to ask how do private schools produce such "confident" kids / adults and how I can do it at home?

[dragontwo]

Ok, I have my reservations about private schools, but I recognise that often they produce kids / adults with high self confidence and self assurance.

I want to know how they do this, how they drill this confidence into them, and how I can replicate any beneficial aspects of this at home into my own kid (state schooled)?

What do they say / do / teach that encourages them to be so confident and expect success?

I know there are down sides to everything but I'm just thinking about good ideas I can help my kid. NB I'm no tiger mother and do my best to encourage my kid as it is already but just looking for ideas and general thoughts on how it's done!!

Just curious!

No, Bramble you are wrong. that isn't what it is.

It's a step up and from there you can start to look down. Just one of the rungs of the class ladder.

Stricter being one of many reasons.

I don't think private school does instill confidence as such.

I think confidence is one of the biggest factors in achieving highly in careers (and life in general). Therefore I would suggest that there is quite possibly a higher concentration of confident personalities within the higher earning brackets.

In general, children at private schools come from families in the higher earning brackets. Therefore its relatively likely that:
-they may well be genetically predisposed to being a confident type
-they have confident parents as role models modelling confident behaviour
-they go to school with other children who are also likely to be more confident due to reasons above.
-confidence is therefore seen as "the norm" within their social circles

So I guess I'm saying that private schools are probably filled with confident children, rather than making children confident.

I do think they encourage and nurture confidence, and of course, opportunities for public speaking/debating/LAMDA/representing schools at sports/drama etc won't hurt - but those (should) happen in all schools in both private and state sectors.

But on the whole, I think the children at private school start confident, rather than are made confident by the school.

I don't think it is the strictness.

dd's state school is very strict, it has to be with such big classes and huge intakes. But its a kind of anonymous strictness. The kids aren't encouraged to question or reason with anyone.

the private school is also strict, but they are more sensible with it. They will listen to pupils point of view. I think it makes children feel that they matter.

People think it is surprising that if a child's family are told by others and the media that they matter, that they have more confidence. And if a poor child's family are told the opposite, they have less confidence.
It actually makes perfect sense. Kids are not stupid, they know if they and their families are seen as important and mattering, or not.
I went to a pretty unique state school for very poor kids where we had lots of opportunities and did lots of activities that only public schools do We all still knew that our families were looked down on by society. We absorbed that message.

Plenty of poor families tell their kids that they matter and plenty of poor families have kids that go on to be successful in life.

I went to private school and am not massively confident - neither am I successful in my career. I'm pretty average really. Lots of my state school friends are very confident, articulate and successful. That came more from their upbringing and genes than the school they went to

This could be me except that I went to a state grammar school. I got very good A levels and a good degree but I've never particularly excelled in any job I've done.

Gretol My parents told me I matter. I am not stupid. I still saw and read about the sneering of people on benefits. I still heard well off mums say work hard or you will end up working as a cashier, sometimes with clear derision - the job my mum did. I knew that other people looked down on my family. We lived in the roughest part of town. I knew even saying where I lived to those who lived in better off areas, would elicit a reaction. Kids are not stupid.

Since they are often selective, they get to choose more able, more confident children from the outset. Perhaps they're actually doing sweet fanny Adams difference to those SAME children at state.
It is impossible to compare as it is never like for like,state schools have to be inclusive.

There are a high number of kids at independent schools with significant anxiety problems, eating disorders or self-harm.

Although some schools are truly inclusive, most will manage out kids who don't fit the mould.

It does work for some kids, but don't be fooled into thinking that it's all good. It would have been horrific for my kids.

There are a high number of kids at independent schools with significant anxiety problems, eating disorders or self-harm

This simply is not true. Of course this exists, but nowhere near the percentage that is often quoted on mumsnet.

I know its an unfashionable fact, but most kids at independent schools are perfectly nice, pleasant, hard working kids who have a lot of opportunity to grow in confidence, because the schools spend a lot of time looking at how to make this happen. This is because they have plenty of money, time and often really good governance and 99% of the pupils parents buy into the ethos of the school and support it fully and want to make it happen.

This isn't to say they are better or worse than a good state school, just very different, because of the huge amount of money invested in them.

FWIW, the pressure put on kids these days with the new GCSES and A levels is ridiculous, that happens just as much in state school if not even more, as state schools only have success in exams to rank them.

I can tell which colleagues were privately educated, often because they seem confident, particularly in meetings, talking to senior people, and presentations.

Think opportunities / training in public speaking and performing or competing (eg music, sport, drama) help. Eg at my state school - and even at university - there were few opportunities. Eg no school drama club, competitive sports, debating society, presentations to the class or school.

At my school there was strong social pressure not to be “a swot”.
Boys who did drama or played a musical instrument were ridiculed, often with homophobic terms.

