To say no to the 6th Harry Potter book...

[TabbyTigger]

DD is 5. She’s just finished the first five Harry Potter books and, obviously, now wants to move onto the 6th. However from what I and other DCs remember, this one has more mature themes (romance/more detailed deaths) and is generally more complex. AIBU to ask her to wait a year or so before reading it or should I let her try and see how she does?

Sorry OP, I can't comment on the HP books because I haven't read them, but I'm sure you're NBU To say no to the 6th one.

I agree with previous posters who have said that children take different things from books (and tv/films) depending on they're age. My DS occasionally watched Family Guy when he was 3/4, he thought it was a cartoon about a baby and a dog, the rest of it went over his head.

I was an advanced and voracious reader from the age of 5, in a house with few books. As a result my reading matter was very disturbing, much worse than anything that appears in the news. When I got the money and opportunity, I bought books at jumble sales. These were not entirely age appropriate either, mostly horror, Wheatley, Herbert and Poe.

See I don’t believe secretly reading anything is a rite of passage. But that just goes to show that different things work in different households. Neither is more valid!

I agree with this statement Jacques and I don't think it is pompous or PA, particularly in the context of this thread where some can't even get their heads around the fact that a child of 5 can read and enjoy Harry Potter books.

Gosh - I was an early reader but at 5 to read Harry potter , that's young , I think - but maybe I have low expectations. ( rather than having it read to the DC in parts. I read LOTR at 9. ( but not really anything disturbing in the books - well apart from Shelob ) ( And I skipped over the Elvish songs )

You skipped over the Elvish songs?? Whaaaat!? You had such an excellent opportunity to set them to music, too. Such a shame...🤣

Rose white - yes I am rubbish But then of all my (few) talents - setting Elvish songs to music is not one of them - Sorry

OP: have you tried The Very Hungry Caterpillar?

Perhaps an opportunity for Lavendargreen's 9yo - no doubt she's learned Elvish already, given the social circles they move in.

The hungry caterpillar haunts my dreams.

My concern (apart from potential disturbance on the part of the 5 year old, which has already been widely discussed on the thread) would be that if they are over-stimulated by linguistically and narratively complex books like HP and similar then they might lose the ability to enjoy much simpler (i.e. written for younger children) but still very fine books. Books like (for example) the Milly-Molly-Mandy series, Astrid Lindgren's Mardie/Karlsen on the Roof/Bullerby series, Professor Branestawm, Andrew Lang's Green/Yellow/Pink etc fairy stories. This may not be an accurate fear, but I would feel I'd done my DC a huge disservice if they then felt such books were too boring or babyish by comparison when they're anything but.

Oh seriously - I would not worry for OP if her DD genuinely read HP at 5 - it just sounds young to me , but then I do not have a genius DS. We still ( and DS is 21 ) still refer to "one nice green leaf" when we have somewhat over eaten .... . ( but then we also refer to one wafer thin mint )

DS loved the Mortal Engines books - but not at five years old - preferred them to HP - but neither of them would he have read straight through on his own at 5. ( well I must check ) but I don't think so as I recall .

I read Hollywood Wives when I was around 10! My mum didn't know.

My concern (apart from potential disturbance on the part of the 5 year old, which has already been widely discussed on the thread) would be that if they are over-stimulated by linguistically and narratively complex books like HP and similar then they might lose the ability to enjoy much simpler (i.e. written for younger children) but still very fine books. Books like (for example) the Milly-Molly-Mandy series, Astrid Lindgren's Mardie/Karlsen on the Roof/Bullerby series, Professor Branestawm, Andrew Lang's Green/Yellow/Pink etc fairy stories. This may not be an accurate fear, but I would feel I'd done my DC a huge disservice if they then felt such books were too boring or babyish by comparison when they're anything but.

I have worried about this actually - I think it happened to me as a young child, and I think to an extent it’s happened to DD2 (12), because she can’t stand most YA fiction because it’s “not well written” (I’ve taught her not to say that around her friends ).

Luckily DD3 (5yo this thread is about) seems not to have suffered that yet. She loves Milly-Molly-Mandy and Pippi Longstocking - I’ll check out the other Astrid Lindgren ones. She loves Pippi Longstocking.

