SIL wants her baby to 'catch a tan'

[LocksHear]

AIBU to be fuming?!

She refuses to cover him up and isn't applying any sun lotion. Baby is 10 months.

Apparently no one puts sun lotion on their kid's in her country, and they're just kept out of the sun when it's at its strongest (between 1.30/3)

She's adamant he doesn't burn, and she doesn't. Which is true. But burning isn't the only sign of skin damage by the sun. So is a sun tan. Any change to pigmentation is, isn't it?

I was at the park with her and all the kids yesterday, I made a point of putting sun lotion on all of mine, and made sure I had loads in my hands when I said "Oh I've loads left. Let me do yours. Might as well, loads left "

She was very and said I'd rather you didn't. I didn't know what to say to that. 5 minutes later she claimed to have a migraine coming on and left.

I've been advised to report her to her health visitor but I know she doesn't have one.

My husband is from Italy and they let kids 'tan' although not babies. No one fusses and as far as I know they don't have higher rates of cancer.

I keep mine protected from the sun but I'm considered eccentric .

You're totally misguided putting chemicals all over your kids though. You should use clothing to keep the sun off and if you need to use cream, use a mineral one. Some chemical sunscreens can INCREASE the cancer risk so she was right to get a 'migraine' and leave

Which chemical sunscreens increase the risk of cancer, and why are they still available in the UK if that's a proven issue?

I’m with the school of thought that getting some sun is good for you, but burning is not. I also don’t think it’s good to lather your child in thick sun lotion whenever the sun peeps out.
My children were out playing all day in the garden with no cream yesterday. I was aware and kept checking on their skin and as soon as I thought that they’d had enough sun, they put thin clothes on. They NEED some sun shine without sunblock.
It’s also the kids who get caked in cream on cloudy days who then burn to a crisp through a window.
Back to your post, I wouldn’t be comfortable with you covering my baby in cream. I’d let them have a little sun, then I’d put them in the shade.
Reporting to a health visitor when the child wasn’t even burnt is psychotic and YABVU

I am a northern European living in a sunny climate. When I first moved here I was paranoid about sun exposure for both myself and young DD, and slothered factor 50 on daily, but over time I have come to realise that lack of sun exposure causes far more health issues in more people. Vitamin D deficiency is a major health issue here. So, these days I go out for an hour each morning without sunscreen.

Much like the "fat causes fat" message that was pushed at us for 40 years rather than "sugar", it can be difficult to unteach people. The Australian Slip, Slop, Slap message that has been marketed for many years has pushed vitamin D deficiency to crisis levels. In this article it notes "Emerging evidence has also linked deficiencies in vitamin D to colon, breast and prostate cancer, diabetes, multiple sclerosis and other diseases". Moreover, the most deadly form of skin cancer, melanomia has been linked to UVA and not UVB (which sunscreen protects against). UVA you can absorb through glass which might explain office workers propensity to melanoma mentioned above.

I was very interested in the death rate website which someone posted earlier- here it is to save you searching. Interesting the two green coloured countries in Europe are Spain and Greece - I wonder if this is linked to taking a siesta?

I digress, in the UK, for example, skin cancer death rate is 3.03 / 100k against 15.23, 22.10 and 20.61 for colon, breast and prostate cancers (all linked to vitamin D deficiency). Also from here note that more than half of (the 1818) deaths from skin cancer are in people aged 70 and over.

Just some food for thought. I have to say though, it does seem a little bit barmy to block out natural benefits of sunlight and then take an artificial supplement to add it back. Afterall, too much of anything is not good for you!

Get a little bit of sun people, it won't do you any harm!

Interesting post, Maursh. I agree!

Ansum - to be fair I was caked in cream as a child, and I still burn to a crisp. But that's because of my skin colouring, not the cream. I will never ever tan, my skin doesn't

Why do so many skin cancer organisations still recommend sun screen and don't think that it's the cause of widespread vitamin d deficiency?

