To think Scotland has a better future than England

[hadenough]

The state of the UK today makes me utterly depressed. A Brexit voted for on the basis of lies, an anti-immigrant rhetoric, and a general attitude of unwelcome.

But yet, in Scotland, the message is very different - a focus on welcoming people to the country, an opposition to Brexit, and a real debate about the future.

It genuinely saddens me to be part of a wider country that appears intent on going back, but never forward.

Gaelic is countrywide down to the border.
Wind farms could be off shore but no lets cover southern Scotland, they only last 25 years but every wind turbine has a wide track snaking round the hills to reach it. They don't drop from the skies.

Fflamingo

I agree.

My OH is English- I am Scottish, we live in Scotland.

He is ( or was ) very pro UK. Voted no in indie ref 1.
He is however pro Europe.
If - when rather- there is A Scottish indie ref 2 he will be voting to leave UK.
Scotland will fare better within Europe than a small minded Britian.

They have midgies though

Higher ed is on it's knees due to woeful inadequacies in funding. Scotland's NHS uses private facilities for operations etc (ie privatisation by the back door). Free prescriptions for all are a huge waste of money. And thanks to Nicola banging on about independence, we now have a tory MP. Go Nicola.

Apart from to the English eh? Scots hate them.

No, only people with a shit attitude such as yourself fuel that idea. I was wondering how long it would take this thread to generate into a slanging match.

I’m also extremely uncomfortable about how Britain is being seen by the rest of the world. Given the seriously unstable political climate at the moment, with division, racism, xenophobia and the threat of war all at the forefront, I do not want to be part of it.

The Tories have trashed the UKs reputation worldwide, and are doing nothing to remedy that. All this talk of “hostile environment” and TR fans marching on Whitehall with their Nazi salutes, Windrush, Grenfell, making a back alley deal with the DUP. Make no mistake, all of us are being judged.

The current PM sees no issue at selling out to make a deal with terrorist sympathisers, who hold views that would have been seen as archaic 100 years ago, because she needs them to prop up her government.

But it’s Nicola who is wrong? Uh huh.

The DUP have wangled a deal which disproportionately benefits NI, which nobody seems to be getting wound up about in amongst all this ire about England paying for Scotland (not true), and nobody ever mentions Wales! In fact, on here, the majority of people didn’t seem to know who the DUP were when they were first mentioned! All you have to do is read the Brexit threads to find people who can’t understand the Border issue in NI/Ireland and don’t see why it’s a problem.

So tell me again how it’s a United Kingdom?

They have midgies though

Yes, vicious little buggers, thankfully I seem to be immune to them, my husband no so much.

What @Beaverhausen said!

YANBU.

DUP leader to march with the Orange Order in Scotland

Incidentally, the OO last time said if Scotland voted for independence they’d leave, so that’s a bonus!

5) I doubt many rural areas anywhere have an oncology department, my Mum had to travel for an hour and we live outside Glasgow.

I don't think anybody expects an oncology department in the rural areas but services have been moved that used to be carried out in the small local hospitals, like in the area where I live, the local hospital carried out US-guided biopsies, now they don't, everybody has to go to Glasgow for those now. Or consultants would come here for a day and see patients (I think the gynacologist still does and maybe some others) now everybody who needs to see a consultant for example for thyroid or bladder issues needs to travel to Glasgow. I'm aware the consultant needs to travel as well but it is one trip to see many patients as opposed to many patients all making that journey.

Yes Scotland is so smug about having all these extras
Like free uni education and prescriptions etc funded by the grossly unfair and out of date Barnett formula, at the detriment of English tax payers.
Happy to let Europeans enjoy the same free university education but not those pesky English students, they use a loophole to stop them getting access to it.
Yes you should be so proud Scotland. Not sure you will be so proud when you really are standing on your own two feet.

Agree with @rogueantimatter with education becoming a joke. My teen was actually talked out of (subtly told she couldn't do it) exams because she wasn't on for the highest grades. She said it was the same for all her friends.

Also, has anyone seen the state of the electronic and biotechnology industry in Scotland now? I was made redundant recently due to my company pulling out of Scotland- 400 people losing their jobs. This was just 1 of 3 closures that I know of in the last year in the central belt. It's pretty bleak, you only just need to drive through the business campuses in Livingston to see the massive amount of empty buildings to know the job situation is grim.

I think it's a matter of time until Ireland reunites. Especially with social changes coming in to force which are against Catholic beliefs. And religion becoming less important in peoples' lives.

Large sections of Scotland neither want independence nor to remain in Europe. Don't forget about (nor belittle because you disagree with) them.

Re drink driving in Scotland- the limit isn’t zero, it’s 22 in breath, and 50 in blood (it’s 35 in breath and 80 in blood in England currently).

I worry about the future in Scotland. Tons of services are cut to and beyond the bone.

When people leave the NHS they are not bring replaced. Remaining staff are struggling to cope.

