Repeal the 8th

[SnowWhitesRestingBitchFace]

So DH and I are currently visiting my DF and DStepM in Southern Ireland (where I grew up).

Just answered the door to a couple who are looking for support in the referendum and wanted us to pledge that we would vote no.

No for context I am just 6 weeks away from giving birth to DC3 (so clearly very heavily pregnant) and they still had the audacity to argue with me when I said I didn't agree with them and I supported any woman's right to decide what happens to her body.

They started trying to show me pictures of 10 week old babies in the womb (not necessary obviously in the circumstances) and weren't pleased that I didn't agree with them given that I'm carrying a baby myself.

I'm sorry I don't really have an actual AIBU I just wanted to rant a bit and show support for the people who have to face this absolute shit every day until the referendum. We're going home to the UK on Thursday so I won't have it all thrown in my face anymore but I just think the guilt tripping is horrendous 😞

"And I am leaning to a no vote and this is the last time I'll post about it, I don't appreciate any side pushing their views so hard."

Removing choice from those who want it, seeking to legislate to deny that choice, there is NOTHING that pushes views harder than that.

Katie, Lucia has as much right to be here as you. She has been delicate and respectful. You are affording her the same courtesy. Resorting to offensive will not get you what you want and it is unbecoming and inappropriate.

Don't make assumptions about the way others will vote. We don't all force our opinions on others insisting there is only one way and it is our own.

NeedAGoodBook

"Removing choice from those who want it, seeking to legislate to deny that choice, there is NOTHING that pushes views harder than that"

Not even a sentence. NeedToReadABook?

Lucia spain i'm with you on this - I got an email to say there had been more posts on this thread and thought im not getting keyboard bullied due to an alternative view.
Ridiculing and pushing views on others is a way to ensure it won't go your way. That is a serious problem for the yes side as is the media bias.

Sabina died of sepsis because of her pregnancy that couldn't be ended!Had it have been she would be here now.
I live in Ireland rural, I really worry for the yes campaign.There are lots of women saying nothing/undecided because they don't want to say they will be saving the 8th.I fear the polls are so Dublin centric that the quiet undecided could save it.
I can't vote as it's a referendum my dh will have to vote for us and my daughter.
They love to bang on about how far Ireland has come but the views of alot of people here like the handmaid tail.
I drive to work I see ten posters telling me the UK kill babies,with fliers through my door about how the birth of down syndrom will drop (total fiction)and a billboard being driven around the town .
My ten year old asking me why do we want to kill babies.
It will be a miracle of it gets through.

Lucia has as much right to be here as you. She has been delicate and respectful

A no vote is neither delicate nor respectful. It is fundamentally neither.

You don't need to have an abortion to treat sepsis adequately.

No you don't but the progression from sepsis to severe sepsis to septic shock can be very, very quick. If she had been given the abortion she asked for, the infection of the foetal membranes would probably not have resulted in the septic shock that killed her.

What about Michelle Harte, a woman with cancer who had to travel to the UK for a termination? Doctors had advised her to terminate the pregnancy but were unable to do so as there was no ‘immediate’ risk to her life'. It took the hospital 2 weeks to make that decision. It took a further 3 weeks for her to get the abortion as she had to get a passport. Over that time, the cancer spread to her brain and she ultimately died as a result of the 8th amendment.

Radyward

Agree completely. The bullying here and the insults are disgraceful.

I prefer not to share the way I vote, to respect a difficult, sensitive and complex issue... but I believe I am being insulted and attacked by someone who wants me to vote the way I already planned to.

The onslaught of abuse does make me wonder who I am potentially aligned with. It isn't a yes or no issue as many have pointed out, even if it is a yes or no vote.

Vote with your own feelings and experiences, if we all do that and can respect each other as we do, we can have a conversation and learn. All this shouting is ridiculous.

I honestly don't even know what to say after reading some of these posts 😞

The 8th amendment has killed women. Dr Peter Boylan said that: "Savita would have been offered a termination in any other European country except for Malta. She'd be alive today if she was in another country or if the 8th amendment had already been repealed." Michelle Harte was another woman denied an abortion which delayed her cancer treatment. Her doctor Louise Kenny saidL "It is an outrageous lie to say that the 8th amendment has never changed medical management or adversely affected the outcome of a woman with cancer. I have personally witnessed care denied to a woman with cancer because of the 8th. She died.

Are you saying the head of the national maternity hospital knows less than you?

I also have a serious problem with unrestricted abortion up to 12 weeks. Most European countries allow abortion up to 12 weeks, the exceptions are the UK 24 weeks and in cases of severe disability abortions can be carried out after 24 weeks , Netherlands 22 weeks , and sweden -18 weeks.
So im sure women will still go to the Uk after week 12 . It is not going to end that travel to the UK outright.
Malta has a total ban on abortion

Actually the thread title starts with Am I Being UnReasonable?

So yes you are.

Do you know this?

^the United Nations Committee Against Torture, the pre-eminent UN body with responsibility for monitoring states’ adherence to the United Nations Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment conducted its second periodic review of Ireland’s implementation of the Convention. The Committee expressed concern at the “severe physical and mental anguish and distress experienced by women and girls regarding termination of pregnancy due to the State policies”. This wide-ranging critique of State policies is not limited to particular social groups or pregnancies in only certain circumstances*

The united nations calls it TORTURE. A no vote calls for the continuation of the torture of women, a continuation to discrimination and violation of fundamental human rights enjoyed by the citizens of every other European country except Malta.

You wonder who you are potentially aligned with by voting yes? Well voting no puts you with Irag, Iran, El Salvador Afghanistan and Uganda. It aligns you with the Taliban and the Catholic Church. It aligns you with Dana, Michael Healy Ray and Crystal fucking Swing.

whosafraidofabigduckfart

When I was in high school we were shown a pro-life video, with an abortion in as much shocking horror as possible. Girls and boys ran out of the class and were traumatised. This was a catholic school. Telling adult students what a condom is was against the rules, but graphic traumatisation was acceptable. Well, the parents were furious of course, but it was considered an acceptable thing to tell young adults to think.The behaviour undermines the conversation... because it is not a conversation, its "agree with me or I will personal insult the very core of your humanity".

I am leaving this thread due to the vitriol. Its my right to choose which way I vote. Why dont posters respect that ?

Just curious to know how others are dealing with the anti choice brigade. I'm really sad to say 2 of my good friends are voting no and while initially I respected their opinion the more time passes the more I feel my view of them is now changed. I don't respect them the way I did. I just can't understand how any woman would vote against this. How are others dealing with this?

I know what you mean. I feel like this about my boss.

It's not a case of respecting somebody else's view on abortion because the vote is about CONTROLLING what OTHERS do.

It is very wrong to seek to control other people without knowing their lives and I can't get past that either.

I see a few posters have a problem with unrestricted abortion up to 12 weeks. But if you agree that a rape victim should have access to an abortion I'm not sure how you could legislate for that. Let's say she finds out she is pregnant at 6 weeks, I'm not sure what kind of process could be completed in a 6 week window that would prove that a rape had taken place.
I think most people accept there are grey areas where abortion (or the right to choose) is the right course of action, but it impossible to legislate for every scenario. And really, who are we to stand in judgement. If you admit there are grey areas then the 8th has to go. Trust women to make the right choice for them.

"I am leaving this thread due to the vitriol. Its my right to choose which way I vote. Why dont posters respect that ?"

It shouldn't be up for a vote!!

What if other people voted on what you got paid. Voted on what job you could accept. Voted on which child got medical care?