To think this doesn't help women to be taken seriously in the workplace?

[Tryingtochangeitall]

I attended a conference last week where there were a number of speakers.

The only woman as part of her speech referenced her important roles outside of work as a wife and mother

None of the men said anything remotely similar.

I didn't need to know that. It doesn't make her better at her job and I just found someone successful and clearly good at their day job referring to themselves as a wife rather demeaning. It would have been slightly better had she perhaps referenced a supportive husband and family, albeit still irrelevant.

I feel it plays up to the idea that women aren't as work focused and professional as men.

it wouldn't engage those who have np interest in marriage (like me) or who are gay and definitely wouldn't be able to get up there and refer to/ show pictures of their same sex spouse...

Gay people can marry and have children you know.

Do you not have children either? If you don’t I would get a vibe from your OP that you actually rather endorsed the notion that women who are married or have children should shut up about it if they want to progress. But the truth is that most women will marry someone at least once and will have children too.

Both. Does it have to be either/or?

When you're in front of several hundred people and you're not there to give a 'how I overcame barriers to succeed' talk, I don't think there is any place for this.

In general in the workplace, my immediate team know I have children and am not married. However I don't reference it generally, and in the wider department and firm as a whole I don't think people would know one way or t'other.

I do have a male colleague who constantly references his child to everyone. I find it v unprofessional. However interestingly he never refers to the importance of his role as a husband...!

Being a wife doesn't impact your ability to do anything but being a mother teaches you a lot. Shouldn't you maybe be questioning why the men didn't mention their roles as fathers?

I think its irrelevant. If the speaker wanted to talk about her whole self/life, whats the problem? Not demeaning at all, Just a fact. Most of us have many roles all interlinking, good for her, and good for a company that works with this. The male model is WORK , everything else in the background. More and more I am seeing companies who are family, life/work balance friendly. To men and to women, it is happening in my own family now. If more people acknowledged that men and women are more than their work roles it would be great. The result loyal workers who feel valued for all they do. Names like wife, husband, partner etc mean only what they mean to the speaker. We should not project our own meanings to the terms. Women should celebrate who we are in all our roles, so should men

Tell you what OP, why don't you stick to your preferred approach next time you speak at a conference, and she can stick to hers.

Have you never had a man give a talk at a conference that you disagreed with / thought was shit? I'd be surprised. Assume you would immediately be online saying "AIBU to think this doesn't help men to be taken seriosuly in the workplace"? You can imagine yourself typing that out, yes?

So you're sayig that in order to be taken seriously in the work place, we have to act like men?

If you take a woman less seriously because she mentions also being a wife and mother, thats about you and your judgement. Not about her. is she good at her job? Was her speech interesting? Does she know her stuff? Well then why the fuck would you see her as any lesser because she truthfully mentioned that she has a balanced life and other roles?

YANBU. I agree with you OP.

I'm well aware gay people can marry. I have several friends in very happy same sex marriages and civil partnerships. However it's not acceptable to be openly gay in many firms. My friends don't keep it a secret in their workplace, but they dont actively mention it to the wider . Much like I have never and would not actively mention my children.

And yes I do have children, and a career.

I think the key point here is the fact there was only one woman speaker. It's really hard when you're the only one, because you seem to carry the entire weight of your gender in terms of how you conduct yourself.

I agree with you in that I wish women weren't continually told they can 'have it all' or 'do it all'. The key issue is that on average, no matter how successful they are at work, women still do the lion share of the housekeeping and childcare - or at least bear the burden of being responsible for it even if it's outsourced.

Women will never feel as able to thrive at work unless they are truly supported at home. The only couples I've known who've been able to achieve this have been ones where they both earn roughly similar amounts of money at similar levels of seniority.

I think it’s a bit victim blamey to say that this is the reason women aren’t taken seriously.

I wouldn't mention this in a conference presentation whatsoever unless it was on the topic of women in the workplace. But I'm not big on personal jokes/photos on Twitter/mixing work and pleasure anyway and I don't do it on social media but quite a few do.

I would mention having children more in informal chit chat at conferences, or when meeting new people at work, if it seemed appropriate, and also to explain if I needed to leave. I don't pretend not to have kids although many of my more distant colleagues when I joined the dep't didn't know I had children and I'd been there many years. People I work with closely- sure!

