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AIBU?

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Original poster

Repeal the 8th

891 replies

SnowWhitesRestingBitchFace · 10/04/2018 20:30

So DH and I are currently visiting my DF and DStepM in Southern Ireland (where I grew up).

Just answered the door to a couple who are looking for support in the referendum and wanted us to pledge that we would vote no.

No for context I am just 6 weeks away from giving birth to DC3 (so clearly very heavily pregnant) and they still had the audacity to argue with me when I said I didn't agree with them and I supported any woman's right to decide what happens to her body.

They started trying to show me pictures of 10 week old babies in the womb (not necessary obviously in the circumstances) and weren't pleased that I didn't agree with them given that I'm carrying a baby myself.

I'm sorry I don't really have an actual AIBU I just wanted to rant a bit and show support for the people who have to face this absolute shit every day until the referendum. We're going home to the UK on Thursday so I won't have it all thrown in my face anymore but I just think the guilt tripping is horrendous 😞

OP posts:
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12
Tringley · 11/04/2018 23:14

And a big thank you to everyone who has donated. Hopefully you have helped us to change this awful, awful law.

theymademejoin · 12/04/2018 00:06

@OVienna - Could that be the slogan for the pro choice movement:

It's a bit too dismissive to be effective, I think. What's needed is relaying of the hard cases to sway the waverers.

There was a doctor on the radio this morning who spoke about a woman who was on a cancer trial that appeared to be working. She got pregnant. Because the rules preclude pregnant women from taking part, she was removed from the trial. A termination was not allowed in Ireland as the risk to her life was not real and immediate. She went to England for a termination but the delay in getting that termination meant that by the time she got back on the trial, it was too late and she died.

That is a woman's who died because of the 8th amendment.

Rollonweekend · 12/04/2018 00:19

You lost me at Southern Ireland (you do realise that is not a political state?)

squoosh · 12/04/2018 00:25

You lost me at Southern Ireland

What a shame you're so easily distracted.

Original poster
SnowWhitesRestingBitchFace · 12/04/2018 00:32

Thank you @squoosh

I honestly didn't realise it was such an issue. I lived here over 20 years and it has hand on heart never been something that anyone I know in real life had an issue with. I'm incredibly sorry if it's offended anyone but it's getting a bit ridiculous now.

OP posts:
Blackbirdblue30 · 12/04/2018 01:06

For anyone in Dublin- there are quite a few illegal a4 paper posters stuck to lampposts. They compare having an abortion to being Hitler and commuting genicide. They're stuck on with wallpaper paste and as they're obviously damp from the never ending winter, easy to remove. Keep an eye out.

BlueSapp · 12/04/2018 01:35

Tringley it’s the same up north, you have these ones preaching in the street middle of a Saturday in a busy shopping town so loads of small children around with posters of abortions and dead babies saying this is what your letting happen, it’s so totally inappropriate

BlueSapp · 12/04/2018 01:38

Rollonweekend well your a delight Confused

antiAlias · 12/04/2018 02:49

@Trinity66

"[misogyny] answers why you think Abortion will not go through but not why gay marriage went through?"

Yes. Who is abortion 'for' most of the time?

The bible (and therefore its followers and those who preach from it) see us as a group which need to be subjugated even more than men. Little more than property which can breed.

@DownWithThatSortofTing

I don't live in England - not even the right continent - and I find it offensive that you call Derry "UK".

Yes. Your comments make me think you are very backwards.

@StripySocksAndDocs @Doryismyname @EightdaysaweekIloveu

I made a mistake. 40% of Catholics go to church once a week but they are nearly 80% of the country. This is an average across the country with much lower numbers in urban areas.

European Social Survey so accurate.

Slievenamon · 12/04/2018 09:12

I don't live in England - not even the right continent - and I find it offensive that you call Derry "UK"

But it is actually in the UK. That's just a simple fact, It can't be offensive.

40% of Catholics go to church once a week but they are nearly 80% of the country

That is simply not true. It just isn't. Ask any single person in Ireland if that is true.

LaurieMarlow · 12/04/2018 09:21

That is simply not true. It just isn't. Ask any single person in Ireland if that is true

That's what recent, highly regarded survey data says though. And that's a lot more accurate than a straw poll of ones social circle.

I'm not pointing that out because I like it, but because it's fact and it's pointless to deny it.

Slievenamon · 12/04/2018 09:34

That's what recent, highly regarded survey data says though. And that's a lot more accurate than a straw poll of ones social circle

People lie to surveys, they definitely lie on the census. I'm not talking about my social circle, I'm talking about the churches being near empty across the country.

LaurieMarlow · 12/04/2018 09:40

ESS data, an RTE poll referenced in the link above, plus a privately commissioned nat rep survey I've seen at work, not yet in the public domain all put the figure at around 40%.

Survey data isn't 100% accurate of course, but across 3 difference studies that paints a fairly consistent picture for me. Data is a part of my job and the additional survey I've seen in work uses the most accurate methods in the business (face to face questioning, plus additional checks).

