To refuse to stop giving my DD money???

[DepressedOtter]

I have 3 DD's, DD1 + DD2 and dd3. All live with me.

Dd1 is 28. works part time. Got into a fair whack of debt and had to move back in with me to try to clear it. She also has a DS aged 3. I look after him for approx 15hrs a week as well as his time at nursery so that she can work. She works approx 26hrs per week but sometimes does up to 30 or as little as 22 (averages 26).

Dd2 is 20. Just left an abusive relationship. Has been here for 2 weeks, no job. But is job hunting while considering studying later in the year. No income, but I buy her food (which is generally pretty cheap. She costs me approx £15 a week total) I also give her £2 for the bus whenever she has an interview, she's had 4 in 2 weeks. Due to her own circumstances she may not be eligible for JSA (a long story) but she is trying as we speak and they may be able to help her with at least advice if not money. But I can't let her starve.

Dd3, disabled, aged 12. Non verbal, in nappies 24/7. Prone to violent meltdowns. Mental age of 3. I am her carer full time and yes, I'm on benefits (burn me for it If you'd like!).

Rent I charge dd1.
Dd1 pays £100 a week, which doesn't even touch what the council are charging me for having her here (£110pw in reduction of HB due to her moving in) let alone her food and her sons food (which I buy) or the rise in bills such as gas and electric - which has been substantial.
All in all having DD1 and her DS here leaves me about 80pw in the hole but I don't say anything as I know she can't really afford to pay any more.

But recently she hasn't even been paying the £100. This week it was £85 but the week before it was £35 she paid, and before that it was £45. Every time I question it she screams and screams at me, which can result in a violent meltdown from dd3.
Dd1 also leaves my house a state most days. She will frequently refuse to help around the house or only do so begrudgingly, even if it's her mess. Sometimes I just leave it for her to sort but sometimes I can't (if for example she has filled my washing machine and there's a load of wet half musty clothes in there while my dirty laundry is backed up). She will leave dishes unwashed for days, to the point where I crack and do them myself.
I'm normally very houseproud and I am miserable with this.
But recently every time I try to say anything about DD1's messiness, lack of reliability with paying (to the point where last week I could not pay my rent to the council, something I can't allow to go on for too long) she screams at me that dd2 is clearly my favourite as she does not have to pay anything and I give her money.

Dd2 does not have to pay for several reasons.
The council aren't charging me anything to have her here (as she has no income).
You can't get blood out of a stone, if I said "pay me £50 a week" or whatever, dd2 would be terrified scrabbling around to sell some of her very few possessions, for £50. Which would help for the first week maybe, but once that money is gone my dd has nothing anymore and I'm no better off for it anyway!
I also don't give my dd money in that sense, as explained I give her £2 for a ticket on the bus when she has a job interview (so she can find work) and I buy her food. She eats cheap stuff which costs me very little.
I also think, given dd1 isn't actually paying what she's costing (which I've tried to tell her but ends in her being shouty, dramatic and saying I favour dd2) she has a right cheek to try and tell me that I can't spend on average £20pw on dd2. Especially because not doing so would mean starving my own child. Something I would not do to either of them (and I would absolutely keep dd1 on no money if she was out of work and could not claim anything)

So tell me, am I being unfair? Dd1 wants me to stop giving dd2 money for interviews and buying food but dd1 isn't exactly forthcoming on how her sister can live on fresh fucking air

All in all having DD1 and her DS here leaves me about 80pw in the hole but I don't say anything as I know she can't really afford to pay any more

Do you mean DD1 has no idea that you've lost so much by having her stay with you? If so the first thing I'd be doing is informing her that she's actually costing you far far more than DD2, along with a warning that the next time she screams at you she'll be out the door.

By the way, I hope you're claiming disability benefit in relation to DD3?

I'm sure OP is claiming everything she's entitled to.

DD1 needs to be given her marching orders, the ungrateful mare.

