To want a home birth?

[InMemoryOfSleep]

I’m not pregnant (yet), but chatting to my mum and some friends recently I mentioned I’d like a home birth next time. Their reactions weren’t positive, to say the least - despite me explaining that, for a 2nd baby, home birth is as safe as an MLU, and both are safer than a hospital. They’ve made me really doubt myself - having read the research and stats I was convinced it’s the best option, but am I missing something?!

I don't think anyone has said the risks are the same!

Also I would rather not have the longer recovering time of a C section too. But that is why it is all about choice for a woman. They can weigh up their own options.

And as you previously said, isn't the outcome a health baby, so if you are going to stick to this then surely all that matters are the stats are exactly the same in both scenarios or level of mortality and serious complications.

Risks aren't the same but they are the same level of seriousness.

Also I would rather not have the longer recovering time of a C section too.

I’ve heard many say this. I can only speak for me, but by day 2 I was fine. Day 3 I was in my prepregnancy clothes and walking normally, no one could even tell I’d had a baby. Stopped all pain relief the next day.

Whereas people who had VBs had stinging fannies for weeks. So, longer recovery wasn’t my experience.

Yes. But I still think it’s better to at least have the chance of fixing a complication.

VBs had stinging fannies for weeks I can also only speak for me, despite having to need stitches (due to unnecessary forceps delivery that went completely against what I wanted, I was held down whilst I was screaming) I was up and walking around that day with no pain relief and in my pre birth clothes.

Every woman is different and everyone has their own experiences. Which is why you can only base your choices on stats and how you feel personally rather than scary stories because I am sure we are all full of these.

However because of this, I do think it’s somewhat irresponsible to not be in hospital. Personally I wouldn’t give birth anywhere that didn’t have an attached NICU.

I acknowledge these views are coloured by my experience, and this isn’t a common thing, but I don’t think it’s wirth the risk.

You seem to be making a lot of assumptions about other people's choices, despite saying that you know your experience isn't common.

You are also totally disregarding the posters, like myself, who have pointed out that in some cases the risk is going to hospital...

Twin pregnancy. High risk. Presented in labour. Ignored and stuck in a room at the end of the corridor. Buzzer ignored numerous times. If either of my babies had been in the trouble your baby was in then they'd have died in that hospital. No-one came near, despite numerous requests, to even look at me until my first baby was crowning and my grandmother screamed at them.

Next pregnancy is a singleton. Low risk. Choice is same hospital (whose reputation is getting worse), MLU (poorish reputation for low staff numbers, but better than the hospital 30 mins from hospital) or home birth with 2 midwives 7 minutes from hospital.

Seriously, what would you have done? And, no, you can't magic up your experience. The hospital we have is the one we have. Where in that am I taking the risk? Where in that am I endangering my baby to be "woke"?

Where in that, or in any of the stories that people have told on this thread that have been repeatedly ignored, is the anything that says anything other than women doing exactly what you did - choosing the best option for them and their baby from what is available?

Every woman is different and everyone has their own experiences. Which is why you can only base your choices on stats and how you feel personally rather than scary stories because I am sure we are all full of these.

I do agree with that. I’m sure there are scary stories for each method. I remember feeling like I was picking my execution when deciding because of that.

I think I’d feel more comfortable with it if transfer times were assured, and there were more staff on labour wards too.

Yes, well, day 3 I was in my pre-pregancy clothes too and walking normally, despite a small tear after the first birth. So what? Some women don't recover easily from either a VB or a CS. You appear to be arguing that because you had a good CS Violette that this must be the gold standard and you don't understand why everyone doesn't have one. Others have an easy VB and don't understand why on earth anyone would chose a CS, but usually we stay schtumm and think, well not my choice, but if that's what that woman wants, she knows her own health and it's up to her to weigh the risks.

‘Whereas people who had VBs had stinging fannies for weeks. So, longer recovery wasn’t my experience.’

My friend had a c section and got an infection and it took her weeks to recover. I had a VB and I was mobile straight away and standing up having a shower a couple hours after giving birth (Midwife didn’t advocate this but she wasn’t ge one whose been laying strapped to a bed for 23 hours). I had mild second degree tear and stitches but it healed fast and want half as bad as I thought it would be and I was relieved I didn’t have to be cut open as it came close. My pelvic floor is really strong and I’ve been very lucky in any respect.

The truth is we all have different experiences and any birth method can go wrong. There are positive and horror stories about all birthing choices. Everything comes with risks and it just depends what risk you’d prefer to take over others.

Lala honestly in those circumstances, I don’t know. I’d never want to go to the negligent hospital so I understand that, and it sounds like your choice was limited.

