To not find middle class ‘socialists’ laughing at the poor and uneducated very funny.

[Mightymucks]

I’m currently a mature student and am on a lot of FB pages related to my Uni. I need to be on there for news, but an awful lot of the content seems to be middle class self proclaimed socialists laughing at jokes poking fun at the thick unwashed masses who might have the temerity not to slavishly agree with them on every issue.

Take this morning. One of them posted a joke about an imaginary rabid Brexiteer called ‘Sharon from Croydon’ who voted for Brexit ‘because she thinks brown neurosurgeons are stealing jobs she would have been qualified for if she hadn’t dropped out of her hair and beauty NVQ’. Cue much hilarity from these students and lots of comments about ‘thick northerners’ whose capability of engaging with the political process doesn’t extend beyond looking at one slogan on a bus.

I called him ‘a snob’ and he responded that he was ‘calling out racism’ despite the fact that ‘Sharon’ is fictional and therefore doesn’t need calling out. It was just a series of lazy stereotypes designed to stoke predjudice and exactly the thing socialism is supposed to be explicitly against?

A symptom of this in a ward by the Uni near me Labour has actually removed a local candidate with long standing Labour links and huge respect from locals because he is
‘too working class’ for the students to vote for and replaced him with a history academic from out of town.

I should point out that in my working class northern area I don’t know a single person who isn’t aware that Marxism and socialism represents the working classes and the poor and uneducated. But apparently a University education doesn’t extend to teaching that these days.

I also know it isn’t universal in Labour because I had a fantastic female middle aged canvasser around this weekend who was totally clued up on issues of local concern like school funding and libraries and actually convinced me to vote for them.

But AIBU to hate these middle class millennial fuckwits who pretend they’re socialists but are actually massive fucking crashing snobs?

The Tories torn their manifesto up as it appeared fox hunting wasn't a working class voting winner. I agree that this was a shocking miscalculation. I hate fox hunting and I'm a farmer.

Ghost of - you criticised it but never answered my question - what’s wrong or untrue on my above list of examples of labour ineptitude?

Labour pointed out in their manifesto their vision for Britain. The Tories torn their manifesto up as it appeared fox hunting wasn't a working class voting winner.

I desperately hope that you do not accuse others of just reading the daily mail as you have no grasp on the situation at all.

Of my list what is demonstrably wrong? Corbyn has admitted the party has a anti Semitic problem.

Most parties have problems.

indy100.com/article/two-tory-council-candidates-suspended-for-islamophobic-posts-8330866

The Muslim council has called for an inquiry into islamphobia within the Tory party. Can I expect as much outrage as there was with anti semitism? Of course not.

The anti semitism has been denounced, rightly so.

The Labour brexit position is (at best) ambiguous. John
McDonnell raised the run on the pound concern. They did praise the ira - McDonnell has apologised. They did mislead on tuition fees immediately prior to an election.

The Tories torn their manifesto up straight after their botched election. The Tories presided over boom and bust in the 80's and Black wednesday in '92. Economic competence?

I certainly won't be lectured on morality. Hostile environment, windrush, go home vans, Maggie and Pinochet, apartheid.

I desperately hope that you do not accuse others of just reading the daily mail as you have no grasp on the situation at all.

Oh I grasp the situation. May cannot read the political landscape.

www.itv.com/news/2018-01-07/fox-hunting-theresa-may-abandons-manifesto-pledge-on-vote-to-overturn-ban/

Well done ghost of - I think that’s your ‘full house’ of deflection and whataboutery

But but but... the tories!

Your lot will have to be a bit more convincing than that if you ever want to capture vote share outside of metropolitan London...

Ghost you are indeed grim

GhostofFrankGrimes

That ITV article explains May forfeited on one (really stupid) aspect of her manifesto, it does not support your wildly dramatic assertion that "The Tories torn their manifesto up". Please back your statements up with relevant information. Thanks.

Same can be said with opposition, yet you seem to ignore the many elephants in the room and rather play party politics though.

The Tories motto is party before country fgs!

