AIBU to not want to work that hard

[Greentomato82]

Not about SAHM / WOHM but about work generally, men and women alike, DC or no DC. Reading a lot of threads on here people often say they work mainly because they 'want' to work and that it's an important part of their identity etc. I know that some jobs are a real vocation, and obviously we all need money, but surely lots of jobs are a bit meh really and with a lottery win most of us would give it up or at least treat it as more of a hobby? I just seem to hear this more and more, lots about career building and ambition. Frankly I am not going to change the word any time soon and that suits me just fine. I want to rebel a bit and enjoy life. We generally work at least 9-5, 5 days a week for decades to pay the mortgage and bills because that's what we're supposed to do. Those at the top get richer and I can't help but feel like we're gradually being coaxed into a trap of believing our work is more important than it is to justify spending so much time there. I don't like that schools are focused on creating a 'productive' workforce of tomorrow, or that I'm viewed as a unit of productivity and the obsession with GDP. We're not ants surely? Am I the only grumpy one that wants to go off grid and hibernate from all the busy productive people. I'm not lazy but I just don't get it. AIBU?

I never knew there were so many other people who felt this way, me and DH have always felt like outliers by not really understanding the need to work/accumulate/work/accumulate. Working to get by is obviously a totally different thing, but I really don't need or want anything more than we have. Nice to hear we're not the only ones, but also good to hear lots of different opinions too and understand it a bit better.

Will look up that 4 hour week which someone mentioned upthread. Out of interest does anyone know how the Monday-Friday week / 9-5 came about? I would love to understand it more.

Turkkadin we're not in London but fortunately are in a place with pretty reasonable transport links with a bus or train every hour or so and shops near enough. Going further afield is a bit of a mission, do-able on the train, though admittedly not the most fun with DC!

I do think there's far too much emphasis put on performance reviews, targets and "professional development" in jobs that really don't need it. My last 2 jobs are part time low level admin roles, neither has a ladder to move up so to speak. But I still have to have professional development reviews and targets when really there's no need - it's a job, not a career. I have a good work ethic (I think!) when I'm there, I work hard and I'm competent, I just don't see the need to pretend I'm hoping to make a career out of being an office assistant. They know and I know that I applied for the job because it fits in well with having young children, and I will move on when they're older.

MatildaMay I think that story is exactly what I'm talking about.

If someone from a developing country or country with an unstable political situation were to say "Frankly I am not going to change the word any time soon and that suits me just fine. I want to rebel a bit and enjoy life ", I think that people would be up in arms and the post would be in the daily fail ASAP. I think that because all is well so far in Europe (and North America too for that matter) OP, then you can take this approach. If your imminent future were not so sure (peace, welfare state, state pension, energy crisis, etc etc etc) then I don't believe that one would be so casual about the opportunities surrounding them.

Equally and conversely, I agree that we don't all need to be the next sheryl Sandberg, we can be content with modest jobs and incomes. I do believe however that humans were created with an intrinsic need to work, whether on something or for a purpose. We need to work in order for food to grow (simplistically thinking of tiling the ground and planting seeds), but also it is one of our evolutionary achievements, that we strive for enhancement and progress. Often when people cannot work they are unhappy and discontent.

Also, having visited a client in Scandinavia, it's really apparent how much better their balance is.

Men and women start leaving at 3ish to pick up their kids. Both men and women take parental leave, and one woman had 8 weeks left to take - which she could take in the next 10 years! Everyone gets 6 weeks annual leave and they all go on 3 week family holidays in summer. Everyone seems fit, happy, healthy and all have a lot of hobbies, like cycling and DIY.

Downside is it's cold, boring, expensive and rains a lot....bit like here.

Out of interest does anyone know how the Monday-Friday week / 9-5 came about?

Historically people worked 6 days and had Sunday off to worship and rest. In 1926 the Ford Motor Company switched to a 5 day week as they thought people could do the same amount of work in 5 days instead of 6, because they'd be less tired and motivated to work harder. Subsequently it was adopted as standard.

MustBeThursday "I do think there's far too much emphasis put on performance reviews, targets and "professional development" in jobs that really don't need it"

oh so much this. It creates work for senior HR types and creates stress for those of us lower down the ladder.

The reason I'm here a lot at the moment is I negotiated a really good redundancy package and will be restarting at the same place on higher pay.

this sums up the insanity of the workplace but also my parents Disapprove of what I have done. I actually consider it the only time I've been able to master workplace insanity and politics and am quite proud that for once in my life I managed to play this game and actually win.

I have lived frugally and planned early retirement since I was about 25 and realised all workplaces are the same and fundamentally shite and if not, at risk of change all the time - so I planned to retire by 50. I now hope it might be earlier if I can leave London before the prices drop but I do plan to stick around to help care for my olds so not sure how that will work out.

I see work and systems more as modern day slavery.
You want somewhere to live you save a deposit then get a mortgage then your a slave to the bank until it’s paid off.
Slave to the government paying taxes
You want stuff you are a slave to consumerism nice car nice stuff you either save so your a slave to yourself or take credit slave to the lender.
And the government promotes this making laws to stop you living a simple life and just making what you need to survive.
It’s always been that way you work for someone they will make money out of you hard work your a slave to them because you need them be it like in the old days working on a farm or in service in a big house or for a manufacturer you work to get money so your a slave to that money
We’re all in the same treadmill and it’s hard to get out. One day we will be free to live the life we want to live but while we all want stuff you will never be free.

