AIBU to not want this SN child in the same class as mine

[PinkyU]

DD is 5 and moving into P2 which will be a composite 3/2 class. I’ve recently found out that a boy with severe challenging and frequently violent behaviour will be in the same class as a P3.

DD also has SN, cognitive, social emotional and physical needs. She is very vulnerable and significantly smaller than this other child. Small knocks and bumps can cause DD significant injuries such as dislocated hip etc. Their will only be 1 teacher and 1 TA in the class which in non negotiable due to staffing.

I’m concerned that not only will this boy take up a lot of teaching time (away from my DD), he is also a substantial physical risk to DD.

AIBU to discuss/request a change of class for this other child as DD cannot be moved to a different class due to her needs?

YANBU if you'd accept other parents demanding your DD being moved from the class were also being reasonable. I doubt you would so you are being unreasonable. It's not all about your child.

In Scotland she should have a CSP (coordinated support plan), it has to be updated annually, and lays out the needs and how they’ll be met. Both children in this case sound as if they ought to have them.

When support in class is working well issues tend, on the whole, to stay confidential.

When support is inadequate within a class it becomes common knowledge among parents very quickly.

I’d speak up if I were you too OP.
Voice your concerns to the teaching staff

Thanks for deleting some posts MNHQ.

You know something tells me we're not going to get productive and solutions-focused discussion from sweet.

At least most of us can debate politely, even if we disagree on things.

Pupil Premium won't come into it I'm afraid, or is highlt highly unlikely.

The school need to ensure the safety of both pupils using the resources they have available. They currently have 1 class teacher and 1 TA. Neither child has allocated 1-1 hours so regardless of how things may have been, no child 'owns' the TA and is more entitled than the other.

The first step should be a meeting with the head seeking clarification on how your child will be kept safe and, if required, a risk assessment for your child. You should clarify how your child's
You cannot expect the TA to function as your child's 1-1 or expect that another child misses support so your child can have 1-1.

You've said about not jumping hoops for an EHCP, you do realise that in secondary there are no class TAs. The only children who get TAs are ones who've got funding and then a few who are SEND and it's helpful but they may get 2 hours support a week. If you opt not to go down the route of EHCP, you could be setting your child up for zero support all through secondary.

Glass,

My own personal experience is rather different, in that every child with high needs - behavioural, educational, physical - has an EHCP, and those with funded hours (of which we have a good number) has a 1;1 TA for those hours - and that usually extends for the whole length of the school day. Children who arrive with high needs but no EHCP are usually 'treated as if they do' while funding comes through.

Therefore, where I work, both the OP's child and the other child would have 1:1 TAs for at least part of the day if their needs are as critical as described AND there would be a class TA for at least the morning in almost all classes - so the conflict between 2 children's differing needs simply wouldn't arise.

So no, this is not the case throughout the education system, but with education budgets continuing to decline in real terms, and special schools disappearing or not growing to meet needs, it is becoming more common.

This genuinely sounds like you could be talking about my son he's is also 5 and going into p2 although he has a full time 1-1 if someone made a request like this against my child id honestly tell them to get fucked , my child has every right to an education just like yours he may have severe SN and challenging behaviour but he can't help it he has neurological problems 😊

cant where do you work and how do I get a job there? 😂

@Glassofredandapackofcrisps "Is our education system really in this much of a mess?"

Sadly yes. In the class I'm in, about a third have SEN of some kind or another. They include Dyslexia, Dyspraxia, Auditory Processing Disorder, Autism, ADHD and ADD. A lot of time is taken up with behaviour (spitting, hitting, table flipping and items being thrown), leaving little time to support those who need educational support.

To understand any child you need to build up a relationship that is trusting. For the SEN children this is, I'd say, the most important part of my job. You cannot begin to understand them until you have this in place.
Many schools just don't have the time or funds for this which is why it doesn't work.
I get headbutted and whacked every now and again (mostly PMLD in my case) but much less since I've learnt to read the students and how they react in various situations. Behaviour is communication in itself for many kids.

Smile,

I can't see it lasting much longer in its current form - no money - but I can't fault the focus on 'meeting each child's needs' and 'reducing the impact very high needs children can have on the rest of a class', even if it does mean we're all running at 100 mph to keep still!

We’re losing staff in September. It’s a nightmare and the most vulnerable will be losing out.

Sounds great, cant

Yeah, purple us too - crucially our pastoral staff have been slashed - staff who absorbed quite a lot of the SEMH work.
I honestly don’t know what September will look like.

"I have also reported Womb post it is shocking disabilities is not the same as NT people violence people with disiblities cannot control these impulses."

OK, so what would you advise if a similar situation was happening at your 25 year old daughter's workplace and she was scared of a coworker with special needs? The idea that this should be treated differently from people with SN obviously stops at some point. What age should that be?

Which is undoubtedly coloured by having to work with two complex children this September, one with very challenging behaviour.

This angle hadn't occurred to me before, but of course if this TA has previously worked mainly with your DD, she might be angling for this [relatively straightforward] situation to continue, via you lobbying for it, rather than have to undertake the more difficult management of another child with SEN and behavioural needs as well. It is a really stressful situation for a TA / teacher to be in, to manage the needs of two children with SEN and the rest of the class, when there is no allocated 1:1, and she herself may be trying to avoid that, using you as 'spokesperson' to hide behind.

It’s so short sighted isn’t it smile? These poor kids will end up goodness knows where because if missing out on that vital support and all the hard working, caring teachers will end up leaving.

I don't understand why anyone would think that the children behaving violently is having their educational needs effectively met. Their school day must be a nightmare of anxiety and stress.

While I understand why you're worried, I feel as many others too. How would you feel if somebody had made the same request about your daughter? Ask the school what they will do in the case of X, Y, Z

Annandale, agreed. Which is whyIi suspect that what will happen within this classroom is that the (class, unallocated 1;1, whatever custom and practice has dictated so far) TA will spend most of their time working with the little boy concerned.

This will meet theOP's desire to keep her child safe BUT will reduce the support that her DD currently gets. However, the only other financially viable alternative for the school may be for the OP's DD to be in a class with only a teacher, and the TA to remain with the boy with SEN - so having them both in the same class may thus be the 'least worst' option.

Which is why the OP should be applying for statutory funding as a matter of urgency, to enshrine in a legally-binding form the support her DD needs.

I don't understand why anyone would think that the children behaving violently is having their educational needs effectively met
Except I don't recall anyone on this thread suggesting violence was ok or that being violent was meeting educational needs.

Regardless of the different views, the central theme through most posts is that the OP absolutely should meet with thr head to discuss her child being safe.

@WombOfOnesOwn We can't compare potential 25 year olds behaviour with potential behaviour of 5 year olds.

Part of childhood in NT children is learning that if you're rough others won't play. You can't compare innocence of developing minds with potential adult behaviour.