The total collapse of ukip should mean a brexit revote

[jnfrrss]

Seeing that their support has collapsed by over 90% this indicates many have changed their mind on it!

Aibu to say this is a perfect example of why a revote is needed?

It was a democratic result. Get over it

I will never accept that it was democratic.

I will never accept that it was democratic

Well, it was. And it doesn't really matter if you accept it or not.

surferjet Fri 04-May-18 09:53:33

There was a study done a few years back where the BNP manifesto was shown to a 1000 people & 85% agreed with it. They didn’t know it was the BNP’s at the time of reading ( & agreeing with it ) but as soon as they found out who’s manifesto it was they suddenly changed their minds.

Make of that what you will.

I've read election bumpf and thought, 'hmm, that sounds good', then realised it was from the BNP! And no, I definitely wouldn't vote for them.

Their in print stuff comes across as very reasonable. If the party actually stood for and campaigned in the manner of their publications they would be a genuine threat to Labour. However, since they don't . . .

I had an interesting conversation recently with a woman who had lived and worked in Greece for thirty years before returning to the UK a couple of years ago. Her opinion is that the EU will implode, but that the UK leaving has postponed the implosion and that it should mean that the UK is coming out the other side of upheaval just as the other EU countries are hitting it. We shall see.

People in London and the South East live in a different world to the rest of the UK. They've done well from EU slaves who will work for pennies.
The good times are over.
Now we must pay!

I thought UKIP should have disbanded the day after the EU referendum, as they had fulfilled their sole purpose. I knew that if they hung around like a fart under a duvet then they would become irrelevant and lose their core support.
I think the local election results rather reflect a major support for Brexit - even a hard one - otherwise LibDems would have totally cleaned up since they are the only pro EU party.

Op - you are either being deliberately obtuse or you have a very naive understanding of the political climate.

The tories, being in power and having a hard Brexit wing, offer the best prospect of a hard Brexit - that’s why UKIP voters have behaved the way they have

But you probably know that already...

I thought UKIP should have disbanded the day after the EU referendum, as they had fulfilled their sole purpose.

Not really... we haven't even left yet!

Well, it was. And it doesn't really matter if you accept it or not.
It depends on your definition of democratic. Maybe if you were one of the thousands of British citizens denied a vote you wouldn't consider it democratic either.

Maybe if you were one of the thousands of British citizens denied a vote you wouldn't consider it democratic either.

I'd be very surprised if you'd mentioned that if the vote had gone the way you wanted it to 😂😂😂

falang - Why would you think that? I was campaigning to get a vote BEFORE the referendum even took place. Thousands of people were disenfranchised in the referendum. Obviously I don't believe it is democratic to deny people a vote and allow other people to vote to take away their rights. It is surprising to me that so many people do.

Maybe if you were one of the thousands of British citizens denied a vote you wouldn't consider it democratic either.

Who had their voting rights took away?

It pretty much went through many channels before the referendum

www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/apr/28/british-expats-lose-legal-battle-right-to-vote-eu-referendum

fullfact.org/europe/who-can-vote-eu-referendum/

Juggling satsumas

You’re quite the drama queen aren’t you

Voter turnout for Brexit was unusually high

So sorry you didn’t get what you wanted... :)

I don't believe it is democratic to deny people a vote and allow other people to vote to take away their rights

What do you think of those who say people should only be allowed to vote if they are a graduate/middle class/young/intelligent etc? A worrying and surprising number of remainers have made such remarks.

Don't be daft, we are leaving the EU next year so there is no need for a one issue party like UKIP anymore. There is no surge of support for an anti Brexit party and both Labour & Conservatives are happy for everything to progress as is. Its a done deal, get over it.

I think we should pencil in another referendum on the EU for 23 June 2036.

What do you think of those who say people should only be allowed to vote if they are a graduate/middle class/young/intelligent etc?

What should I think about them? That's obviously ridiculous. It also has absolutely nothing to do with what I posted about. The Brexit vote affects EVERYONE with British citizenship yet not everyone with British citizenship was allowed to vote. Disagreeing with this makes me a drama queen? It's hardly dramatic to disagree with your vote being taken away and worrying over whether you will be allowed to keep your job (seeing as my contract specifies that I am an EU citizen with freedom of movement) and whether your EU husband will be allowed to move to the UK in the future - answer: very probably not as we are not millionaires). So yes, it does piss me off when people talk about it being "democratic" but it pisses me off even more when our fears are so easily dismissed as "drama" by people who obviously have no idea what we are facing and what it is like living in limbo while this omnishambles gets sorted out.

The Brexit vote affects EVERYONE with British citizenship yet not everyone with British citizenship was allowed to vote.

Who do you think should have got the vote who didn't?

Ex-pats who haven't lived here for 15 years or are you trying to class EU citizens living here into your British citizenship?

I am talking about British citizens abroad.

Which ones specifically, those that haven't lived here for 15 years?

That was tried through court and failed, any less than that and they could have done.

The courts decided it was a fair amount of time, I guess you don't which is fair enough. But do you have the figures to say it was thousands?

Yes. I know it went through the courts but I disagree with the outcome! The figure is definitely in the thousands but I don't have them to hand. It might not have changed the result (in fact I seem to remember that it couldn't change the result - not enough people even if they were all remainers) but it is the principle! I know a lot of people disagree with giving the vote to British citizens abroad but the fact is some of the people who have been most affected by the referendum didn't even get a say. That is why for me it is not democratic.

I have just looked it up and to be fair it did say that up to 2 million were possibly affected by the outcome.

I see you are essentially arguing semantics, but as a remainer myself, the general feeling and something I agreed with was that is was a reasonable outcome considering they had not lived in the country for over a decade.

I see you are essentially arguing semantics, but as a remainer myself, the general feeling and something I agreed with was that is was a reasonable outcome considering they had not lived in the country for over a decade.

I think that is a reasonable argument for a general election (although it has to be remembered that many countries including the US put no limit on it). However, the referendum changed what it means to be a British citizen, not just what it means to be a British citizen in the UK. For this reason, I see it as fundamentally unfair.

I wouldn't use the US as a base model considering we do not chase our ex pats for taxes, the can hardly deny them a vote can they.

I can kind of agree with you on some level, but there hasn't been a massive outcry from the potential 2 million, only the same handful, so I will suggest that they thought it was a reasonable cut of point as well, which was also the general overall feeling at the time of the court decision if you remember.

As you say it might have made no difference, rather comically we had a significant leave vote from the spanish ex-pats but as I said I think you are just arguing semantics for semantics sake which brings me back to agreeing on some point with your argument.

Juggling satsumas

Been away over 15 years you say? Presumably not paying uk taxes one assumes?

I don’t care. Go play politics in your new host nation