I know slavery is looked at differently now and is classed as forcing people to work for next to nothing but really what it the difference? If you don’t like your job doesn’t that feel like slavery?

Just my take on the whole work thing

@fuzzyduck1 "And the government promotes this making laws to stop you living a simple life and just making what you need to survive."

what laws are you thinking of?

I would definitely not compare work to slavery on any planet btw, I'm quite stunned by that comparison.

I do always enjoy listening to Willy Moon "working for the company" before work. Gets some of my irritation out before I arrive.

I'm laughing at the references to Scandinavian workplaces. The first thing to remember is that they often start work at 7am so they can leave at 3pm. They still work a 35-40 hour week.

The other part to remember is that the high tax rates and culture of no one bettering themselves results in zero rewards for working harder. DH, being Danish and working for a Danish employer, has been treated appallingly in the past. The company is slowly falling apart because everyone works 35-40 hours a week just doing work that falls into their 'box'. DH thought about paying people bonuses but as they are taxed at 80% it really isn't worth it. Instead he pays for them and their family to go on holiday, with flights and a stay at an all inclusive resort. There are quite a few Danes living abroad because they want more and they want to 'better' themselves and their family. I always laugh at how they all put their DC in the expensive private schools here. The public schools are very good where we live.

As it is I was very focused on making money from university through my early 20s. I was very good at it and managed to create assets of £1.5m or so back then. Since that time I've been able to manage those assets and today they are easily worth £6-7million.

I don't have a flashy lifestyle. I take the bus to work, pack lunch and fly economy. We have 2 DC with ASD which is what drives me to work hard. I have to earn enough to keep everything running should something happen to DH. Where we live is extremely expensive and moving means we wouldn't have access to the resources we need for our DC. I'd love to return to the UK but the resources are so very lacking compared to where we currently live.

As much as I think work is bullshit and as much as I think the government and society manipulates us into thinking it’s somehow worthwhile (look at want2be who never misses an opportunity to talk about how much money she has, as if anyone, especially on this thread, cares), comparing it to slavery is ridiculous.

Ouch.

Yeah showing off about millions is completely unneccessary, what a stealth boast.

If you want to make tonnes of money I agree that Scandinavia isn't the best place for you.

However, if you want greater equality between the sexes, to continue in an interesting job post children and better work life balance, it sounds like a very good deal.

I don't think it's ridiculous to compare certain work to slavery. When you have requirements for a certain number of hours to be worked to qualify for benefits and working those hours doesn't result in achieving a certain minimum standard of lifestyle, I think it's very much parallel to slavery.

step Don't know about you but the reason I work is for the money I earn which enables my family to have things we couldn't otherwise afford. Your DC might eat a normal diet but my DS needed extensive feeding therapy to learn how to chew. Yes he could suck and swallow but chewing was something that wasn't inate for him. I take huge pleasure in watching him eat an apple.

Laurie There isn't the equality between the sexes that people think exists. It's a very sexist place actually.

The laws that say I can’t do what I like when I like without permission

I know slavery is looked at differently now and is classed as forcing people to work for next to nothing but really what it the difference? If you don’t like your job doesn’t that feel like slavery?

Erm, I imagine it feels pretty fucking shit, but slavery felt like knowing your children could be sold away from you at any time never to be seen again, or that you weren't allowed to read and write, or that your owner could kill or mutilate you with impunity. I'm not saying what you describe isn't totally shit, it is, but there's quite a big difference between shit and chattel slavery.

@TinaTop

I'm sorry to hear your career plans didn't work out. I didn't mean any offence by the term 'career-minded' but can see how that comes across as unfair for those who didn't have the opportunities to succeed in their preferred career. I hope you've enjoyed how things worked out for you, even if it is different from your initial plans.

@fuzzyduck1 "The laws that say I can’t do what I like when I like without permission"

erm, I was hoping for something more specific to your remark about not being able to make just enough to live on.

@Want2bSupermum

Oh dear sounding a bit smug there...

I agree with a lot of what's been said.

But

There seems to be an assumption that the only way to make money is to wait for somebody else to make the job for you so you can go and ask politely for it, then do whatever they say forever more. It's a very passive way to engage with the world of work and if you wait for everybody else to tell you what to do chances are at some point you are going to feel trapped and fucked off.

You can make money by choosing to engage in things that interest you. It may take a long time to make any sort of good money but at least your work is something you enjoy and are good at.

I hate work. I work 37 hours a week for minimum wage in a job that bores me to tears. Every other week I only see my kids for an hour each day due to my shifts. It just depresses me to be honest.

I'd maybe feel different if I had a job I was actually interested in doing.

@Spaghettijumper "It may take a long time to make any sort of good money but at least your work is something you enjoy and are good at."

it might take ages or forever to just pay the basic bills and have no emergency money, which doesn't work well when you get sick etc.

That sort of thinking is for people with family money behind them or other income streams, the average 18 year old cannot really do a lot with this information, even if just renting in a grotty houseshare.

Spring - it's possible to work in a job to pay the bills and to build up the job you want to do on the side, if you're motivated enough. None of the people I know who own their own businesses (including me) had any family money behind them.