Schools have no spare cash. Last year they ran out of ink for the printer. Basic stuff that should be essential. Still using old non decodeable Biff and Chip books.
The Curriculum for excellence is all about pushing Scotland towards independence. Not about raising standards. I would like to see Scottish & English kids sit the same exams at GCSE level and SATs to see how they really compare.

Changes to the exam system that mean results can no longer be truly compared to previous years. Which mean standards can drop with out it being obvious.

Social services are cut to the bone. For both adults and children. Old people who need 24hr care left in their own homes because nobody has money to fund their care. Reaility is to get a place in a nursing home people need to be hospitalised first. By an accident that could have been prevented.
Care might be 'free' but really it means they have fewer places available.

The council know a road need me is dangerous and needs some traffic calming measures. They have admitted they can't justify the funding until an accident happens.

Fewer well paid jobs, fewer opportunities.

Free everything still needs to be paid for the answer is they are cutting everything else to fund it.

Living in a part of Scotland that isn't the central belt I have to say that Scotland is no better than England. All this them and us with Westminster, it's exactly the same with areas outside the central belt. SNP couldn't give a shit about them. Buggar all been done to help with the oil issues in Aberdeen. Education is woeful, the presumption of mainstream for ASN children is failing everyone. NHS is no better. Named person is a poorly thought out sticking plaster. But we have baby boxes and free uni so hurrah.

As for no PFI, do some research on NPD, Scotland's replacement for PFI. A total and utter shitshow.

@Igneococcus my comment was a direct response to cancer treatment in Scotland requiring travel.

Of course it’s not perfect, no political party is perfect. There is always room for improvement/changes.

I love Scotland and it is still a beautiful part of the UK, but I have to say that it’s becoming a much less pleasant place to live and I don’t see it having a brighter future than England.

Scotland needs migrants because of our demographics but attitude surveys consistently show that we’re no more welcoming than the rest of the UK (which I’m not going to reduce to ‘England’). We are however extremely divided because of the independence issue, and this is affecting our economy as well as social cohesion.

Some aspects of our NHS are good, but others are dire with many services being cut following central dictats (like the removal of ALL wellbaby clinics). University education may be nominally ‘free’ but the gap between the richest and poorest is widening, and school education is so poor I really worry for my children’s future. Our once thriving Biotech industry (my sector) is crashing and wages are going through the floor. What is perhaps most worrying though is the way the current Scottish government conducts itself: unworkable or illegal badly written legislation, refusal to honour FOI requests, and simply ignoring Holyrood votes that it doesn’t like.

Can’t see it ending soon either.

Large sections of Scotland neither want independence nor to remain in Europe. Don't forget about (nor belittle because you disagree with) them.

Nobody did. As it stands, they’re currently the only ones happy with the status quo.

And as for belittling, on this thread it would appear to be coming from the unionists, so I’m not sure why you’re having a pop at nats.

I think it's a matter of time until Ireland reunites. Especially with social changes coming in to force which are against Catholic beliefs. And religion becoming less important in peoples' lives.

I think the Brexit border issue will push it. The GFA has a clause that if there is enough public support for a reunification referendum it has to be held.

Education is woeful, the presumption of mainstream for ASN children is failing everyone. NHS is no better. Named person is a poorly thought out sticking plaster. But we have baby boxes and free uni so hurrah.

Lack of ASN provision isn’t Scotland wide, in fact, in our area it’s shit hot. No presumption of mainstream.

And Named Person was rescinded so I’m not sure why it keeps being brought up.

NHS targets in Scotland in comparison to England

Nobody is saying the education sector is wonderful, it clearly needs improvement. But saying all these things in comparison to England without acknowledging that the English education system is on its knees is misleading.

It’s all very well to rattle off stats about things you disagree with, fine, but to pretend that Scotland (which has some areas which are exceeding targets) is the only country in the U.K. not doing what it should be just isn’t true.

I'm Scottish, as were my parents and most of my grandparents. I moved to England when DC1 was a baby. DH was born in England, to English parents. Moved to Scotland when he was primary school age. He got battered daily at his first school, and in those days teachers didn't like 'telltales'. I'm sure it wouldn't happen now, it's just some adults who have a problem with the English.

I thought there were mighty class divisions, the way someone spoke in my hometown pretty much identified their background. It happens to a lesser degree here in the north of England too. I've been fortunate, no one has ever taken against me here for being Scottish. DHs younger siblings have remained in Scotland, and to all intents and purposes are Scottish. Just like lots of families on both sides of the border, lots of us are a mixture of Scots, English, Irish and Welsh. There are more similarities than differences IMO.

As far as the NHS goes, there is a shortage of money and resources across the UK. A relative in Scotland needed an op for a serious condition last year. It was arranged, cancelled, arranged again, postponed again. He had the means to go private, but most of us wouldn't. I think I'd rather have life saving operations than free prescriptions for all. If I'd never lived anywhere but Scotland, I might have a perception that the English get the best deal. Most of us actually get the same deal. I'd rather see us pull together than split up.

Scotland have a lot of free stuff but have you seen the roads? Disgraceful