To NOT accept feeling like a breeding sow?!

[Notlivestock]

I have had a really terrible afternoon with my mother - unusual for us because we generally get on well (though this is largely because I spend my life being a peacemaker).

DM asked me if my DH and I are planning to ttc soon. She is desperate for grandchildren, and loves nothing more than to talk to me about what it will be like when I one day have kids. I told her we have no immediate plans, which is true. I explained that we aren't in the financial position we would want to be, that I want to progress further in my career first, that we have a big holiday next year I wouldn't want to be pregnant for, that I love my life as it currently is and I'm not ready to change just yet. Reminded her that I'm not yet 30 so it's not like I'm running out of time.

She absolutely flipped out. She said 'it's never going to happen, is it?'. I asked her if that would be the worst thing ever and she said 'yes - it's the worst thing you could do to me.'

She then said DH and I keep on booking holidays (we don't - next year will be our first proper holiday in 3 years) which shows we aren't interested. I said this is the time we should be having holidays, when we are young enough to enjoy them. She burst into tears and said 'that's how I feel - that I should get to be a grandparent while I'm still young enough to enjoy it.' (She's 55 btw...).

She said 'it's up to you but if you make a selfish decision you'll be depriving your father and I of the one thing that would make us happiest.'

I honestly don't think I've ever felt worse. It's like she's disregarded all my autonomy and my goals and ambitions etc because she doesn't see any of that as important compared to my main purpose - providing her with grandchildren. It's like I'm livestock she wants to breed.

I don't even really know what my AIBU is, but where do I go from here? This is the worst it's ever been but she talks about my future children constantly. She asks when I'm planning to try constantly. She has another grandchild on the bloody way from my sibling but it hasn't changed anything. How do I escape this? It feels like a nightmare.

She’s probably imagining all kinds of bonding scenarios.
She’ll got to your scans,
Be your birthing partner,
Name the baby....
I feel sorry for you op.

I would write to her. Otherwise she might respond with the tears and not hear you.

You need to sort this out now otherwise she'll be demanding all sorts when you do decide you're ready . "When we have DC is between me and Bob, it's not for you to tell us what's convenient for you."

She's only 55? Ffs! I'm early 50s and have a dd in Y6.
She needs to grow up. Ridiculous attitude.

She could be jealous of dil’s Mum ‘getting there first’ or being more involved.

Steely gaze - ‘I would not tell anyone if we were ttc and I never will if you ask me once more’.

Does she use the internet? Send her a link to this page while asking what does she think about this.

She's completely out of order and being totally selfish. And extremely naive too. What if you were to struggle along the way, how would she react?

I am an only child at TTC in my mid 30s after two early losses. My parents are 64 and 70 and have been nothing but kind and patient and hopeful that they will still have grandchilden. I really hate to see people being badgered into having babies because nobody takes a second to think about the reasons it hasn't happened yet. Whatever, the reason, it is valid and non-negotiable. Your mother is being totally irrational and I hope you can find a way to show her this so she realises she is the problem.

She’s probably imagining all kinds of bonding scenarios.
She’ll got to your scans,
Be your birthing partner,
Name the baby....

^^ This. She sounds hugely over-invested, and quite honestly it wouldn't surprise me if she's viewing it as her opportunity to play "Mummy" again. I'd bet my shiny pound on her kitting out a room in the house as a nursery and stamping her feet about having "alone time" with the baby overnight before they've even cut the cord.

You need to tell her that her behaviour is driving you away. You have no obligation to have a child just to make her happy and that if she doesn't back off and learn some boundaries then you will stop seeing her.

Be firm and if she turns on the tears then point out that this is exactly the reason why you don't want to even think about having a child yet - because you've already got someone who behaves like a tantrumming toddler in your life.

Look, it really isn’t that hard. You say (or write) very calmly, ‘I don’t appreciate what you said and I won’t stand for you speaking to me like that again. I will have children when I see fit and if I don’t have children it is up to me and my partner. This scenario has nothing to do with you. I don’t want to hear about the subject from you again.’

If she persists or behaves badly, you stop answering the phone and meeting up.

