To think funding new grammar and faith schools is a bad idea.

[ConstantlyCold]

Just that really. This will benefit pushy middle classes (like me) but not the kids that really need investing in.

Stupid idea.

My children would have failed Bertrand's amusing little shoe test miserably, yet all eight made it into the superselective without even a single appeal.

Those squiggle lunch boxes and bags / pencilcases are a leveller at our primary. The cost of those.

Well not really, since the extra money is tied tightly to the social mobility agenda of the school requesting money. The idea is precisely to create more places at already excellent schools for the bright children in disadvantaged families. The idea is to look forward, not back (which is what these threads always do).

Yes, they will have to increase the proportion of PP children in order to get the money.

It seems an awful lot of teachers are labour supporters so whatever the government of the time does or doesn't do, they are fighting against the the teachers on the the ground who will clearly do things thier way unless ordered not to do so.

Why else would any teacher have the audacity to sit and lecture a parent on why 11+ is bad. Instead of saying.. Yes, no, I don't know. The audacity!!

Selective state schools (grammar schools) we need more of to enable brighter pupils to excel and not be drawn into 'non education' issues that comprehensive schools have to deal with.

At my children's grammar school many of the parents are teachers. I wonder what sort of shoe and lunchboxes the children had when in reception....

Technically, primary schools are not allowed to prepare children for the 11+. The whole idea of it being an untutorable test of potential is completely blown out of the water if the Authorities accept that kids can be prepared by schools. In Kent, for example, all a school's 11+ papers could technically be declared void if it was proved they had offered more than 2 familiarisation papers as preparation.

If you think pushy parents are not involved in grammar school intake, have a look at the 11+ forums. They are astounding. Some parents start preparing their children in year 4. Poor kids - they pass the 11+, think they can take their foot off the pedal and then the school starts heaping on the pressure for the SATs

If your parents are teachers your at an advantage before birth.

vimeo.com/227098557
Please if any one has a chance watch this it’s about children taken out of social housing projects and placed in private schools

All the children are bright but poor but the key word here is BRIGHT
And also have the support of their families

For most children being clever on its own is not enough they needs books in the house
Boundaries
Love ect
Family support

But it was the schools who altered the project to whom they thought would do well the teachers just wanted the kids to get a good education no matter WHO provided

Why would you hold a child back to prove a political point this is what really wrong with education

If you think pushy parents are not involved in grammar school intake, have a look at the 11+ forums. They are astounding.

There are some desperately pushy parents on there but I get the impression that their children are at best borderline and many won't get in. Regardless, just as Mumsnet is not really representative of all mothers, I don't think you can assume that the 11+ forums are representative of the parents of all grammar school children.

No, what is really wrong with education is that few people bother to wonder what it's for.

80s exactly!

My dd maths skills are lower than 10 year old dd I can't help her now! But she gets it and barely needs help. I have never helped her with hw.

I have been on 11+ forums. I suppose one may go mad if your local schools are dire. Or if your dc is borderline. Thankfully we have good local school.

It's also this tutoring industry which makes you 🤔 you needs to hours extra every week and myths about the test perpetuated by the left decrying... But no fsm get in.

As I said earlier.. They can't from state primary because they won't help them!

Br has twisted my own suggestion of practise papers, help with nvr and exam technique onto hours of tutoring.. And support.

I don't know what's so hard to understand that in some schools pp child won't even bear the words 11+ because the teacher's think it's a dirty word. How on earth would that child get nearly the test.

Open up discussion, order all state primaries with relevance to be supportive to parents, start some extra classes on test ie... DIY ers.. To simply explain some things.. That alone will help massively!!

Cutting information off from children is a great way to stop them progressing.

^^ the point being the test isn't hard for able child.. It really isn't and many parents don't go mad tutoring.

Rosa-read my post of 17.25

Cutting information off from children is a great way to stop them progressing

Telling them at the age of 10 that they 'aren't academic' is even more effective - yay!

RosaGertrudeJekyll

Amen
My sil got in and barley needed any support because she is very very bright dh didn’t get in then again he also didn’t get into Oxford like his sister dispite coming from the same very affluent background

Faith schools should be funded by their church and not the government. They are all rich enough.

Agreed

Multivac who tells them that?

"Multivac who tells them that?"

Just checking-this thread is about secondary transfer-specifically to selective schools?

The system delivers the message very effectively, Rosa. It's built on the misconception - utterly bought into by many posters on this thread - that some children are 'more suited to an academic education' than others. There's a shred of truth in this after KS4 - but from 11-16, it's nonsense, as increasing numbers of non-selective schools are demonstrating.

Br who decree that only two papers was enough to prepare child for test

They may sit and do two questions in that practise test because they get stuck and noone is able to tell them to do all they know first.... But maybe they would have got 99% if they had exam technique.

Personally I feel a little more help than two practise tests is needed but not much more.

Re reading... Again this should come from the the school.
In dd school they are forced to through the reading levels. Many schools allow them to to be free readers at a certain level.

This alone would have held dd back had she not had access to books at home. A novel reader only given 20 page books!

Now in year 5 she has access to better books in class but her reading supper has come from a home and her school is a good state primary.

Eat - agree! Let them do the brainwashing with their own riches.
Give the spare money to the normal schools.

www.nomorefaithschools.org

For anyone who objects to faith schools, their expansion and 100% selection based on faith criteria, please have a look at this website. You can use a template to send an objection to your MP.