To think a lot of people are jealous of teachers' holidays but...

[Pengggwn]

...too bitter about it to admit that they wouldn't be teachers themselves?

Just that really.

I have seen so many comments and threads aimed at dissecting teachers' pay and conditions to a forensic level, people complaining that teachers are available over the summer to answer their queries, people arguing that teachers should be working anyway or claim to be working even when they're not (I'm not, at least not for the next month).

And yet, we are in the middle of a teacher recruitment and retention crisis. We can't recruit and keep well-qualified teachers.

Where are all the volunteers??

WeightedCompanionCube

Sorry to hear that. It can be particularly difficult after a break, can't it?

I imagine that if night school was an option for teacher training then the teacher shortage would be solved.

Perhaps. Sadly, you do need to have some experience working and then teaching in a school before you can be considered a trained teacher. Night school isn't the easiest for that.

You can earn more than an NQT while training to be a teacher in some subjects.

”I maintain that criticism of teachers far, far outweighs that of people in any other public service role.”

On here? Maybe. In the great World Wide Web and the media, nope.

It’s exactly the same issue with nursing. Now you need a degree in nursing so it just makes it impossible for career changers especially when you consider that now half young adults have degrees already. Government policy gone wrong. There are enough people out there to fill the vacancies the problem is that adult education is now inaccessible to many.

SunnySkiesSleepsintheMorning

Well, it's here that we're talking, isn't it?

Why do you think it's like this in England? I mean people on other countries also went to school, have kids etc.

I can only compare England to my own education system, and I'm comparing it based on observations here and from people I know who went there to work.

I think that as a system it is far more obsessed with ticking boxes, assessment, sudden curriculum changes and paperwork for the sake of it. The workload is far more intense and I dont think the heavier workload = better education. Imo the profession in Ireland is less so (though we may be heading that direction, which I won't tolerate). Parents are much the same the world over, to what degree you allow awkward ones interfere varies.

Mind you I would put the US at the bottom of the heap, judging by some American teachers I know having to crowdfund for their classrooms at the moment. Land of the free, but apparently not land of providing tables, chairs and whiteboard markers to their schools.

And as an outsider I have to admit I think schools paying teachers wages from their own budgets is completely fucked up. I've seen a lot of talk about people not getting pay rises or schools forcing out more experienced (and expensive) teachers in order to hire some cheap NQTs. Thankfully I'm not in that.

That's not to say that Ireland doesn't have issues in our system, of course we do, but I feel very fortunate to not work in England.

I don't envy teachers at all. My parents suggested I do teaching and I have no idea why. Id be a terrible teacher. Don't have the patience.

There are other difficult jobs out there though, like nursing. The police don't have it easy either. And many jobs do require you to work longer hours, although a lot of them do pay over time.

The thing I hate the most is parents whining about having to spend time with their kids, why can't they go back to school etc. You chose to have them, if you didn't want kids, use contraception. Looking after your kids is your job as a parent it's not the teachers job.

Of course teachers have a tough job. But as a nurse where the consequences of making mistakes are higher, the hours generally more unsociable, the starting salary poorer and the hours away from the workplace per year less than half what teachers get (and our hospitals and clinics don't shut when it snows!) its somewhat galling to see all the fb gloating.

cptartapp

I think the treatment of nurses in this country is disgraceful. That doesn't mean I don't think people bitching about teachers shouldn't put their money where their mouth is.

There are other jobs that offer term time working if you don't fancy being a teacher!

People do moan about teacher holidays. After 21 years of it, I now let it wash over me.

I don't think that all teachers claim their job is more stressful than others. DH is a management consultant and he works about the same kind of hours as me, and has a similar amount of stress. He also has to travel. However, his take on it is that my stress and workload are compressed into finite time periods, whereas his is constant and therefore feels more manageable. He also earns a hell of a lot more than me and gets annual bonuses. His holidays can be taken when he feels like it, and if he's ill, he just lets someone know and his work is rescheduled for another time.

