To refuse to stop giving my DD money???

[DepressedOtter]

I have 3 DD's, DD1 + DD2 and dd3. All live with me.

Dd1 is 28. works part time. Got into a fair whack of debt and had to move back in with me to try to clear it. She also has a DS aged 3. I look after him for approx 15hrs a week as well as his time at nursery so that she can work. She works approx 26hrs per week but sometimes does up to 30 or as little as 22 (averages 26).

Dd2 is 20. Just left an abusive relationship. Has been here for 2 weeks, no job. But is job hunting while considering studying later in the year. No income, but I buy her food (which is generally pretty cheap. She costs me approx £15 a week total) I also give her £2 for the bus whenever she has an interview, she's had 4 in 2 weeks. Due to her own circumstances she may not be eligible for JSA (a long story) but she is trying as we speak and they may be able to help her with at least advice if not money. But I can't let her starve.

Dd3, disabled, aged 12. Non verbal, in nappies 24/7. Prone to violent meltdowns. Mental age of 3. I am her carer full time and yes, I'm on benefits (burn me for it If you'd like!).

Rent I charge dd1.
Dd1 pays £100 a week, which doesn't even touch what the council are charging me for having her here (£110pw in reduction of HB due to her moving in) let alone her food and her sons food (which I buy) or the rise in bills such as gas and electric - which has been substantial.
All in all having DD1 and her DS here leaves me about 80pw in the hole but I don't say anything as I know she can't really afford to pay any more.

But recently she hasn't even been paying the £100. This week it was £85 but the week before it was £35 she paid, and before that it was £45. Every time I question it she screams and screams at me, which can result in a violent meltdown from dd3.
Dd1 also leaves my house a state most days. She will frequently refuse to help around the house or only do so begrudgingly, even if it's her mess. Sometimes I just leave it for her to sort but sometimes I can't (if for example she has filled my washing machine and there's a load of wet half musty clothes in there while my dirty laundry is backed up). She will leave dishes unwashed for days, to the point where I crack and do them myself.
I'm normally very houseproud and I am miserable with this.
But recently every time I try to say anything about DD1's messiness, lack of reliability with paying (to the point where last week I could not pay my rent to the council, something I can't allow to go on for too long) she screams at me that dd2 is clearly my favourite as she does not have to pay anything and I give her money.

Dd2 does not have to pay for several reasons.
The council aren't charging me anything to have her here (as she has no income).
You can't get blood out of a stone, if I said "pay me £50 a week" or whatever, dd2 would be terrified scrabbling around to sell some of her very few possessions, for £50. Which would help for the first week maybe, but once that money is gone my dd has nothing anymore and I'm no better off for it anyway!
I also don't give my dd money in that sense, as explained I give her £2 for a ticket on the bus when she has a job interview (so she can find work) and I buy her food. She eats cheap stuff which costs me very little.
I also think, given dd1 isn't actually paying what she's costing (which I've tried to tell her but ends in her being shouty, dramatic and saying I favour dd2) she has a right cheek to try and tell me that I can't spend on average £20pw on dd2. Especially because not doing so would mean starving my own child. Something I would not do to either of them (and I would absolutely keep dd1 on no money if she was out of work and could not claim anything)

So tell me, am I being unfair? Dd1 wants me to stop giving dd2 money for interviews and buying food but dd1 isn't exactly forthcoming on how her sister can live on fresh fucking air

She is displaying precisely how and why she got into a mess with money, meaning she had to move in with you.

Set out to her precisely what you expect moneywise from her. If she can't won't bother to meet it, tell her that she has to go. Even pack her bloody bags for her.

How disgusting that she upsets DD3 and acts like a spoilt brat over DD2.

I will be doing approx 30 hours a week (reducing from fulltime for childcare when DS goes to school) and I will still be earning more than minimum wage > Approx 14k a year. I would be asking her does she need you to sit and help her budget plan, and stick to it. Perhaps she has gotten into a mess financially and doesn't know how to undo what she has done, or her behaviours. I have gotten into a mess spending in the past and it took a while for my behaviours to change.

You’re being more than fair to dd1 and if it wasn’t for her ds I’d agree with kicking her out. As it is I think she needs an ultimatum with a time limit - shape up or ship out I.e. improve in x number of ways by y date or you will be changing the locks and out she goes. Get dd2 to take dd3 out for a walk if possible while you give dd1 the rules? List what she’s costing you to show her exactly what you’re laying out for her.

