Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

I’m putting this out there. High heels.

570 replies

Undercoverbanana · 02/06/2018 13:50

I think they are ugly and make women/girls look ridiculous. AIBU?

OP posts:
RebelRogue · 02/06/2018 20:16

@KittenBeast if there's no societal pressure then why are there so many threads about 10-11-12 yos asking to shave? With a multitude of replies of let her because bullying,comments,kids are mean,it's embarrassing,I wish my parents let me do it etc.

Such conditioning starts early and sometimes never goes away.

TemptressofWaikiki · 02/06/2018 20:17

YABVU They are beautiful and some women, including myself can walk well in them. I have hundreds of pairs, many original 1940s and 1950s pairs.

KittenBeast · 02/06/2018 20:20

You're certainly coming across as fairly stupid Cantankerous

CantankerousCamel · 02/06/2018 20:22

You’re suggesting there is no social expectation on women to shave their bodies and you’re saying I sound stupid?

This is just laughable

RoseWhiteTips · 02/06/2018 20:24

Agree, OP.

InkSnail · 02/06/2018 20:24

Why are high heels sexy?

"a raised backside is attractive to men because it mimics lordosis, the sexually receptive position that mammalian females adopt prior to mating".

DioneTheDiabolist · 02/06/2018 20:25

Preteen and teenage years are choc full of societal pressure, from what to wear, to what to listen to, what games to play and where to hang out. Erikson identified this psychosocial stage as Identity vs Role Confusion and it happens as the child is exposed to more influences outside of the immediate family and is given increased autonomy/independance.

It's interesting enough, but I'm not sure that adult women should make decisions based on (pre)teen conflict.

CantankerousCamel · 02/06/2018 20:27

Dione

Exactly! Which is why not shaving is such rad choice!

RebelRogue · 02/06/2018 20:29

@DioneTheDiabolist fair enough ...but that doesn't mean that societal pressure doesn't exist,and sadly that it starts early.

RoseWhiteTips · 02/06/2018 20:30

Men looks at my legs. I don’t ever wear high heels. Go figure.

Ravenesque · 02/06/2018 20:37

There is HUGE societal and cultural pressure on women to shave. It's easy for someone who shaves to say they're doing it not because they feel that they have to, but because they like it better like that. You might like it better, but did you ever go full on hairy in order to make that decision? Did you live for a couple of years with no shaving and then decide, "no, this isn't for me, I think I'll shave like 90% [random number but probably there or thereabouts, but happy to be contradicted], not because there is any cultural pressure, but because it's my choice and I have never felt the pressure of our culture, or all the ads for hair removal, or you know, been stared at for daring to go out with hairy legs?

There is huge pressure. Why are men doing it now too? It's called consumer capitalism. Don't worry, I'm not going to go full on Marxist with anyone, but in order for capital to grow, new brands and new markets need to be made. "Hey, let's tell men shaving is great for them too and that women don't like all their hair!". This isn't yet a full on cultural change. Beards are a definite indicator that men still like their hair and older men are not going to shave their chests and ball sacs, because they're not the target market. Maybe one day it will be a full on cultural change. Women didn't all suddenly start shaving, but they were eventually shamed into it.

That's the other difference. Men who are told that shaving is cool are told it is cool and hot. Women who are culturally expected to shave, were and are shamed into it. Hair is nasty unless it's on your head, type stuff.

I give in to all manner of cultural pressures. I wish I didn't, but I know I do and I don't pretend that it's me making my own choice, because none of us lives in a vacuum and whether you chose to conform or rebel, you are doing so from within the culture you inhabit. There's nothing wrong with conforming per se, but it is wrong to pretend that any of us are free from the societal norms and pressures that are all around us.

Ravenesque · 02/06/2018 20:40

@CountFosco, thanks so much for the link to En Brogue! That is going to be a new binge read for me Smile

Teateaandmoretea · 02/06/2018 20:41

This is the problem they are not a choice they are considered the correct footwear for women when dressed smartly. I have an issue with this.

