to think that Vegans shouldnt own pets?

[Tryagaintomorrow]

we've just had the discussion at work and have concluded that if the animal is stray/rescued/injured/unwanted etc and would be killed without an owner then this is OK, however if the animal has been bred to sell then that is not OK as it goes against vegan beliefs of not using animals for commercial gain.
Of course there is the argument that no one should buy a pet whilst there are so many to be rehomed, but that's a different story.
Thoughts, have we missed something?

I am a vegan. I have a dog. He is a rescue and I wouldn't ever have an animal that wasn't rescued. I also raw feed him because that is what is best for him.

Why is it that vegans/vegetarians are held to such high moral standards? I'm not perfect, i'm doing my best. I made a decision not to eat animals, or any animal product and that's what I do. I made a decision to get a rescue dog. Nobody is perfect, nobody can live ethically in every single area of their life - it isn't possible. Why are we expected to justify ourselves? It's like the "carrots have feelings too" argument that we are expected to listen to. If you (generic you) are happy eating animals, carry on. Don't invent ridiculous standards that those of us who don't eat them are expected to live up to.

My ex friend killed her cat forcing it on a vegan diet because she thought because humans good survive of a vegan diet animals could (despite me telling her numerous times humans are omnivorousness meaning we can eat vegetable fruits and meat cats are obligate carnivores meaning they MUST have meat and cannot survive on vegetables, grain or fruit.

She thought i was being stupid and all the animal dietary links i sent her were simply meat industry propaganda, she thought i was a monster to tell she killed her own cat by starving it to death because of her vegan beliefs and thought it was not on i told all our mutual friends and made her look bad.

She has a bloody master's degree and still thought this.

Unless you are a vegan, why on earth do you give a fuck? Unless it is to do what idiots do when they argue with vegetarians and vegans and do their best to 'get one over' on them in a very twattish manner

^^ agree with you 100% starcrossedseahorse. I was trying to say similar but not quite as well as you did!

Vegans already consume more ethically than meat-eaters or vegetarians by not consuming animal products.

notlivestock Is it any wonder vegans are "held to a higher standard" when people make sweeping assumptions like that? When you piously assume that somehow eating imported foods (soya, quinoa, lentils, avocados, pineapples etc etc ad nauseum - very little is home grown) from all over the world is somehow better than fresh lamb from a local farm - these things contribute to unnecessary freight miles as well as adverse environmental impact from ground clearance to impoverishing local communities.

It is now widely accepted that western imports of vast amounts of quinoa and avocados has pushed up the price so much that natives can no longer afford to eat their own food.

Not quite as ethical as you'd imagine.

Thymelord (fab user name btw) thank you for a balanced approach - you do your thing, I'll do mine; we don't need to try and convince each other to change our ways. If only everyone gave up preaching and setting impossible standards for those who are "different" to them...

strictly speaking humans cannot survive on a vegan diet. we need b12 which comes from supplementation, fortification or animal defecation.

source - the vegan society.

I have lots of pets, dogs and guinea pigs. I'm Vegan and they are all rescues. But I think people should rescue animals in need regardless.

Thymelord

Why is it that vegans/vegetarians are held to such high moral standards?

I think it is because most people do know deep down they shouldn’t be eating animal products but they convince themselves there’s no other option because that’s the only justification. Seeing people leading healthy, happy lives without animal products therefore gives them the rage and they HAVE to find ways to pick that lifestyle apart in order to justify their own.

Btw before people accuse me of goadery/being a preachy vegan - I am NOT a vegan, nor even a vegetarian! But I recognise that as a failing of mine, not a failing of those who do have the willpower to stick to their principles on this matter.

He also eats a vegan diet, because he is a rabbit.

You've obviously never left a Peking duck pancake roll unattended

I don't consider myself vegan because I have non-vegan clothes and makeup, and sometimes cave and have stuff with milk in, but I try and eat a vegan diet. I have a cat that we got for free from a friend (who really should have had her cat spayed a long time ago, poor thing) when he was a kitten. I feed him cat food which supports the animal industry but he would starve otherwise as he's incredibly fussy and hates the outdoors. It's a grey area. The film Carnage touches upon it in quite a funny way. I wouldn't buy from a breeder simply because it seems silly to pay a fortune for an animal, rather than because I'm categorically against animals for commercial gain (though I guess I am, haven't much thought about it). Veganism for most is about animal welfare and, excluding puppy farms and back yard breeders, there's not much that conflicts that in breeding pedigree animals.

Meat industry, not animal industry

Sort of off topic, but it's funny how much things can change...

Rewind a decade or so, and I was a meat lover extraordinaire. I loved it all. Roast lamb, crispy bacon, bbq, you name it!

I've been a vegan for over three years now (was vegetarian prior for several years), and I can honestly say the thought of eating meat now makes me feel physically ill.

I don't judge those who eat meat, just for me personally I actually feel the same level of revulsion eating meat as I imagine meat eaters would feel about eating human flesh. It's that revolting to me. Yet I used to down it with gusto.