I think you've had enough comments now to be able to say that DD1 needs to grow up and pay up or ship out.

You're down £10 a week already in rent even when she pays the £100. This is before you add food and utilities. If she can't see what a leach she is then she needs to go and find her own accommodation for herself and her child including all bills and food for under £100 a week.

Calculate what 15 hours of childcare a week would cost her and tell her.

Then tell her to find her own house. I know she's your DD1 and you don't want to see her on her arse, but she's massively using you. She's 28, and still screaming at you? Time for her to move.

DD2 is with you because she's left an abusive relationship. DD1 is with you because she overspent and now she's expecting you to pick up the tab.

Just out of interest, how long has she been benefitting from your kindness, compared to the two weeks DD2 has been back home?

YNBU, but DD1 sounds VU!

Does she know that her non-dependant deduction is based on her earnings, and that that amount is what the law says she can afford to contribute towards the rent? Why should she be subsidised, when she already gets her full benefit entitlement plus her wages?

I'd be telling her she needs to pay up or get out. Actually, I think I'd probably be writing her a letter giving her notice. But then I'm a hard-faced bitch.

It may be worth submitting her payslips to the council. Because the HB deduction is based on her earnings, if she'd done a lot of extra hours when you last submitted her payslips, the deduction made now may be higher than it should be. But she still needs to cover the money you lose and her costs.

I support people with housing problems, and the failure of adult children to cough up their contribution is a huge cause of rent arrears and sometimes eviction.

Bear in mind that if she does move out, and that leaves you with a spare bedroom, you will be affected by the bedroom tax (14% of rent for one spare room, 25% for two).

I'm 28, I'm married and have a great career having worked full time for eleven years - alongside part time study. I racked up some frivolous debt in my early 20's which I'm now paying via Step Change. It didn't send me back to my mum's and I didn't scream at people and feel sorry for myself.

Your DD needs to get a grip.

And show her this thread!

Her behaviour is very wrong - screaming and screaming at you to deflect any criticism and drown out any explanation. Terrible to think she is responsible for a child.

If she won’t listen to you, could you send her an email? Inform her of expectations and rent requirements. You are already helping her with the debt by housing and feeding her and only asking for a contribution toward it. She is bullying you to be her housekeeper / nanny to boot!

It sounds as if you are all struggling and this is a very difficult situation for all of you including your dd1. In reality she is probably very stressed and possibly overwhelmed. Bottom line, your time and money is for your 2 younger dds and you. Every pound your dd1 demands takes money away for food or to do nice things with your youngest dd.

Tell DD1 to sling her fucking hook, fucking hell what an abusive twat she is.

Dd1 is s sponge, financially and emotionally, it's time for her to move out, she is a user, you have enough of your plate with an ungrateful abusive leech living with you, give her a month and tell her out she goes

I have to agree with this OP

very difficult.i have had this.and yes I thnk the other sibling will always have that sweeping thought of jealousy or whatever it is when we think we are hard done by but...then its gone,you get over it and realise mum and dad are only ever trying t odo the right thing.
so if you are as you sound then your a loving mum who doesn't love/like your middle daughter over the other?
it does happen. there can be major creuelty when a mum really just doesn't like one child and will cherish anothr.but this really doesn't sound like that here does it,so as long as you know that in your heart.
educatingarti had a lovely thoughtful post and ideas so id try something like that.
your family sounds like its got lots going on.and you need to work together.so also id try and start doing stuff together if you can.do the sisters have a good bond?try and reassure the love between the family again.you should be fighting together now rather than fighting a you've all had your fair amount of shit thrown at your recently eh.
could you sit down with the two girl and let each of you speak.calmly.maybe if you all heard eachother emotions here it would put things into better perspective instead of the sisters perhaps seeing and then believing only the outer layers of things.

You have no choice but too kick dd1 out, she works so she can pay rent on a property or council property? You can’t afford to lose that much each week and feed them both, I’m guessing you are having to use some of dd3’s DLA to pay for DD1 and her DS?