^^ this is exactly it. Women should not be required to wear any type of shoe a man isn't. Why should I totter around in heels if I don't want to (and I don't). But if u do then fill them...

ForalltheSaints · 02/06/2018 20:42

A start would be a law that said no person can be required to wear high heels at work (except perhaps theatre performances). You may recall the receptionist who objected last year to this.

LassWiADelicateAir · 02/06/2018 20:44

Lass of course I have used my personal experience to decipher my opinion of a social norm

No you were using your personal experience of the efficacy of anti perspirant to unilaterally declare how it works- if it works like the way you say it does for you that it must be the same for everyone.

CantankerousCamel · 02/06/2018 20:49

Lass

No, I haven’t.

You made a general comment that hair is ugly and unclean and I said that’s rubbish. The burden of evidence is on you to prove your point.

I know it’s nonsense because I’ve been both hairy and shaven and so have many other poeplke I know. You’ve made a judgement based on nothing but the social expectations enforced upon you

KittenBeast · 02/06/2018 20:54

You’re suggesting there is no social expectation on women to shave their bodies and you’re saying I sound stupid?
This is just laughable

I'm saying that nobody gives a fuck whether you shave or don't. Nobody gives a fuck whether I shave or don't. Nobody gives a fuck. I know plenty of people that don't shave their legs. Nobody gives a fuck. Literally nobody. Not anyone in the real world, anyway. What circles are you mixing in where so many people give a fuck about whether you have public hair?

KittenBeast · 02/06/2018 20:58

Or pubic, even.

CantankerousCamel · 02/06/2018 20:59

Oh I see.

kitten

Our intelligence levels are ill-matched to have this discussion.

Apologise for not realising that sooner.

WilburIsSomePig · 02/06/2018 21:08

I'm saying that nobody gives a fuck whether you shave or don't. Nobody gives a fuck whether I shave or don't. Nobody gives a fuck. I know plenty of people that don't shave their legs. Nobody gives a fuck. Literally nobody. Not anyone in the real world, anyway. What circles are you mixing in where so many people give a fuck about whether you have public hair?

I agree with this. I genuinely don't give a shiny shite what anyone else chooses to do with their body. Some people are so caught up in what they believe, they really cannot believe that people don't care.

The80sweregreat · 02/06/2018 21:10

I don’t care what people do either.
Honestly. Their arm pits and legs, their choice. ( same for men)

KittenBeast · 02/06/2018 21:13

I agree with this. I genuinely don't give a shiny shite what anyone else chooses to do with their body. Some people are so caught up in what they believe, they really cannot believe that people don't care

We're thick, apparently.

RebelRogue · 02/06/2018 21:19

@KittenBeast except they do. Maybe amongst adults they're in a minority now ,or don't share their views to your face/out loud ,but they still exist.

And even if everyone truly did not give a fuck some people struggle to go against messages they have internalised for years.

Meanwhile in the real world pre teen girls beg their parents to be allowed to shave legs/pits/arms. Fully their choice no?

Bumbelinadance · 02/06/2018 21:27

I love my high heels
They make me happy
Live and let live
If they didn’t make me happy
I would stop wearing them

Just saying

KittenBeast · 02/06/2018 21:29

except they do. Maybe amongst adults they're in a minority now ,or don't share their views to your face/out loud ,but they still exist

Maybe they do, but they simply don't matter and aren't worth anyone's time. There are only a small, insignificant number of people who give a shit if you're fuzzy or not.

And even if everyone truly did not give a fuck some people struggle to go against messages they have internalised for years

And that's a shame.

Meanwhile in the real world pre teen girls beg their parents to be allowed to shave legs/pits/arms. Fully their choice no?

Growing up I can't recall anyone giving much of a toss, and if they did, does this really happen? Who at 12 or 13 can't get hold of a razor and shave without begging parents, if it really matters to them that much? Shaving arms? Is this a thing?