To be honest, this is exactly the kind of grandparent you wouldn’t want your children to be around.

I had this from my mom. From the age of 16 she told me it wouldn't be a bad thing for me to get pregnant as she would help me raise it. When I had DD at 26, I realised she thought she was going to be involved on a daily basis, babysitting and coming round all the time to help. She thought she would be coming to the hospital when I was in labour, which I didn't allow. DDs nearly 1 now, she sees her every couple of weeks and that's it. I've never left DD with her as I know it's all about control with her, she told me I would be raising DD exactly as she raised me.

She seemed to have some weird idea that because her daughter was having a child, she would be so involved that it would be like a chance for her to parent all over again. She doesn't have the same expectations if my brother were to have a child. It's really strange.

I would tell her you never plan to have children and you don't owe her any.

Tell her to get some cruises book, plan some world travel, take up a hobby ....she needs to stop breathing down your neck for her whole 'raison d'etre' ....she needs to get a bloody life!
I would also tell her that the subject is now strictly off limits completely...should she persist or have outbursts then this will cause very serious harm to your relationship, and that would be a great shame.
Tell her you want to enjoy these years and it's your life not hers. Tell her the more she pushes this subject, the further away she will push you.
She sounds very childish and impulsive!

Oh dear she sounds hard work OP.

Some excellent suggestions on here. I hope you don't live too close to her, as if grandchildren do arrive, you may find you have more problems with constant impromptu visits.

She sounds insane! She’s fairly young doesn’t she have a social life or work?

I have GC and mind them 2 days a week but that’s more than enough as I have a busy life. What else does she do? Could she do charity work? Sounds like she is old before her time.

You need to be very firm op. Your life is yours not hers. Selfish woman. Ignore tears etc that manipulative crap.

I would stop the convo immediately and leave. She will get the message

She’s dreaming of being mummy again. You can’t do that with sons children because, in her head, she’s the “other” grandma to their child.

It’s russian doll syndrome. My mum has it.

She cut cords, attended scans, influenced names, accidentally calls herself mum!!!

It’s a nightmare, put your foot down now.

I adore my kids but you enjoy holidays now whilst you can. You can’t ever go back but you do need to have something to look back on when you’re knackered and covered in milk and nappies!

I would honestly tell her every time she mentions it you’re adding a week onto the time you tell her you’re pregnant. Or adding one more person you tell before her!

diddimus - did this approach work for you? Because generally, if you present peope with ultimatums in this sort of scenario, you are going to get more problems, not less.

In the kind of relationship I was referring to before, the DIL having a child can been seen as almost irrelevant; mostly because they know they are unlikely to be able to control the situation, and have to play to the the DIL’s tune. They will not “count” because they are not drawn into the game.

Your brother probably has a much easier relationship because he has not needed to play the game. By doing his own thing, and being oblivious to her expectations, she then has to go along with him, to get any time with him. Do you think, if he started telling her she was out of order, she would behave the same way she does with you? You don’t have to answer, almost rhetorical...

My DB does not even realise there is a problem, and I would say is very entitled. If he does not want to do something with DM, he won’t. This is of course always the DIL’s fault. Always.

Anyway, I’m glad that’s not what you’re dealing with!

Good luck with the enjoying your life just the way it is; sounds bloody lovely!

wow my parents were a bit like that and i actually told them "so i don't matter now? great thing to know your role in life was to have children"
I was 38 when i had my first

honestly i just do contact on my terms, don't do skypes if they piss me off - we are in different countries - and that is their fault for always making me feel second best to my sibling all my life and then suddenly when I marry and have children I'm flavour of the month/year... fuck that...

None of her bloody business when you decide to have children , is she normally this controlling ? That’s the beauty of being an adult you make your own decisions .

It’s so wierd! What’s this obsession with grandchildren. I mean I adore my 2 but I have had my kids. I don’t want to parent again.i if any of my kids don’t have kids so be it. Their choice.

My sil is like this with her GC always has them and calls them
‘Her boys! But she has no other life. No social life for herself etc. It’s sad really.

My observation is that there are a lot of women out there who feel entitled to take out resentment at their own lot in life, perhaps at societal or familial restrictions they experienced, on their daughters. For whom a daughter is a legitimate source of power and control

Standing ovation to this.

