MiL Obsessed with DH's Bowels..

[getawfmylaaaand]

DH was recently poorly and had to have a very minor operation. He's perfectly fine and back at work.. however there's still a problem:

For the last 4 weeks, MiL has been calling DH daily to ask about his bowel movements. She demands colour, texture and frequency and any 'anomalies'. Illness was nothing to do with bowels.

She's also insisted on attending every single dr's appointment with DH while I've been at work (DH couldn't drive), so she's been taking him under the pretence of giving him a lift, then following him into the room with the doctor and when DH asked her what on earth she thinks she's doing, she's feigned getting upset and DH hasn't had the energy to make a scene, so she's been in with him . After his appointments, he generally calls me to have a chat about what's been said and I can hear her in the background trying to tell him what to say. It's like 'don't tell her that DH, she doesn't need to know all that'. Then, when we go over for dinner she drops bits about his medical stuff into conversation and waits to see if I react as if I don't already know. It's really really odd.

Worst of all she's shared quite personal medical stuff with a few family friends, to the point where DH had a call from one of her friends asking if he'd tried this particular brand of wooshit snake oil because it had helped loads with her BP apparently .

DH is baffled and quite upset by it all. He's not really communicating with his Mum because he hasn't got the mental energy to deal with her and as a result MiL is incessantly calling and texting me at work etc to find out how he is etc. I've tried to stop this by saying 'he's very well thanks MiL and probably at work, I'll ask him to call you when he has time' but she's not getting the hint at all.

DH also gently suggested to her that she should back off a bit but she got really upset and said "you're my son of course Im worried about you" and that's been the standard response to any nudging we've done.

For full context, we've not wanted to upset her too much because FiL passed away 18 months ago and she's still very fragile. I sort of understand her anxiety but I fele like it's tipping into manipulation.

Any ideas?

OP - I would actually go NC. I have done it myself with manipulative family members, and it really does pay for itself in peace in the long run.

'She's still his mother' is something that gets said by people who are normal, who have never had to confront this sort of behaviour, and have NO IDEA that people can, do and actively want to act like this. You think she is 'grieving', or possibly a little unhinged, or maybe she's just a bit obsessed? She might well be all those, but she may well also be a complete narcissist and you are all just 'bit-players' in HER dramas, HER life, HER whole being. You may well be just there for her amusement and game-playing. Believe me, it happens, and it's happened to me in the same way. At the very least, go LC and keep her at arm's length - she will not stop until she gets every tiny detail that she can pass on as hers; 'look at me and my interesting life! Look at what I know! I'm so great to have such an interesting family...'

I think going NC or even LC would be a major and unkind overreaction. From your later posts, it sounds like this anxiety might well stem from her experiences with losing her husband - she is frightened that symptoms will be missed and she will lose her son as well. This does not, however, mean that she can trample across your lives in the way she has been doing. Grey rock is definitely the way to go and start saying "No" if she wants to come along to appointments etc. and you don't want her there. It isn´t cruel to not give someone everything they want.

I don't think @Wyatt98765's suggestion is callous - it's blunt but clear, and gives her sufficient chance to stop needling for information that's frankly got sod all to do with her before you end the call

It's similar to how you'd deal with a badgering child, and that's how she's behaving.

Perhaps Wyatt is just cutting to the chase after long experience. Sometimes you optimistically think you can manage a person/ situation like this, but when it turns out that you can't and it causes years of pain, you wish you had been firmer or NC much sooner.

And people with anxiety do need boundaries, restraint and to regain a sense of proportion. The distress they feel is real but frequently the danger/ risk is not anywhere near the same, and it helps to (re)learn the difference. Being clear about the rules of what is reasonable and accpetable and what is not, might provoke a reaction, but that doesn't change the rules. Often there is safety for the anxious person in other people's strong boundaries - in the long run anyway!

You will find your way with though I am sure.

flisspaps It is like reverse parenting isn't it! The parent-toddler. Argh!

I think @Wyatt98765 makes an excellent suggestion. You would just need to prepare yourselves that the first few times are going to be incredibly uncomfortable and stressful for everyone. If you hold firm then she will have to stop, but if you give in even once then she will keep trying.

I would probably then continue as normal with whatever telephone/visiting schedule you have as though the situation didn't happen so that she knows she won't get anywhere by continuing. I might also inform family in advance that she is having some anxiety issues and that you're doing your best to help her and suggest that they could also be helpful and calm her down.

Reverse parenting is EXACTLY it.