I don't think dd2 is taking the piss, she has only been here and free of her ex for 2 weeks, she has applied for many jobs (and had 4 interviews) in that time. As I've also said, she does do more than her fair share, including looking after dd3 for me so that I can go out. I do genuinely believe she's trying her hardest...
dd1 however, I agree.
I do struggle to think about kicking her out though, she's my child and the last time I hinted that perhaps she ought to start looking for somewhere else to live she started crying and saying her and DGS would be in a cardboard box on the street. I know logically that the council would probably help her within a month, and if not she could likely stay with DGS father (they're not together but get on quite well) and has other friends. But every time i think about it I feel really guilty about hurting her or my grandson
She wasn't evicted or anything by the way, but as she didn't have much left at the end of the month she wanted to move back in and save a bit more, clear off all of the debts and have a fresh start. I did tell her the council would probably want her to pay a part of the rent, and did say she might not be as well off as she thought, but she insisted that as long as it was less than £1200 a month (which it is, by a long way) she would be better off and wouldn't mind. Her attitude changed quickly once she got her feet under the table though. I have suggested she get help from stepchange or similar, as I think she (at least previously) would've benefitted but she refuses. I've also tried to help her budget but she won't tell me anything about her debts, who she owes to, how much the repayments are etc. I've been in financial trouble myself before so wanted to help her with it, but she won't tell me anything (as is her right as she is an adult)

She does drink, smokes socially (probably 5 packets in the last 2 months) and does go out sometimes, but I'm obviously not sure how much she spends. She hasn't had an excuse as such - last week it was because she had an unexpected bill from her previous place - which is ok. But generally she just says "I don't have the money" doesn't tell me why and doesn't seem to have a plan to pay it back at all. If I say anything else her voice raises and the argument starts.

I don't have a DH and am single which I think makes it a bit harder as I struggle to see if I'm unreasonable or what I should do for the best as I have no one to talk to about it.

Both dd's have never really been close, but dd2 is getting a bit withdrawn and seems to just head out for a walk or upstairs whenever dd1 is around, as dd1 has been quite horrible to her, too. I know she is embarrassed to have no money, dd2 has worked and lived independently since 16, so to be back with mum and having no money of her own is probably fairly demoralising for her.

of crouse there are things like being pleasant.not rude.being grateful.helping around the house.those are a thing as a parent you tell you daughter to get her act together on.yes argue the hell with her if shes not doing her bit.

At twenty fucking eight, she’s the Op’s DD, but she’s NO child.

DD2 sounds lovely 🌷

I don’t think there is any excuse for the eldest daughter to act as she has been. No matter the stress she is under, it is unacceptable to scream at her mother, refuse to clean up after herself, and neglect to pay her rent. She is 28 years old. Most people have managed to support themselves fully for many years by that age. But this woman is in debt, only working part time, and taking advantage of her mother’s generosity.

I often see posts on MN saying that parents should always welcome their adult children home with open arms and assist them financially (with house deposits, etc.). But in some situations, that sort of assistance does the adult child no favours at all. I have seen adults who are truly infantilised by their parents’ well-intended generosity. In the OP’s case, it seems that the eldest daughter has reverted to stroppy adolescence. And that can’t be good for her, much less for the other family members (including her young son for whom she is meant to be a role model).

She’s 28. She needs a kick up the arse.

kateandme by making her stand on her own two feet.

She is abusive to OP which distresses her disabled sister, and she doesn't help out around the house. OP does not have to put up with that, whether it's her daughter or not. The more OP puts up with it, the worse it will get. Being stressed is no excuse for her vile behaviour, and being family doesn't get you a get out of jail free card.

She’s using emotional blackmail to get you off her case. You need to give her an ultimatum- she either has to sit with you and have a full, adult conversation about the mess she’s in (no crying, no shouting) so you can help her make positive changes or she can find somewhere else to live.
She had to see that she needs to make a decision one way or the other, that this is not a long term solution and that her behaviour is bang out of order
Stand up for yourself- I know she’s your daughter but she’s being completely disrespectful of you, your home and of her siblings and is showing no interest in wanting to improve her situation- for her or her son.

how is kicking a daughter rout ever going to help her.she by choice im guessing wouldn't have had to move back.and is probably stressing out over this herself

She deserves to be kicked out because she's not sticking to the agreement of paying OP what was agreed, hence OP being short on her rent. She's also screaming and shouting at OP and refusing to discuss it in a grown up manner...all this is having a bad effect on DD3 so yeah she should be thrown out. What would you do? Allow her to dictate to the entire household?

She’s a grown up adult. She’s not a child. Her mother shouldn’t have to be dealing with the mess that she has gotten herself into nor having to put up with the emotional abuse.

kateandme

I'm sorry but you're talking nonsense. You're talking as if OPs DD is a little child. She's a 28yo mother, her selfish behaviour is disgraceful, no excuses.

how is kicking a daughter rout ever going to help her

Because the op is going to risk falling into massive rent arrears and possibly face eviction herself from the family home. Housing benefit is not paid in full if you have a working adult in the house even if it's not them on the tenancy. That is not an acceptable risk.