Great, informative post Maursh and those links show why this is a discussion worth having.

I also read it was the UVA rays (non burning) that cause the most deadly melanomas hence the problem with sun beds.

We all have to make our own decisions, but based on the huge amount of research I've done (had cancer before so thoroughly researched the vitamin d link and have been involved a study) I will continue to allow myself and my children to get some sun exposure without suncream (I protect my face though) without burning, then seek shade or use cream if we are staying out (I do feel happier using the green people organic cream but that's personal preference

Why do so many skin cancer organisations still recommend sun screen and don't think that it's the cause of widespread vitamin d deficiency?

Probably the same reason why the alcohol limits are set low, they don't trust people to be able to judge accurately what a safe level of exposure is. Sunscreen is a cause of vitamin d deficiency, doctors have come out and said it.

Again, most people are saying exposure in moderation and sunscreen for extended periods in the sun or at peak times. Not that using sunscreen at all is bad

Didn't we all survive as kids without being slavered in lotion?!

Didn't we all survive as kids without being slavered in lotion

RTFT. Several posters above have had skin cancer, FFS.

ask any australian about that...

btw i am in my 50s and was cover ed i n suncream as a kid. and i didnt leave the uk until my late teens .

Fish - no. When I was a kid we had a day in the pool at school, they let me wear a t shirt but nobody helped put suncream on my back. I burnt so badly my entire back was covered in giant water blisters and I ended up in a&e
My mum is v v dark colouring and has never sunbathed but had skin cancer on her upper arm

the plural of anecdote is not data

when i was small no one put sunblock on
...
yes children are getting rickets because of vit D deficiency

Maursh good points.

What leaves me a bit confused is that everyone is so fierce about protecting kids from skin cancer yet I don't see the same engagement when it comes to other lifestyle cancer linked to high amounts of processed meat (bacon, ham, ...) , acrylamide (chips, crisps, ...) . Cancers which are far more prominent.

If you really are concerned as you should be about the health of children and future adults, it would make sense to go all the way and beyond giving them a colourful diet . Maybe the Greek and Spaniards eat tomatoes and other fruit and veg and don't have a soft fifty-shades -of-beige - diet. I moved from Spain to Australia 3 years ago, what kids eat here fills me with horror.

What makes parent put clothes, hat , suncream but not swap crisps for tomatoes, bacon for cauliflower , chicken nuggets for watermelon, and so on?

You know, you can protect yourself from the sun from the inside, right? nutritionfacts.org/video/preventing-skin-cancer-from-the-inside-out/ .

So for all of those high on the sun-phobia to prevent skin cancer, what do you do for the digestive cancers or the hormonal cancers? Why such enthusiasm for one and indifference for the other?

And yes some of you probably have made healthy choices, but the majority will have bacon and ham in the fridge, crisps and other snacks in the cupboard. The evidence is as strong if not stronger of the harm caused by processed meats and ultra-processed food. And there are far more cases of hormonal cancers (linked to obesity) and colorectal (linked to food) than skin cancers. And this is not because skin cancers have decreased (they are actually increasing)

When I see kids at a beach eating fish and chips with a coke, to opening these giant packs of crisps but not a inch of skin uncovered, I just don't get it.

*Just some food for thought. I have to say though, it does seem a little bit barmy to block out natural benefits of sunlight and then take an artificial supplement to add it back. Afterall, too much of anything is not good for you!

Get a little bit of sun people, it won't do you any harm*

I wear spf 50 every single day. I use topical acne creams that make your skin very sun sensitive

Even before I started using them, however, I still wore spf 50 - because I'm vain and UV rays and sun damage cause wrinkles!

I take a daily multivitamin and my vitamin D levels are exactly in normal range.

King

A small amount of processed meat isn't going to do you any harm, it's when you're eating it in large quantities, every day, when the risk comes. And it's only one risk amongst many others.