She does it to me too so it can’t just be because she’s his mum. She likes to know when my periods are she’s not overt about it though, I’ll say I’m feeling a bit under the weather and if I’m not specifc she asks whether it’s ‘that time’ because in the far flung past I mentioned I have difficult periods sometimes.

This is how I know she won’t be on to us about the baby just yet, I asked her for a pad because I came on whilst at her house (she keeps some around for me and her nieces when we visit just in case) last week. The bleeding only lasted an hour or so though and that’s why I tested. Not sure what it was, but docs on Wednesday confirmed I’m pregnant and we’ve got an early scan soon so it will be the last thing she suspects hopefully. Tests are still positive (I’m POAS’ing like an absolute mad woman) and still getting symptoms so hopefully all is well. I don’t want her knowing though because if it’s not all ok I can’t deal with her again.

Just spoken to DH and he’s read the thread, he is very much on board.

She's outrageous imo!

Callous to not want to talk to her about shit & periods??!!

No wonder she keeps doing it because she's not being told to fuck off with her inappropriate intrusive questions!

Good grief, I'm a nurse and would NEVER ask my parents about their bowel movements!

It's possible she is indeed grieving and having health anxiety. The thing is, though, that's not DH's problem to handle. That's hers.

If she calls in a panic, I suggest just telling her everything is fine and that she will be told if there's a problem. If she whines that you've sent her into a panic, then suggest that maybe she needs to see a therapist to learn how to cope.

Congratulations on your expected little one!

I think that your MIL acts very much like my 'D'M.

It's all about HER and how SHE feels in response to family members health issues. It starts off subtle and looks caring, but before you know it all conversations turn to how hard SHE is finding it all, how stressed SHE is with it, and how SHE needs to know EVERYTHING.

I've been grey rock'ing for years. She hates it. She knows NOTHING about my health and I keep details if my life in general pretty light.

Telling her I was pregnant was hard as ideally I'd tell her once the baby was born. Last time I was pregnant I was accused of making it all about me as I refused to respond to her daily texts/emails about the state of my uterus. This caused a huge row where she showed her true colours so was actually quite helpful.

I'm pregnant again and it's been a horrific pregnancy. She knows nothing of this. I'm always 'fine' if she asks. She's starting again with the repeated attempts to gain info from me. I thought she might have learned from last time do it has been insightful to see that she hasn't. It's clearly manipulation rather than any care for my wellbeing. I lower contact significantly, so she ramps it up and tries to send in her flying monkeys (your aunt Betty in your case). However they're growing tired of it too.

I treat her tantrums like I do my toddlers. Ignore. Ignore. Ignore.

Hope you find a way through this and congratulations on your pg!!

You're right tho, she'll be a nightmare GM if you don't set some firm boundaries now.

Have a read of Susan Forwards Toxic parents and Toxic in-laws books. Your mil is very much enmeshed in your lives. Susan Forward has great advice on untying the apron strings without completely severing them. My DM is very enmeshed in my life, she is lovely and I adore her but it was getting too much! With the help of the toxic inlaws book, my dh has spoken to my DM and explained that she was making me unwell with her constantly offloading her relationship issues onto me. DM was not happy at all with my dh but she has stopped, dh has been very protective because he sees how exhausted and drained it made me.

We are NC with dh’s family who were critical, controlling, abusive, chaotic rejectors who were constantly trying to destroy our marriage and we’re deliberately cruel and narcissistic. Despite their awful behaviour, we tried again and again and again, we forgave again and again and again, yet their behaviour just got worse and worse. To the point that I had to say no more to protect my children, my marriage and my husband. We are so much happier and our marriage has definitely improved! It is not an easy option though and shouldn’t be done lightly or without a lot of consideration and support. My dh required significant counselling and he still feels guilt.

There is only one way to handle this - zero information other than 'everything's fine'. Any small piece of information will give her way in to keep asking more questions. No matter how crap you are feeling, just don't tell her. You are absolutely right to tackle this now, otherwise she will be a complete nightmare throughout your pregnancy and beyond. She also needs telling that it is definitely not OK to share your personal medical details with anyone else. She's clearly done that more than once and it is utterly unacceptable. The only way to stop her is to give her nothing to go on.

When Auntie Betty rings could you tell her what MIL actually wanted to know?

-We’re not hiding things from her; she wants to know what Tony’s bowel movements are like and he doesn’t want to tell her.

I’m guessing at this point Auntie Betty will fuck off but if she suggests he really ought to tell her you have one clear line of action.

Have you been to the toilet today Aunt Betty?
What was it like?
And so on and so forth.

