To have left them alone

[Karmin]

Hi

I really want Mumsnet advice, I don't know if I was wrong and I am fully prepared for flaming.

I am signed off sick at the moment, due to a mental health episode. I work as an admin for children's social care.

Yesterday I was called into an absence meeting, I took my partner in as due to the medication I am on I wanted to make sure that anything important would be remembered. I left the car at 13:58 and we returned at 14:12.

The car was parked in the building carpark outside under the tree, windows left open, they were close to the building where my old team members were. DS2 and 3 were in the car and the dog. The Dog was secured behind a dog guard. DS2 is 10 years old, DS3 is 2. DS2 adores DS3 and I was happy that should DS3 become upset DS2 would have immediately brought him in and come to us as he has been into my work before.

A social worker came to the window during the 10ish minute period and asked him who he was, a social care referral has now been made, my partner was called by my manager this morning to let him know in advance.

I am swinging between tears and anger. I know there is no legal limit to leave a child alone, I thought I had left them in a safe manner, I knew it was going to be a short how are you doing meeting. They were in a car park off the road next to a safe building, where all adults are checked and safe. I thought I had taken every precaution, the dog was secured away from them, so even if he had a random never before seen aggression he couldn't get to them. (He is a puggle)

Was I wrong?

I wouldn't in those circumstances. You didn't know how long you'd be and it's a lot for a 10 yo.

But, I'm also always at mnetters who take their dc to pay for petrol. I mean, our Petrol stations here state that no under 16s are allowed on the forecourt. I've also never seen anyone walk a dc from their car to pay for petrol. We only got pay at pump in the last 6 years so I had a year of a toddler and 2 newborn babies. How on earth do these parents manage to get fuel and safely get dc to the shop? I can't imagine getting the double buggy out, all 3 dc out of the car, pay and then get them all and the buggy back into the car. If I saw this in rl I'd think they were bonkers!

Karmin this isn't your sole decision, your DH is jointly if not more responsible

Op says her husband was to return after 15 minutes. Yes a swarm of ladybirds could have appeared but it's more likely they'd have been in sn accident on the way to or from the office so it's not unreasonable to minimise such a risk.

What if sonething happened? You couold have got trapped in an elevator or just passed out. It's unlikely that anything other than what you expected to happen would have happened but you cant be 100% sure. You unnecessarily risked your childrens safety.

I think anything over than 5 mins tops and any situation where you cant see the car is not really acceptable. I will park in my small Co-op car park and dash in for milk/yogurts etc but am never gone more than 5 mins, can see the car and hear if alarm goes off.

I probably wouldn't have done this but not because I think there is any real risk, but because I would be worried about being judged for doing it.
Any risk would be tiny I would have thought- I imagine playing on a trampoline is riskier.
What I also wanted to say is that my DM and DAunt, I have been told, back in the 1950's were left at a young age (say 8 and 10) to get their younger DB up and to school each morning and to give him his breakfast, wash up and dust! (DGrandmother was a postlady).
School was well aware as were neighbours and everyone thought all was fine. How times have changed.
I hope everything works out for you OP. It hardly sounds like the crime of the century.

Op says her husband was to return after 15 minutes.

She didn't say that at all...

I took my partner in as due to the medication I am on I wanted to make sure that anything important would be remembered. I left the car at 13:58 and we returned at 14:12.

Whether or not it was in front of social workers isn't relevant, is it? We shouldn't behave differently in front of social workers, because that suggests we know we are wrong if we are behaving differently.

Personally, I wouldn't have done this, but I don't think it, in and of itself, placed your children at serious risk. More just sub-optimal judgement.

I'm really surprised that your partner agreed to this.

Perhaps it's that both thought it OK that it has been flagged?

Presumably there is nowhere within the workplace that they could have sat & the dog left at home?

It’s a “no” from me. Sadly, in the age we live in, it was not safe at all. Also, heat can suddenly take hold; especially on young children and animals (despite parking under a tree). Op, you made a poor decision. Acknowledge this at the meeting and move on. I do hope you start to feel better soon

I'm sorry you're going through this & other issues, hindsight is useful and I'm glad that you've realised that it was the wrong decision to make. Please,seek help for yiur mental health issues as it is affecting your ability to make adequate risk assessments.

So, now we have taken temperature out of the situation, and have the full information that the car was all of 12 steps from the building, and not miles away at the other end of an enormous car park, do we still all feel this situation requires an actual referral for the input of social workers who are no doubt busy with actual child abuse cases, or could it have been better dealt with by someone from the social work team in the building speaking to OP at the time and dealing with it then and there?

Personally I’d have spoken to the OP, fetched her husband/partner out of the meeting to watch the kids, at the time and recorded it as advice given and no further action needed. I strongly feel that a referral is overkill, and due to anxiety about doing the wrong thing on the part of the referrer, (not their fault it’s the culture of fear we work in) Meanwhile if it was so dangerous how come the social worker didn’t actually stay and look after the kids? Whatever happened to doing the right thing instead of doing th damn paperwork?

For future meetings I’d suggest you use your mobile phone voice memo feature to record the meeting and leave your partner to look after your children.

The social worker couldn’t have known they were being left for such a short period of time, and was just doing their job. I also highlight that neither could you - Imagine if the meeting had run on for 45 mins or so.
It’s a tough situation though - hope things get better for you

The social worker had a duty of care to follow this up imho.

You say in OP “ a social care referral has now been made, my partner was called by my manager this morning to let him know in advance.”

I’m a bit confused about the chain of events, do you mean nobody spoke to you at the time? You just got a call today?

I feel this is completely unacceptable. It's too hot for one thing!

Hope you get everything sorted OP.

No I would not have done that. Leaving dogs and children in locked cars are a definite no no. They can become overheated, dehydrated and a 10 year old is not responsible enough to watch a toddler and dog. You did not know how long the meeting would go on either so definitely not reasonable to do this. You should have asked for a colleague to go into the meeting with you and your partner stay with them or taken them all in with you and left them in reception with someone keeping an eye on them.

@m0therofdragons I took my three year old to pay for petrol with me this morning! Mainly because if I leave her she sets the alarm off and I never know if it's one or two clicks to make sure it's off...but I wouldn't get three out of the car!

Notevilstepmother will you give over being so bloody logical/sensible and practical? How the hell are we meant to have a bunfight - and the super-parents meant to show their superior parenting skills with advice like that !!