So for a PP saying you don't have the discipline, I think it's just because you haven't reached that kind of level. Once you do, it's easy because it has become revolting.

For me, it happened because of watching various documentaries on the food industry, including Joaquin Phoenix's Earthlings. As an animal lover, it was so traumatizing that it all just clicked for me, and I could never go back to eating meat.

I'm not perfect, but this is my personal line in the sand.

There is a joke "how do you know someone's a vegan? They'll tell you", which for me personally is all wrong. I actually loathe telling people because it tends to get awkward real fast. I just like to live my life, and let others live theirs.

I don't see why not, as long as they don't feed vegan food to carnivores like cats and dogs, whose digestive system is different from omnivores like us.

That is beyond stupid.

DD and I are vegetarian on very limited dairy (mainly soya milk)

We keep guinea-pigs - they are the most vegan animals going (apart from their insistance that they wear real fur )

They are caged (huge cages) for their own protection , stops them being somethings dinner.

And yes, all Rescues .

Hope your piggies are inside 70. It is way too hot for them at the moment.

I try very hard to be as vegan as possible but admit I don't always succeed, and we have a cat. She was in a rescue centre and had been treated appallingly. So badly that her temperament meant she was returned there twice. She' s still a pain in the arse but we love her and hopefully she will be happy one day!

The fancy cross bred dogs that some of my acquaintances have jumped on the bandwagon to buy for £1000's, irritate the shit out of me. There are plenty of dogs who are 'good with children (main excuse for getting a labradoodleycockerpooed, or whatever they are called). Its just to keep up with the neighbours as far as I can see. Meanwhile, healthy lovely animals who need a home are being sidelined.

I firmly believe it's up to the person to live as they see fit; as long as it doesn't harm others. If you choose to live as vegan I have zero problems with it, and it's up to them to decide if they want pets or not. Why do you care?

Similar with religious people - it's up to the person to decide what version of religion they follow, and if they're eg Christian but don't do everything you're "supposed" to do as a Christian surely that only matters to themselves?

star my pigs have a lovely shed in shade for their hutches , its one of the shadiest bits of the garden. At the moment they're lounging in their rabbits runs in shade , its quire breezy here (they are Well Spoiled )

I am vegan and I have pets. I have no conflict about this. My pets are treated well and fed appropriately (which includes meat). The rest of my family are not vegan and it really isn’t an issue!

I am vegan and would never buy a pet (although I’ve never related that to being vegan, I just don’t see why you’d buy a pet when there are so many that needs homes already). I have a friend who has been vegan for YEARS and bought a miniature sausage dog about 5 years ago and I was really quite annoyed about it - I know it’s none of my business but when I asked her about it she just said “oh they never have daschund puppies in shelters.” Well yeah, obviously not. But why do you need a sausage dog?

Urgh I could go on about this topic all day long but I basically agree with you. IMO, if you love dogs you love all dogs, buying particular breeds because you think they’re “cuter” or whenever means you’re funding some of the horrific health problems that a lot of them have (frenchies, bulldogs etc especially) and it’s completely unnecessary. Vegan or not, it can be a horrible industry and thousands of dogs die every year because of people wanting designer dogs. Fills me with rage!

@usernamealreadytaken

Why are you assuming that all vegans eat imported soya and all meat eaters eat nothing but local and organic? That's clearly bullshit. The truth is the vast majority of all people, vegan or no, are eating imported foods, foods connected with the destruction of the rainforest, food containing palm oil etc. But on balance, veganism is a more ethical choice because at least in addition to the issues above they aren't also contributing to the horrific environmental impact of the meat industry.

More rainforest is cleared to make room for the production of grain for beef cattle than for any other purpose. The beef industry is also a major source of greenhouse gases, and uses astronomical amounts of water. Imported avocados have their own carbon footprint to deal with but it's just not in the same order of magnitude.

Of course it is possible for meat eaters to make ethical choices - you can eat meat exclusively from your local farm down the road and only consume seasonal, local produce etc etc. But this is not common - and any meat consumption contributes to one of the most environmentally destructive industries there is.

And I say this as someone who is only vegetarian, not vegan! I absolutely recognise the ethical failings in my own diet. Because nobody is perfect, and everyone is making the compromises they have to make to get by. And that is fine.

But what is not fine is this attitude that vegans have to be absolutely perfect and make no compromises and fulfil other people's expectations or be branded hypocrites! It's absurd and unfair, and most of the time it comes from meat eaters who feel defensive about their own choices.

DO you actually know any vegans who have bought pets from the trade? I know a lot, and they would be horrified at the thought of 'buying' another living being. Many of them do have rescue pets though.

specialsubject

You can get B12 from algae (many commercially available dried seaweeds). Perfectly possibe as a vegan

Depends why they are vegans, but none of my business really.

As long as they don't try and feed their pets on a vegan diet, I don't have a problem.