Did you promise to obey your husband?

[peace654]

I had an interesting discussion with my 90 year old nan about the royal wedding. She said she was surprised Meghan didn't promise to obey Harry, and the whole point of marriage is to follow tradition.

I was surprised - she's 90 but always been a feminist for her age at least, she believes in women working outside the home and not putting up with any bullshit. She's always pushed me to be strong and independent. She's not religious either. She definitely wore the trousers in her marriage too!

I've only been to a handful of weddings and didn't take much notice of the bows, so I wondered if it was usual for women to promise to obey their husbands nowadays? Do people still do it in order to be traditional?

Why?

I cannot pretend to begin to understand how any woman would participate in this appalling sexist farrago.

Yy. Though proposals and weddings seem to bring out some weird patriarchal submissiveness in some women who otherwise appear quite normal.

If you're making a lifelong vow to obey with the mental reservation 'as long as he never asks me to do something I don't want to do' why make it at all? The 1928 wording without obey was and remains an option, not compulsory.

If you're making a lifelong vow to cherish with the mental reservation 'as long as s/he does what I want' why make it at all?

It works pretty equally both ways.

Tbh there are many more patriarchal aspects to marriage than the vows which are pretty equal.

feerier I suppose it seems like a get out clause. I'll obey you if you're nice to me and don't ask me to do anything I don't want to do. We don't say in sickness and health but not if you get a mental health issue because I can't be doing with that.

It's entirely patriarchal. Which is fine if that's how you see marriage, which a lot of by the book Christians do. Marriage as set out in the Bible is a social structure with a man at the head, representing Christ leading his church. He must love his wife, as Christ loves his followers but direct, guide and correct her (like a child) and she submits to his elevated status and puts her trust in him. He cannot abuse this trust or make her do anything that is ungodly.

If you buy into this, then it's probably not a bad way to go on in life. But at least understand and be honest and it. Own it.

This view of marriage is why a lot of Christians do not believe in gay marriage conducted in a church, not because they don't respect gay relationships but because Christian marriage is about one man and one woman. That's just what the book says. It's not a judgement on gay people or their union.

Well said TomMarkle.

Well yes, it does seem equal ferrier in that neither appears to work if the chips are really down. When the shit hit the fan in my own marriage and I was being liberally sprayed with the stuff, I actually did think of my own vows - that I was in this situation voluntarily and was part of a publicly witnessed partnership. Obeying someone experiencing a psychotic episode could have been actively harmful, but the fact that he had stopped cherishing me was completely irrelevant. What is the point of vows that collapse under pressure? If cherishing means 'I'll cherish her while she's being lovely and doing what I say' then it's actually even more sexist and patronising than obeying, which at least acknowledges the awkward power imbalances in relationships by overruling the woman

I don't buy into the Christian ideal. The whole structure can fall apart for many reasons. We all vow to love for example but many of us don't love until death and that's not something we can do anything about.

I promised to love until death us do part.

ha ha ha ....would never have even crossed either of our minds...think we said something short n legal (thinking about it now might have been worth having to see if the guests noticed - they would have been in stitches if they had!)

Hell no! We had a big church wedding but even the vicar suggested we take that bit out

I think we promised to “love and cherish” each other. I wasn’t surprised that they took obedience out of the vows but I was very surprised that promising to honour each other wasn’t an option either. I think honour is pretty fundamental tbh

I did, by accident. I had made a big point of telling DH that I would never obey hahaha......so on our wedding day we were asked what set of vows we had chosen. This was a registry office do and for all my gobbling off We had completely forgotten to pick one. So the registrar said we could have a couple of minutes to choose but I just jumped in and said no we will use the first one on the list. She looked at me and said 'are you sure?' .....I didn't pay attention and just said 'yes, yes,yes'. So we are in front of all our friends and family saying our vows and I am repeating what the registrar said and I heard 'love, honour and obey' we were looking at each other and I hesitated, looked at the registrar and then back at my soon to be DH who was trying not to laugh 😂 so obviously I had to say it. He has never let me forget it ...apparently the look on my face was priceless. I have never obeyed though lol

I am not the obedient type. Neither is DH.

Neither of us considers the other to be a servant.

A vow to obey would have been totally inappropriate

stormy honour and obey in a registry office ceremony? Really?

DP and I aren’t married (but I like a good wedding same as the next person ) and I actually think all that “saying vows” bit is completely bonkers. As if because you say some words out loud, that makes them binding. What a load of daft woo nonsense if you think about it.

Sorry bit off subject I know, but all the “ooooh I’d never say that” comments are making me titter.

Diana didn’t vow to obey. Fergie and Sophie did but Kate didn’t either.

Can’t believe Sophie did. That was 1999 ffs!

My vows were done by a registrar so had no line about obeying. My mum in 1974 ordered that the obey vow was not used. My dad used to say ‘you vowed to obey me!’ and she'd say ‘I certainly did not are you mental!’

"And God promised men that good and obedient wives would be found in all corners of the world...

then He made the earth round...and laughed and laughed and laughed...."

If I ‘obeyed’nothing would get done I got told earlier to go inside as I was in his way. He went off in a huff to google a solution as ‘nothing ever fucking works’ So I had a look whilst he had his tantrum and solved the issue in 2 minutes. If i’d stayed indoors like a good obedient wife he’d still be scratching his head and whinging and possibly be in B and Q spending money!

I actually think all that “saying vows” bit is completely bonkers. As if because you say some words out loud, that makes them binding. What a load of daft woo nonsense if you think about it.

Are you confusing civil and religious ceremonies? Civil vows are not remotely 'woo', but the form of words you are obliged by law to say at a UK wedding are legally binding. You are now bound to the other person in the eyes of the law, and will have to get divorced in order to marry anyone else.

I know that lustrum - I’m just amused that you still have to say it all out loud, rather than just sign thr form or whatever.