But believe what you like.

Slievenamon · 12/04/2018 09:44

I'll believe what I see. And I'm not sure I'll take any stats from the pp above who was deathly offended that someone correctly said Derry was a city in the UK!! Grin

I'll look into the data and see what it actually says, but I'm incredibly sceptical and I think anyone who actually lives in Ireland would be.

One of the links given says that Ireland is still a very religious country because what? 70 odd percent of people identify as Catholic? But they fail to appreciate the huge difference between being Catholic as a culture and Catholic as a religion. Most people tick the catholic box on a form but they don't attend church, don't beleive in the religion and it doesn't inform their daily lives at all. They mean Catholic in the same way they mean Irish.

Trinity66 · 12/04/2018 10:00

Last week they put their leaflets into toy catalogues that were distributed door to door in Dublin.

That's disgusting

Trinity66 · 12/04/2018 10:02

I honestly didn't realise it was such an issue. I lived here over 20 years and it has hand on heart never been something that anyone I know in real life had an issue with. I'm incredibly sorry if it's offended anyone but it's getting a bit ridiculous now.

It isn't offensive at all, tbh when I read your OP I didn't even notice, I'm used to seeing people post it alot from being on UK forums. Ok we don't really say it over here but I don't see what's offensive about it

BertrandRussell · 12/04/2018 10:02

“Most people tick the catholic box on a form but they don't attend church, don't beleive in the religion and it doesn't inform their daily lives at all. They mean Catholic in the same way they mean Irish.”

So, culturally Catholic. With the centuries deep conditioning that entails......

Slievenamon · 12/04/2018 10:03

yeah its no offensive its just wrong, and slightly irritating.

Slievenamon · 12/04/2018 10:04

So, culturally Catholic. With the centuries deep conditioning that entails

Depends what you mean by that. The centuries of deep conditioning that gave us the first popular yes vote in the world on gay marriage? The centuries deep conditioning where we threw off the yoke of the church over the last 50 years and how almost no-one pays the slightest notice to church teachings anymore?

Trinity66 · 12/04/2018 10:06

One of the links given says that Ireland is still a very religious country because what? 70 odd percent of people identify as Catholic? But they fail to appreciate the huge difference between being Catholic as a culture and Catholic as a religion. Most people tick the catholic box on a form but they don't attend church, don't beleive in the religion and it doesn't inform their daily lives at all. They mean Catholic in the same way they mean Irish.

Yep 100% It was actually only in the last few years that I started ticking no religion in the census form, I was never religious just born into that religion, never went to mass (except for weddings/funeral etc) and I don't believe in god, it was just habit to tick Catholic, pretty much most people I know just tick for that reason too

theymademejoin · 12/04/2018 10:09

@Slievenamon - I'm talking about the churches being near empty across the country.

That's not the case where I live. I live in a pretty affluent village that has a high population of blow-ins and is on the outskirts of a large urban centre. The church is packed every sunday. Another village nearby, with similar demographics, is the same.

OhCalamity · 12/04/2018 10:14

Please, mumsnetters, share the link for funding the Repeal side far and wide as you can. If you are an Irish citizen, or living in Ireland, or if you know an Irish person you would like to give an unspecified cash gift to you can donate.

crowdfund.togetherforyes.ie/

BertrandRussell · 12/04/2018 10:18

“Culturally catholic” in the “Let’s all show what liberal party animals we are and thumb our noses at the oldies by voting for equal marriage- that’ll show them” but “Ooh, abortion, that’s a step too far, not sure about that at all” kinda way.

antiAlias · 12/04/2018 10:18

@Slievenamon

"But it is actually in the UK. That's just a simple fact, It can't be offensive."

Do you know nothing about the history of Northern Ireland (and I don't even like saying that)?

Do you think telling a black mother that her children are far more likely to commit crime than a white mother's children is inoffensive? Do you point at every Muslim man boarding a flight saying "he's 87.4% more likely to bring down the plane than I am"?

If you really can't understand the nuance of offence and fact then you aren't worth engaging with.

I tell you what, I will give you this year's salary (nearly £150,000) if I can video you walking around Derry for an afternoon telling everyone that Derry is part of the UK.

"[

deadringer · 12/04/2018 10:19

I don't put a lot of faith in statistics or surveys because they are often unreliable sources of information. 'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics'. Going on the figure above (40% of nearly 80% of the population) the figure is less than 32% which is still too high imo. I can't do links (old gimmer) but I just found an article in the Irish independent that states that a parish that attracts 15% of it's Catholic parishioners to mass is considered to be doing well. In Dublin attendance in some areas is as low as 3%, in wealthier areas slightly more. Believe whatever figures you like but to dismis the evidence of people 'on the ground' as it were is a bit offensive imo. It has to be remembered too that there are Catholics who are pro choice, and atheists who are not. Abortion is something that the nation is divided on though, outside of religion. Snowwhite I occasionally say southern Ireland too, growing up any time I went abroad I was always asked if I was from the north or south and I got into the habit of saying south. No big deal surely.

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