I think the most pernicious thing here is that it is still seen that what one woman does can and does reflect on ALL men.

Plus the assumption in the OP that women won't be taken seriosuly in the first place - that is a certain starting point in thinking. Not a particularly useful starting point.

Has anyone ever read a thing like this anywhere, written seriously:

"AIBU to think this doesn't help men to be taken seriosuly in the workplace" and commenting on the actions of one man. Not even actions - mentioning something outside of work - with men it's often hobbies they mention. So, you go to a talk, a man includes some mentions of his hillwalking during the talk. So, immedaitely online "This sort of thing doesn't help men to be taken seriosuly in the work place".

What we need is for women to be given the same freedom to be seen as, and treated as, indivudal people, and not as some homogenous mass who are all the same and if one fucks up we've all fucked up. And I mean this woman just "referenced" her family in a talk, it's not like she crashed barings bank, or fiddled the Libor rates, or covered up a massive pension defecit...

lol should be women at the top there obviously

Thespring - absolutely agree.

If this was a Women in Business conference it would have sat better. Although I think would be better phrased as her and spouse working as a team supporting each other's careers, rather than being a wife is really important.

But it wasn't an inspirational talk of that nature, so I do feel her comments were out of place.

I’m autistic, so maybe my view isn’t typical, but I think at a professional conference all the speakers and delegates should stick to the professional topic under discussion. Who the hell cares whether they have kids or are married, and who wants to waste five minutes of valuable conference time hearing about their home life? It just drags out the speech and delays you getting to the coffee break!
If you want to prattle on about irrelevant social stuff, save it for dinner or coffee time.
And I think it’s particularly demeaning and undermining if women do it - it comes across as “Please don’t be angry that I have a career, and am competing with you big important men - I’m a good little wife and mother too, honestly..”

I agree OP, unless the talk was about work life balance then there was no need to mention marital or parental status.

Men don't tend to, they just get on with the job.

I agree OP.

I was on a "staff engagemet panel" recently (an extra step in the interview process which some companies have introduced for recruitment to very senior positions). All the women mentioned their kids, none of the men did.

...although, I don't necessarily blame women for doing this. I just think it's a sad reflection on society and th workplace that women feel this is something they should mention but men don't.

It's not saying that at all. In all my working life - which goes back to the 1970s - women have always had to be twice as good as men to reach the same level and have fought to be taken seriously. We've been told you can't combine a career and a family and be successful and some of us have spent decades proving that you can. By wanting this woman to airbrush her family out of her professional life you're perpetuating that paternalistic crap. Fucking decades of feminism down the drain. I despair.

I was sort of nodding at your post OP and then I thought - Hell NO!

It should be the DEFAULT that a woman is taken seriously without having to do or say anything. Baseline respect is expected and afforded to men without question.

Why should that be different for women? Answer: It bloody well shouldn't.

Take from this wahatever you want...this thread made me remember that when my OH was doung his PhD at CERN one of the professors said "a wife and kids has been the downfall of many a good physicist"

So women can't refer to themselves as a wife? At all? Or just in a work scenario? Personally I'm so over being told what I can and can't do or should and shouldn't do.

This reminds me of the ‘man who has it all’ Facebook page. Your OP reads as something of a parody to me.

I’m autistic, so maybe my view isn’t typical, but I think at a professional conference all the speakers and delegates should stick to the professional topic under discussion
I entirely agree.
I'm autistic, too.

If you've taken up my time with a conference, keep to the point. Man or woman, I don't give two hoots about your family life, I want you to focus on the work.

Being a feminist and a successful worker doesn't mean you have to mention your family, or that you have to avoid it. Just don't waste people's time with it.

Starting off your speech by references like this sets the wrong tone. A throwaway comment during the speech would have jarred less. But talking about the importance of her wife and mother roles at the outset was really jarring. Whilst I did listen to the rest of her speech I was constantly thinking why on earth did she feel the need to start off like that?

And if a man had spoken of the importance of his role as a husband and father with photos, I would have had a very similar wtf? moment.