OP, you HAVE to kick her out. I know how hard it is when it's your own child, I've had to do it myself, but it has to be done. You know the council will house her, even if it's in a B&B, so she's not going to be on the streets.

Well for one thing you sound a great Mother. As has been said by pp fair treatment is not always equal. You are been very fair.

From your description of your eldest she probably has always avoided responsibility, it is time for her to grow up.

Best of luck with it all. I hope she listens pays up or moves out. Free childcare in all thrown in. You are to good to her.

I would imagine if dd1 is working over 16 hours a week and has a child she will be entitled to working and child tax credit (which is a decent amount, my SIL receives this) so why would she not be giving you money?. I'm sure once your dd2 finds a job you will ask her for money towards the house aswell. Think she may need to grow up. I'm 28 I have 2 children run a house with a full time job. I visit my mum a lot and she would never put up with me leaving our mess lying around in her house, I tidy up before we leave. Kick her arse into gear, she needs to grow up.

So she was paying £1200 before in rent, and managing even though it was tight? And now won't pay £400 a month?

That's really shit! If she paid you £600 a month, would that cover her costs? Then she could still pay off a serious chunk of the debt every month.

But she would have to stop being an arsehole and screaming at you, as well as actually paying the money.

she won't tell me anything (as is her right as she is an adult)

Well, that sounds like her trying to have it both ways. Grown adults don’t move back in with their parents because they can’t hack financial self-sufficiency (having become a parent herself ffs), then fail to make the agreed contribution without explanation AND go into a strop when asked. (Let alone all the other stuff involving sisters.)

If DD1 was childless i would threaten eviction.
However, throwing herself on the mercy of the council will see her being offered emergency housing in a hostel or cheap bnb. Not ideal for a 3 year old who's already lost one home.

Op should try to fix the family dynamic first. I really feel for DD2 and when she does get a job hopefully there will be more money coming into the house.

Ok DD2 and DD are by definition dependant and you are being a good parent supporting, with minimal negative to yourself (given dd2 helps out) and likely facilitating dd2 to get sorted and on her way

DD1 is choosing to sponge off you, getting free childcare, being rude, shouting and upsetting you and the other two, not cleaning up appropriately- do I go on?

You know you are being walked over and it won’t change until you sort it out
If she shouts you tell her she goes

Give her a week to start paying and start cleaning up and if she doesn’t shape up or her stuff outside

She won’t be in a cardboard box, her ex will have her and she can apply for emergency housing

Tbh you will be doing her a favour as she needs to grow up and be respectful

You are hurting your daughter and grandson more by allowing her to stagnate in this way. This environment sounds horrible for your grandson (and not because of anything you are doing but because his mother is refusing to step up). Refuse to allow her to guilt-trip you. She needs to go.

telling your parents about your debt is so difficult.its the biggest form of a child(or anyones) shame think.and ive seen it come across as anger lots of times.its such an out of control feeling to be in debt.and u never wan tto let ur parents down like that.

try to bring yourselves back together.easier said than done from an outsider I know.but its like your all individualy seeing and fighting your own battles.or the two sister are.you need to get back into caring for eacohtr and having eacohters backs if that possible.
so simple things.wathing movies.cooking together.going out for coffees.just slowly trying to get that link back.it creates thought and empathy with one another.
make sure your dd2 knows there is no shame in being where she is.that it can happen to anyone that best people in the world.the most hardworking can find the world shit on them sometimes.but that as a mum and family your proud and will always be there to catch her and work to get her back on her feet.
what about even a jobs night.sitting down with your latops and all the girls searching through indeed or having a laugh over prospective jobs etc.sticking a bowls of chips in the middle of the table and a box set and helping eacohter out.
work with what you've got to make the situations better for all.
get your dd1 to look after the dd3.get her some dam perspective too. maybe she could do this whilst you go out with dd2 for a job hunt.
is there any way your dd1 could get another job.
any local pubs or bars for the dds to even job share.
money has so many shame and guilt feeling with them when your introuble with it.al you can do is to try to get back as a unit if you can.because like most things that bring such heightened troublesome emotions,the support you have around you is the thing that will see you through.you all need that.
I can picture this group of woman being such a force to be wreckoned with with all you've been through if you could get back together again

Sit DD1 down and tell her the facts of life. She’s getting a good ride off your generosity but you have to consider DD3 first. Good luck OP. You sound like a great mum doing her best for her children.