I don't think kicking her out here is right though.your all overhwhelmed I think from your own problems and we all take and that vent that in different ways.it doesn't mean anyone is a bad person.she might be taking the mick on not paying but is she a bad person would she wan tto be making you feel this way.i think shes reacting badly to a set of circumstance that feel out of control a bit

Have you written all of the costs down, shown DD1 the exact financial hit both she and her sister cost you?

Write it down, paper, email and text. Be very blunt with her, she has to pay to live somewhere and she either works with you or goes to the council and throws herself at their mercy - as a homeless single parent!

She really is doing a very good job of illustrating what got her into a financial hole in the first place. If you don't start insisting she will drag all of you into the same money pit.

Good luck!

I was shocked she's 28. At 18 I went abroad to work then wasn't allowed "home" again. Lost a place to live, the "family" I lived with and had to get my arse in gear. By 23 I'd been working solidly for years, bought a flat in London and standing on my own too feet. Maybe it's time your dh and you both spoke to her and made her see reality. How did you deal with her at 2 when she had tantrums? Do that.

your family sounds like its got lots going on.and you need to work together.so also id try and start doing stuff together if you can.do the sisters have a good bond?try and reassure the love between the family again.you should be fighting together now rather than fighting a you've all had your fair amount of shit thrown at your recently eh.
could you sit down with the two girl and let each of you speak.calmly.maybe if you all heard eachother emotions here it would put things into better perspective instead of the sisters perhaps seeing and then believing only the outer layers of things.

I agree. DD1 is acting badly but I'm guessing she's lost her home because of debt, hence moving in with op. I think she's so stressed at her failure that she can't see the wood for the trees. I don't think she needs to be threatened with eviction right now by her own mum.
Op all 3 of you need to sit down with pen and paper and work out all the incomings and outgoings in the house. As the mother you need to stress to both of them that you all need to be looking out for each other.

The two eldest are both taking the piss

DD1 needs to grow up. She’s an adult and a mother. She needs to pay her way - the amount is non negotiable (what was the excuse for being short the last few weeks? Does she go out/smoke/drink? She needs to be paying rent to you before any other spending) your putting her and her son up almost rent free and providing free childcare. She needs a kick up the arse. Don’t put up with the verbal outbursts- if she kicks off again tell her she has a month to find alternative accommodation. Honestly, she’s totally taking you for a fool.

DD2 - needs to get a job. Any job, to get some money coming in to start paying you keep money and to start saving to get herself a place of her own. Better to have a job and carry on looking for something better than To sit around doing nothing. While she is at home she should be doing housework and things to help you out.

Wilding
Her dd2 is actively seeking employment and has only been there 2 weeks. Hardly taking the piss.

You need to kick her out. This situation is unsustainable, and causes your DD3 distress.

Write her a letter giving her notice of a month, she can take it to the council.

But she needs to go.

DD1 sounds awful and the situation needs to change.

Has she ever been properly self supporting though? As in, was she only able to live outside of the family home because she was with a partner so shared rent and living expenses etc?

What sort of debt is it - was it robbing Peter to pay Paul, using credit cards to pay rent? Or avoidable debt like store cards of somesuch?

At 28 without a child, a house share would be a viable option but I don't see that happening with a little one.

Is her job well paid or min wage?

If you kick her out can she afford to rent somewhere for her and her child?

She obviously can't stay as you are running out of money and she's unpleasant to live with, but I'm just wondering what will happen. I'm not sure a min wage job could support an adult and a child.

In 2 weeks you can easily have got a job. Temp agencies can sort jobs out no problem. Anything for office work/cleaning/bar work/event staff etc

Time for DD1 to stand on her own two feet.

By the way, I hope you're claiming disability benefit in relation to DD3?

Wilding DD2 has only been there 2 weeks, after escaping an abusive relationship, and has had 4 interviews already. She also helps OP look after her disabled sister, and does housework. She's hardly taking the piss!

how is kicking a daughter rout ever going to help her.she by choice im guessing wouldn't have had to move back.and is probably stressing out over this herself.
as a family you need to join together in these moments and work as a team to support and get to a better place.i cant believe all the people that thinks kicking a child out at this point is ever right.
yes you always have to reach a point where its detrimental living.but that I believe as a mum has to get somewhrre pretty f*ing traumatic for me to kick my child out.and even then if I love them and see in them my good child id work through the trauma with them