As I’ve said a few times to reassure PPs - since finishing HP5 she’s read Utterly Me, Clarice Bean, Because if Winn-Dixie, and is (right now) reading the first Ivy and Bean. Hopefully she’ll get hooked on that series and between that and the rest of the Clarice Bean series (she’s still got 2 left + the Ruby Redfort books) has plenty to be getting on with. I think we have 10 Ivy and Bean books!

Lined up after she’s got a few more Roald Dahls, the Thora series, some more Anne Fine, the Molly Moon series, the Little House on the Prairie series, the Definitely Daisy series, and a new Penderwick book is out on a few weeks. Not sure when she’ll be ready for Ibbotson/Streatfield/Roman Mysteries/His Dark Materials/Swallows And Amazons/ Morpirho/ The Hobbit etc so I’ll wait until she displays an interest. I’ve also ordered the pirate series someone upthread recommended!

And the discussion about the news - she absolutely can process the news. She likes reading the newspaper. I don’t let her read/watch uncensored, but she is exposed to knowledge about natural disasters, war (DH often works in war zones, not really avoidable as a topic), news about illnesses etc. Not everything, but the bits I think she can cope with.

You sound like such a snob. There is a whole host of YA fiction that is very well written.

Yes - I know there is. I wasn’t referring to myself - it’s DD who takes issue. She says she doesn’t like the style of “modern” books, no matter how hard I’ve tried to find something for her. She likes Elizabeth Laird, Phillip Pullman, Ali Smith, Neil Gaiman and Harry Potter and that’s it for modern/teen literature it’s a pain because she rejects almost everything DD1 (14) loves!!

Children can be very advanced in certain years. I would , if she loves reading , encourage books which give her advanced vocabulary , but also books which encourage "a plot" ( which may not be so advanced as per age per reading ) & chat to her about the plots. I was advanced in reading ( and you can guess my age from this ) I at age 3 apparently looked at a copy of the Times and said " Mummy " what's Herr Willy Brandt " I could read the words but no real comprehension . Encourage her to read , but if she is going be good at literature ( and I think it is far too early to tell ) talk to her about what she has read. I am sure she is very very clever , but then a friend of mine had a child at 2 or 3 who could recognise all the flags of the world and could do sums. Sometimes it lasts , sometimes it doesn't . OP I do not wish to say your child is not incredibly clever , but some children are very perspicacious at that age. Just encourage her , but , not just in one thing.

Have you tried I Capture the Castle - some adult themes but low key

Actually I say that tongue in cheek - I think I Capture the Castle is too old in themes for a 5 year old , I was being cheeky as she is clearly a v clever child but she could probably read it but I wouldn't recommend it for age 5 or low pre teens. Have you tried Rosemary Sutcliffe, Leon Garfield - sort of grown up childrens' books but as I recall , non too adult themes.

it’s happened to DD2 (12), because she can’t stand most YA fiction because it’s “not well written” (I’ve taught her not to say that around her friends wink).

You should be teaching her to understand the difference between “not well written” and “not to my taste”.

Crucial distinction, SoupDragon, and extremely illuminating.

There is loads of excellently written YA fiction. It is seroiously wanky to say otherwise.

You should be teaching her to understand the difference between “not well written” and “not to my taste”.

I will be sure to, but I know she doesn’t mean it in the way everyone on this thread has taken it. She just doesn’t find modern styles of writing interesting. By “well written” she means written in the way she likes, and doesn’t put the books down around her friends - it’s just a jokey argument she has at home with her sister. DD1 calls DD2’s books stuffy and posh, DD2 calls DD1’s books pretentious and over-written. As she’s 12, I just laugh and buy her books I know she will like. She doesn’t need to develop an interest in modern fiction if she doesn’t want to, just as DD1 doesn’t need to develop an interest in the classics.

12 year olds say silly things - calling her “wanky” is uncalled for.

*I have worried about this actually - I think it happened to me as a young child, and I think to an extent it’s happened to DD2 (12), because she can’t stand most YA fiction because it’s “not well written” (I’ve taught her not to say that around her friends wink).