I went to a private school and I agree with some of the things people have identified. From my experience, it would include:

• as people have said, a lot of opportunities to stand up in front of a class or a school and speak in public. It's expected that you will do this and no getting out of it by claiming you're shy
• very very clear boundaries and very very clear expectations of behaviour. You show teachers and other adults respect at all times, you can't get away with being sulky or being a little shit as much as in the kind of schools where I later taught. This means you're often better at talking to adults than people who've been to schools without this ethos.
• range of opportunities. You might not be academically that strong, but because you all have to play sport and have the chance to do music/drama/art, you're perhaps more likely to find something you're good at, which gives you more confidence. And even those who were academically not that strong at my school were expected to get Bs at GCSE; anything else was not acceptable and teachers would work hard to make sure you did as well as possible
• you're used to being measured against others. We had exams at the end of every term and you'd get both your grades and your place in the class. When you did athletics in PE, your ranking against the other girls/boys was posted publicly. I've never known a state school that did this - I believe it helps build resilience.

Really interesting thread. I was astonished when I started university at how starkly different my privately educated peers were. I decided then and there that I wanted that confidence for my own children.

When you did athletics in PE, your ranking against the other girls/boys was posted publicly. I've never known a state school that did this - I believe it helps build resilience.

Damn right it wouldn't happen in state schools, image the parents coming in with all sorts of complaints/reasons their little snowflakes were at the bottom - State schools/some parents don't prioritise soft skills like resilience, aspiration, respect, trying your best etc etc

Someone always comes last but like our primary school - everyone was a winner. At sports day they didn't pay any attention to who came first as everyone got a certificate anyway.

I didn’t notice it much until I got a graduate job. University was mainly study / exam based with virtually no requirements for public speaking or team working.

When I started assessment centres and then graduate level work I realised I had few skills in key areas like meetings participation, verbal information giving and persuasion, and public speaking (even to small groups of colleagues).

I was thinking about this the other day.
When I was at private school, in year 6 we had to 'give a lesson' and in Year 7 we had to 'give a talk'. Prior to that we had to learn poems and stand up and recite them to the class... at the time it didn't seem a big deal but yes I think it did give us confidence.

When you did athletics in PE, your ranking against the other girls/boys was posted publicly. I've never known a state school that did this - I believe it helps build resilience.

They did this in the state and private school I went to.

Well, in the state school they only posted the top 50 (?) of each year. But we were about 60-70ish pupils a year (20ish people a class) so people still knew who scored too low to even be put on the ranking....

I often did, btw. It doesn't seem to have had a particularly negative impact on my self-confidence btw...

Personally I think confidence comes from exploring opportunities and private schools offer far more opportunities so generally produce more confident kids. There are however those kids who will not be confident as they see opportunities as problems and that I think is a key difference. DB (dear brother - did I get that right - first time poster) is Mensa, private school educated and failure at life. I, state schools but do very well. My DC all private school educated and all very confident; DB's kids all private school educated and two are outstandingly confident one is like his dad - no confidence and no drive.

also, what was a massive confidence giver was being spoken to by teachers in a normal way, not like we were scum. When I moved onto state school, tbh I was shocked at the way teachers spoke to us.

I think private school helps the "invisible middle" kids the most. The very natural confident and able will be chosen for the school play at a big state school etc because they are easy to choose and will perform with little help/support. Our local state primary is 3 form entry and the year 6 production had 5 main speaking parts. There were lots of grumbles about it having been the same 5 or so kids since reception that got all the speaking parts. Encouraging a shy child without any obvious talent takes time and resource. They need little things that they can win at to build them up.

State schools, in the most general of sweeping statements, seem to serve the bottom cohort including those with quite severe SEN and those at the top quite well. It's the ones in the middle who don't have any behaviour problems but who aren't really reaching their potential that seem overlooked because at the end of the day there are only so many resources in a state school. The lack of SATS and Ofsted in private schools can't really be underestimated in regards to how much resource this alone frees up.

Each of my kids has had an opportunity they never would have had in a state school that has moved them well ahead in their lives. DD was told she had a gift for visualizing and needed to work in movies as director or screen writer, she is now studying and interning at both at Uni. DS got into polo playing and received a scholarship to study at Uni by playing (not water polo).

I am just starting work in a private school and what surprised me the most was the level of respect the teachers had for the pupils. Each child was greeted personally at morning and afternoon registration and every teacher who walked past a child in the corridor had a genuine interest in the children.

My dc school is not like this they are greeted on mass ie good morning class ... and then this is followed by a rapid register before trying to cram in everything that needs to be done. The teachers are always racing from one thing to another and every appointment I have with them I am well aware of their need to race through to their next appointment. My dc attend what is considered to be a good state school too.