There is no such thing as burning in moderation though, like you can burn a bit and it won't matter, sun damage is sun damage. It only takes a couple of instances of burning in childhood to massively increase your risk of skin cancer in later life. The equivalent would be saying two slices of bacon in childhood massively increases your risk of bowel cancer in later life, it doesn't.

And I can put suncream on my child and a hat on him. I can't force feed him vegetables if he doesn't want to eat them. I can - and do - offer them, and have offered them to him since I weaned him at 6 months, but if he won't eat them there really isn't much I can do about that. I can, however, put factor 50 on him to reduce his risk of skin cancer. And I can give him Vitamin D supplements, as recommended by the NHS.

I used to live in the states and our paediatrician advised not to put sunscreen on babies under 6 months as the chemicals are bad for them.

I must admit I don’t panic too much about suncream now they are older (youngest 9) but in this part of uk we were wearing coats one day and a few days later it was scorching hot. It can’t be good for skin the sudden shock of the hot sun. So I made mine wear suncream.
I always applied it when they were babies. I know someone who died from skin cancer recently in their late 20’s. Olive skin too

Hmmm, if sunblock is sooooo crucially important, then why is it not available on prescription for everyone? Should people on low incomes and their children just be left to choose between skin cancer and staying permanently indoors in sunny weather?

(runs away. I am a believer in sensible sun exposure with various factors - skin type, time of day, time of year, length of exposure, etc. - taken into account).

I do occasionally put sunblock on my child, but don't actually recall him ever tanning in all the years of his life. This bloody country get so little sun, it's depressing. I was just thinking about it yesterday. In other countries, sunny weather is the norm and rain is the break in normality, so to speak. Here gloom and wet is the norm, and a sunny day is a wonder to behold. :(

This is a difficult one as I’m aware that lots of the European countries don’t think it necessary to put loads of sunscreen on (kids or adults). It also depends on the strength of the sun. When we are in Europe my husband (from an Eastern European country and dark skinned) never wears much if any sunscreen and never burns. When we are at home in New Zealand he has to put it on and does burn. We have much stronger sun here because of the hole in the ozone layer and our burn time in summer is about 5 minutes. The UV index is very high here too and you can definitely burn outside that 1-3 time. I am not sure what the earlier Australian poster was talking about because as far as I’m aware Aussie is the same and also (same as NZ) has a very high indicidence of skin cancer. I am quite fair and always use sunscreen because my father (who had dark skin tone and tanned very easily) died of melanoma which spread to his brain. I certainly do not want that for myself or my kids, so I’ll be using sunscreen (and my hubby agrees). But at the end of the day she’s from one of those countries and its her kids, her choice. So long as they don’t burn and she keeps them out of sun leave it be.

Dairy I'm not overreacting. She is leaving him out well over 20 minutes at a time, in direct sunlight

Wow, 20 mins outside without sunscreen in the UK, call the cops now!

Carpet

A small amount of processed meat isn't going to do you any harm, it's when you're eating it in large quantities, every day, when the risk comes. And it's only one risk amongst many others.

But it is not a small amount. How many hundreds of pounds will a child eat bought or cook by his mother? How many hundred of slices of bacon, how many sausages? Ham? Salami? Pepperoni? Just one sausage a week for 15 years, and bang you have eaten 700 of them. Really not a small amount.

Processed meat is a class 1 carcinogenic to human. Full stop. And here is everyone defending it. Total nonsense.

If it makes sense to protect a baby from the sun, why doesn't it make sense to protect a baby from another cancer risk? Why give a baby a taste he will keep all his life that will put him at risk for cancer.

A toddler will not prefer chicken nuggets over fresh food if he has never tasted it. In the same way you avoid exposure to sun, why not avoid exposure to more cancer risk factors? Why buy it in the first place?
Even easier to avoid than the sun.

Everyone can do as they please and eat all the crap they want. But then avoid going on a high and holy horse about cancer prevention and the sun because it is totally hypocritical . Either you are coherent or you are not.