It's swings and roundabouts and I can't get upset about it. I used to, when I was first working and friends who were earning way more than me in graduate jobs would tell me how "lucky" I was.

I love my job. Mind you, I'm no longer in mainstream schools.

I love my job. Mind you, I'm no longer in mainstream schools.

eviltwins that's my sentiment, too.

Teaching is a crappy job, even if you love kids. I taught in secondary and primary, loved the actual teaching but dealing with all the hoops, inspections, tests, parents, staff room politics, and having to work with useless teachers who clearly hated children I’m so glad I don’t have to work in a school any more. Now I teach one to one for a fraction of the pay, no sick leave and unpaid holidays. You have my full respect.

Teachers don't get paid holiday. We get a portion of time off in lieu of overtime but nowhere near what we actually do.. most professional jobs don't get overtime anyhow.

Thelastnigel exactly.

I think my problem is that whether it is on here or out socially I hear teachers moan and moan. Not nurses, not social workers.

@LatteAndLettuce there don't tend to be threads started on nurse or social work let holidays though

@LatteAndLettuce come off it. Everybody moans about their job - not just teachers. And I can confidently say I have NEVER read on MN any teacher say they have the most stressful, long hours, difficult (delete as appropriate) job of all. Never. If you can find one, then I will be prepared to stand corrected.
I'm a teacher of 25 years standing, the very, very best bit is when the classroom door is closed and I'm with the kids (secondary age) I could see the data inputting, constant changes to the curriculum, annoying parents, paperwork, inspections etc etc etc far enough but I'm in it for the kids and any difference I can make to their (sometimes very sad or challenging) lives. And the seven week summer holiday is absolutely fucking fab, one of the only perks of my job.

..and some teachers work most of the summer holiday in things like holiday camps etc - we had to do that to have enough money for the family and as I was working all summer anyway it made sense he worked too.

Some people do move into teaching in later like Lucy Kellaway ex Financial Times journalist has done that with her Now teach programme. nowteach.org.uk/

I’m not jealous of teachers’ holidays because I don’t want to be a teacher.

What does irritate me is the way so many teachers constantly whinge, whine and complain about how tough their job is. I’m sure it is demanding, but so are many, many other jobs which don’t get 13 weeks off a year to make up for it!

Stop moaning, teachers. If your job is really that intolerable, leave. You won’t, though, will you? Because you really don’t want to work an extra two whole months every year like the rest of us....

LatteAndLettuce

I think my problem is that whether it is on here or out socially I hear teachers moan and moan. Not nurses, not social workers.

I hear plenty of nurses and social workers moan. I also hear doctors, plumbers, carpenters etc. moan.

what is it that is often said on here?

"Its not just teachers"

BonnieF
Stop moaning, teachers. If your job is really that intolerable, leave. You won’t, though, will you? Because you really don’t want to work an extra two whole months every year like the rest of us....

How about you stop saying that "teachers constantly whinge, whine and complain about how tough their job is" because frankly its bull.

If your job is really that intolerable, leave. You won’t, though, will you?

More than one in ten secondary teachers left teaching last year. A quarter of new teachers don’t last 3 years in the job. The government has consistently failed to meet its recruitment targets for years and is throwing increasing amounts of money at the problem - £26-28k to train to be a physics teacher, or even geography.

The country really can’t afford for even more teachers to quit teaching.

I love the holidays. I get 19 weeks. I can lead a double life of being WOHM and SAHM.

@BonnieF fuck off with your goady shite eh? Everybody moans about heir job at some point, if they say they don't, they're a liar.

"I’m not jealous of teachers’ holidays because I don’t want to be a teacher.

What does irritate me is the way so many teachers constantly whinge, whine and complain about how tough their job is. I’m sure it is demanding, but so are many, many other jobs which don’t get 13 weeks off a year to make up for it!

Stop moaning, teachers. If your job is really that intolerable, leave. You won’t, though, will you? Because you really don’t want to work an extra two whole months every year like the rest of us...."