... and if you really want to start on history perhaps you should reflect on socialism (in itself a stepping stone to communism) and the murder and chaos it caused in the twentieth century

This is the creed to which unreconstructed Marxists like McDonnell and corbyn cling to. That is of course, while the likes of Abbott send their children to private school.

After all, all are equal in the court of Stalin...

Well done ghost of - I think that’s your ‘full house’ of deflection and whataboutery

Its no good strutting around when your party spends most of its time, morally, in the gutter.

Please back your statements up with relevant information. Thanks.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4594294/Theresa-tears-manifesto.html

First and only time I'll provide a DM link and say "my pleasure"

... and if you really want to start on history perhaps you should reflect on socialism (in itself a stepping stone to communism) and the murder and chaos it caused in the twentieth century

Reverting to the communist boogeyman.

How did rabid nationalism and the scapegoating of minority groups work out in the 1930's?

Ghostof

Did you read the article? Classic DM use of hyperbole. Theresa May did not tear up the party manifesto, she axed several (very stupid) key pledges. It's right there in the subheading. The pledges deserved to go, no question, but please don't use DM style exaggeration and drama to criticise. It's not necessary - you could've just said "The Tories had to remove several key aspects of their manifesto". But I suppose that's not emotive or dramatic enough for the evil and foolish Tory image you are trying to portray.

The communist boogeyman.

I suggest you read up on the gulag. The Berlin Wall. Famine as government policy. Forced repatriation of entire populations. Repression of political prisoners.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/21/queens-speech-key-points-theresa-may-has-shredded-tory-manifesto/

ok, is shredded a better word? How is the Torygraph on the hyperbole scale?

Do you understand journalism and how headlines work? It's irrelevant which newspaper you select or which adjective they used, a simple read of the article shows that she did not actually tear up/shred the manifesto. She had to remove several pledges and replace them. Not all of them. Some of them. I am not trying to be pedantic but you keep arguing points and presenting what you clearly see as "ta-da" evidence, when it's really not. Also LOL at your "communist boogeyman" comment and attempt at Hitler deflection.

willy I think it's you who doesn't understand how journalism works. Removing pledges and rewriting is exactly tearing up/shredding

CheeseyToast

It's editing

Nope, editing would never suffice. Look, I'm a headline writer, you really don't know your stuff.

I prefer the analogy of shrodingers immigrant. The one that is both stealing your benefits and your job at the same time

This.I've said the same, so many times!

I've had many northern working class people saying racist things to my face and telling me how the foreigners stole their jobs. I'm polite and I take it smiling but the fact is they can't do my job because they ARE dumb and uneducated. We are not even competing for the same level but because they are salt of the earth it is okay to be racist to me?!

im sorry you've experienced racism, all northern working class people? surely your being as equally bigoted.

Three joeys

Replace northern working class in your paragraph with ‘black people’. Then read it back and see what’s wrong with your statement!

the scapegoating of minority groups work out in the 1930's?

Maybe ask Jeremy, he seems to be quite keen on emulating it?

One of my friends did some very broad-brush workings out to compare the violence inherent in national socialism, communism and capitalism over the twentieth century - looking at everything from resource wars to concentration camps to imperialist conquest to avoidable famines. Grim, grim quantification of the unquantifiably horrific. I can't remember the exact details, but his findings were that capitalism was the most violent system by a long, long way. This is NOT for a second to diminish the horrors of the gulags or the holocaust, but to question the presumption that capitalism is a peaceful, benign system.

As Derrida put it:

'"For it must be cried out, at a time when some have the audacity to neoevangelize in the name of the ideal of a liberal democracy that has finally realized itself as the ideal of human history: never have violence, inequality, exclusion, famine, and thus economic oppression affected as many human beings in the history of the earth and humanity Instead of singing the advent of the ideal of liberal democracy and of the capitalist market in the euphoria of the end of history, instead of celebrating the "end of ideologies" and the end of the great emancipatory discourses, let us never neglect this obvious macroscopic fact, made up of innumerable singular sites of suffering: no degree of progress allows one to ignore that never before, in absolute figures, never have so many men, women, and children been subjugated, starved, or exterminated on the earth."