When we had been married about two months my MIL asked Is he regular? I didn't know what she meant so she eventually explained and when I said How on earth do I know, she thought I was the devil incarnate.
Reading there pages, not just this post, I am amazed at how people involve so many other people in their lives, I was 70 this year and I don't think that I have ever discussed my health with anyone other than a medical professional, and I only tell them what I want them to know! I have had one or two medical things, odd lumps-like things but I've never felt the need to tell all and sundry, including Himself. Must be a generational thing but reading about the anxiety created through telling people things then they pass it on etc., I'm glad I didn't.
As far as this lady is concerned, use the shortest sentence to MIL, I find that Fine is long enough. Get your husband to ell the GP's surgery that she is not to attend his appointments, they will prevent her, it's actually none of her business, whoever she is.

I think there's more nuance to this than it sounds. I do think the MIL's behaviour is driven by a genuine concern for her DS. Obviously the daily calls are excessive, but perhaps the DH could provide some sort of weekly update to his DM.

Another way to deal would be - if you can - to try and have a chat with the relevant 'Aunty Bettys', whoever they might be. The key family members. This would need to come from your DH, or at the very least both of you:

'AB, we wanted to talk to you in private as we think you might not be aware of the current situation with Mum. She's been behaving extremely oddly since DH was ill so we want you to know that we are dealing with it in the way we think best - as we know Mum will talk to you and we don't want you getting the wrong end of the stick and thinking we are being mean to her. Since DH was ill she has gone overboard with him - insisting on being there for appointments, refusing to take no for an answer if we say that some information is personal and private, she is even calling daily asking about his bowel movements and getting hysterical if DH says that there are things we don't wish to share! It's clearly a grief reaction which we entirely understand but it's been going on for a while now and pandering to it is only making it worse. She's regressed into treating DH like a child and it's starting to damage their relationship. It can't go on and we want you to know that we are trying to establish some boundaries now. Perhaps she needs to speak to someone too. She will almost certainly come to you complaining that we are treating her harshly, perhaps you might be a better person than us to suggest that she maybe asks the doctor for help with her health anxiety?'

Take a pic of your dumps and send it to her for analysis.

Stop telling her stuff. Get a taxi for the medical appointments and just don't let her know that there are any. Just feign that everything is allright and he doesn't need the help anymore.

Or DH tells her to back off, one or the other.

I've been wondering if your MIL's name is Gillian McKeith? She used to like to analyse people's poo on TV.

I genuinely do not understand why this is an issue you weren’t sure how to solve and that you needed a “clear strategy” etc from others. I cannot imagine my husband letting this unfold this and then having to come to me re how to shut this down, let alone the pair of us not being able to think of how to stop it. And talk of getting the GP to set boundaries for him - how are you not just cringing at the thought of asking another adult to um adult for you. I hope you get this sorted now and don’t let yourselves be controlled. I feel angry on your behalf at her behaviour esp re your miscarriage - I had miscarriage before having my daughter. Congrats on pregnancy.

Being “ in charge” of his health gives her a sense of purpose. It’s not that healthy though.
Your dh needs to be gentle and boundRied with her.

My adult son would tell me to fuck off if I tried this, and frankly I would deserve it.

She's clearly got health anxiety (about everyone she loves, not just herself) and yes of course she needs to rein in her intrusive behaviour, but the lack of compassion on this thread from some posters has me .

Her son developed the same symptoms as his father, who then died quite quickly afterwards of that illness, is that right? And you're wondering why she's gone overboard with the worrying?!

I would sit her down (preferably your DH, but both of you if he can't stand up to her), and tell her that you understand that she is worried and wants to be involved, but that her behaviour is intrusive and suffocating. You need to reiterate that you love her, but that you won't tolerate it (like you would with a child). Then stick to your guns.

Nannymcnamechange

I don't think it's a lack of compassion. She's going totally overboard. If she hears nothing for one day she gets herself into a blind panic. That's not normal or healthy. Even if a person has anxiety they should be able to keep it under control or else see a health care professional. It's not OP and her DH's job to manage MIL's mental health.

I think I'd put her in the camp of someone who makes it about her, rather than her sat there biting her nails with worry.

I've got a family member who doesn't even talk, but every time someone is ill or she finds out someone is diagnosed with something, it's all about her, even though I don't think she's overly fussed apart from being able to use this as conversation.

You've had some fantastic advice, I would also say definitely keep the pregnancy under wraps till 12 weeks. If you need to speak to your Mum don't feel guilty, as I'm guessing Mum won't take an advert out in the local paper.

Wishing you all the best.