Luckily DD3 (5yo this thread is about) seems not to have suffered that yet. She loves Milly-Molly-Mandy and Pippi Longstocking - I’ll check out the other Astrid Lindgren ones.*

Re Astrid Lindgren: imo her very best are the Emil series, the Mardie books, The Brothers Lionheart, Ronya the Robber's Daughter, and Mio, My Son. I don't think the Pippi books are among her best (though they are still lots of fun) but for some reason they are the ones most easily available in this country and the only ones that seem to be consistently in print. Amazon marketplace or ABE Books is your friend if you're interested in tracking down other Lindgrens!

I wouldn't personally be too concerned about a 12 year old deciding that she doesn't like certain authors or even genres on grounds of general literary quality. That's literary discernment and personal taste based on her reading experience, not necessarily missing out as such. I don't know about yours but the YA section in our local library is very uninspiring: ours dipped in a few times but found nothing much to interest them (as an aside, I never understood why the librarians' idea of "YA" never seemed to include anything written before about 1998). I think 12/13 can be a very difficult age for an advanced reader because she will presumably already have read a lot of the classic "YA" books which were originally aimed at teenage girls and their experiences, like the Anne of Green Gables series and the Little Women series, but may not quite be ready to make the jump to fully-fledged "adult" literature so it can leave them feeling bored and at a bit of a loss. We found that Regency or Victorian novels, especially those by women, and also the type of fiction usually classified in our library under "minor literary fiction" worked extremely well at bridging the gap because they were absorbing for teenage girls without being overly demanding. So for example Jane Austen, Elizabeth Gaskell, Wilkie Collins, Sherlock Holmes (maybe Maria Edgeworth, Ann Radcliffe or Mary Shelley when she's a bit older) - plus the more entertaining of the Victorian or early 20th century writers like Jerome K. Jerome, G.K. Chesterton, John Buchan and P.G.Wodehouse. My point was more that DD3, being only five, might miss out on a huge number of wonderful, classic children's books and authors just because they might feel too "babyish" if she's used to books aimed at an older readership. But it doesn't sound as if that's happening, or at least not yet.

“I will be sure to, but I know she doesn’t mean it in the way everyone on this thread has taken it. She just doesn’t find modern styles of writing interesting. By “well written” she means written in the way she likes, and doesn’t put the books down around her friends - it’s just a jokey argument she has at home”

I think OP means her 5yo, not the 12 yo one, Galahad.

Serious question. These 5 year olds with advanced comprehension skills and emotional maturity, are they aware of various world events such 9/11, the holocaust, current events? Do they read adult newspapers?

There is a book in the reading scheme they use at DD's school about the Holocaust.

9/11 slightly a moot point because it was before her time; she understands there was a terror attack and many people died. She is aware of current events, yes and has been since she was small. We had to explain about Sandy Hook for example because she read it on a newspaper stand whilst we were driving past. I think its important she has access to current events.

She loves Milly-Molly-Mandy

Great taste - I love Milly-Molly-Mandy

At a similar age, DD loved Little House in the Big Woods so they might be worth a look

I had read up to book 4 by the time the first film came out, when I was 6, as had most of my friends at the time, its not particularly shocking. I remember because my brothers friend had read them in year r and we were all very put out .

I think probably the 6th is too mature, i think it has less of the magic of harry potter and its more boring tbh, but I don't think it will do harm to read it. I always had a principle as a child of reading every book twice, once to get the story and once to understand it. She will read them again I am sure when she is older.

I read Harry potter again when I was about 11 ish before the last book and it was great because the first time was all about the magic and excitement of Hogwarts, but I realised there was things I missed so it was like reading a deeper book. Have read it again as an adult, and trre were things i missed again, all books should be read multiple times anyway of they are good because there are always bits you miss.

You haven't spoilt it for her, I think the best bit of Harry potter is the magic of the first book, thats why it became popular not the 'fantastic themes' of the later books. At the end of the day it's a childrens book.

Also children read books because they have a great story not because they are mature or well written. They will still enjoy younger books with older books as they enjoy the story.
I think the most I ever enjoyed Harry potter was as a young child because then it was just pure magical story, and I could believe it. As I got older I never enjoyed it as much as the first time I read it, although I still enjoyed it, there were plot holes and things I hadn't noticed at 4 or 5