Your mother is behaving appallingly. What a cow. Sorry, but she is. She doesn’t give a shit about you, her daughter, as your own person. She just sees you as a vessel for grandchildren. How utterly disgusting.

If I can engineer that in such a way that it doesn't trigger her defensive response it might be an ideal solution!

This needs to not be your metric for success OP as it’s out of your hands how she responds. Do you see how you’re still dancing to her tune? Focused on her and what she thinks and feels? Get past that. Your goal should be that you no longer listen to any grandchildren talk longer than two sentences. She says the first sentence, you tell her ‘that’s so rude, I don’t want to talk about this thanks’, she carries on and you leave. Every. Single. Time. Her response is immaterial. She’ll soon learn through association that bringing this up is boring for her as you walk away.

If you don’t grow a spine soon and manage this situation it’ll just continue, as I’m sure you’re aware. You’ve had some amazing advice on here so far.

I’m so bloody thankful that even though I’m thirty my father still cares about me as a person and his daughter and celebrates my successes and has only ever once talked about my having children when I was the one to bring it up. I can’t imagine having a parent who was putting pressure on me as if my own reproductive choices are anything but that, MY OWN.

She sounds vile. Get it stopped.

Another option would be to just message her and say ‘look i’d Have preferred to keep this private as it’s personal between my husband and I, but we’re not planning on kids. So stop asking’. It’s technically true. You’re not actively planning them. Let her grieve alone for it if it means she’ll stop wittering on. Then if you do ever have kids, fine. Nice surprise for her. You owe her nothing more.

Having read your update - I would move (a lot) further away and reduce contact, as it may help you get your boundaries clearer.....she is well out of order and seems to have a very strange idea of her role in your life....

living close is always going to be difficult wether you do/do not want /have children - whatever you decide...she will be difficult....have a look at the stately homes thread....

Many posters on this thread have pointed out, quite accurately imo, at narcissistic mothers and russian dolls syndrome. For those who haven't experienced such a mother, it is difficult to comprehend how those of us who have find it difficult to "just tell her to stop". You see, the thing is we have been conditioned since childhood, particularly if we were the scapegoat child, to be hyper attentive to any change of mood and to walk on eggshells as to not trigger an emotional attack. For me, it took several instances of no contact and a move across continents to have some semblance of freedom. And yet as I mentioned about, things still got difficult around the topic of having children, to the point that I was expected to not only hack at my body with endless medical treatments but also be responsible for my mother's sadness about not having my children. Yes, I typed that on purpose. I would have birthed them, but they would be HER children. No wonder I never got pregnant, I'm sure my subconscious mind was like, no, WTF, save yourself!

AtrocityNeedles

Yes agree there’s a lot of truth in that. Nightmare women.

The next time the subject comes up, say "NEVER, EVER! We can't stand children!" Go on about how noisy and smelly and badly behaved children are and about how babies are the worst, screaming and pooing everywhere. Tell her some stories about friends' toddlers drawing on the walls and grinding jam sandwiches into the cream carpets. Then, if and when you decide it's the right time to try, say nothing about it to her at all. When the bump starts growing, just say that that you are thinking of going on a diet. When she comes round and sees the moses basket set up in the living room "oh yes, we're getting a kitten! That's a kitten bed. Isn't it sweet?!" When the baby arrives, introduce it to her as Princess Fluffypaws Tiddleston McFuzzbutt, the purebred persian kitten (Tiddles to her friends ). Get your brother on it too and have everyone cooing over the cute little kitten. When the baby starts crying, get a tin of tuna out of the cupboard and ask if she's hungry. Baby toys are cat toys, you could leave a litter tray strategically placed when your mother comes round, mention how much Tiddles likes catnip, etc.

Sorry, I kind of lost interest in the end. But I thought it maybe useful to remind you just how useful young grandparents are. You will probably find it easier to go back to work etc if she us still young enough to help. Bare that in mind when you reach a point when you are ready. Well done for being so sensible about it despite her behaviour. Nothing more reckless than having children that you can't provide for.