I’d probably opt for an ELCS like I did anyway for numerous reasons but obviously that is not for everyone, and other than that it sounds like you would have had more individual care at home (which says something about the hospital).

the one who had*

wasn’t*

picking my execution and that is exactly what is wrong with a few posters on here, saying how could women who choose HB live with themselves if anything went wrong. Well no woman should be made to feel like it will be her fault because it can't be when stats are exactly the same and the UK rates are so amazing in either scenario.

When stats are the same for both scenarios then women should be supported to choose whichever birth they want without feeling any guilt or being scared of "what if".

I don’t think it’s her fault if it goes wrong. You choose what you need based on the info at the time.

I just worry low risk is assumed to be risk freez

Free that was supposed to say

I just worry low risk is assumed to be risk free

I think that people see hospital as risk free when it isn't. There is always risk associated with birth and people seem to think by going to hospital this is somehow eradicated.

The difference being, there are a whole team of experts, so somebody should be able to pick up on something.

However, there's no point in all that stuff being there if you arent being monitored properly by the midwife.

All the machines and experts in the world won't help you if no one detects something is wrong. Which is why good midwifery is your first (and most important) form of defence. Which is the point you seem not to engage with, with all your talk of incubators and anesthetists.

My acquaintance, who I talked about unthread was in a hospital, with all the equipment and back up you have referenced. Her baby was born severely brain damaged because of inadequate monitoring. The first line of defence failed, which likely would not have happened in a home birth. All the doctors and equipment did not make a difference.

i think it depends how much you trust doctors. There seems a lot of distrust.

It's not about distrust. Doctors aren't going to be monitoring my labour throughout, are they? They won't have a clue that I'm in trouble unless someone tells them. Which is why the midwife (and their skills) are so important.

I think that people see hospital as risk free when it isn't.

This exactly. All birth choices carry risk unfortunately.

Laurie maybe I’m underestimating midwifery because I was consultant led (by choice) and bypassed most of it.

My community midwife was brilliant though.

In an ideal world we’d all be able to have our choice of perfect birth, which for many people would be one on one midwife led care with a private room before during and after the birth, the midwife in the rest on with you throughout not caring for other women and doing admin in the office, with a pool available should you wish and also an emergency crash team, operating theatre and NICU on the same site. Or an ELCS. Followed by continued high level care, in your private room with a bed for your partner.
The reality is that for the vast majority of women across the UK this option simply doesn’t exist. There are neither the facilities nor the staff at most MLUs or they are detached from the emergency hospital facilities anyway.
So you have to weigh up the risks and benefits, which are different in each setting to find the one that is lowest risk for harm to you and your baby. Statistically that may actually be a HB for some people - this is not ‘woke’ or ‘woo’ its rational evidence based decision making.
I would also agree that family history is important. My mum had delivered two whopping babies with minimal intervention, I’d had similar pregnancy to hers, have a similar build and was confident that the birth was likely to be similar despite the baby being ‘a wee bitty big’ as my midwife put it. Violetta was very sensible having had a different family history to opt for a different kind of birth. I had a slight risk factor for PPH and was a first time mum so in that case the safest place for me was at the MLU within the hospital - despite their horrible staffing issues. This time depending on whether the same risk factors or different present it could be anything from a planned section to a home birth, it will be discussed with the professionals as the pregnancy progresses to have the safest birth for myself and my baby - nothing to do with Netflix or yoga! Yes, I’d really like another water birth but not enough to risk my babies health if advised against!!

I felt far better after elc than I did after my text book birth, which left a small tear. That small tear was so painful I cried when I was thirsty because I was terrified of having to pee, I didn't wash myself because again it was like dragging razor blades covered in salt and lemon over my privates.
I couldn't poo properly either and had awful lower back pain for two weeks.

With my section I could happily do all the above! I just needed assistance stepping into our bath shower! But there was no pain just tiredness after walks for first two weeks.

Not so the ladies in my nct group. One was self cathertising a week after birth, in and out of hospital... One nealry died from complications and was in and out of hospital for a year!! Another had huge episiotomy.
One had water birth she and I were best off in the group but having had section with her first said she wishes she had gone down that route!

I know many people even after planned Elc find recovery hard, however to present recovery from a section as guaranteed to be hard and long and not from a vaginally birth is not true.

My first birth was amazing according to mw, text book, fast est labour. I recovered from my elc far better.

The difference being, there are a whole team of experts, so somebody should be able to pick up on something.

And sometimes they pick up on something totally not needing to be reacted upon because sometimes machines can create problems that aren't actually there. This can created unnecessary medical invention leading to complications. This could all be avoided with 1:1 homebirth care because MWs are amazing at their job

Snowmagedon and that is the point isn't it, we can all choose what option will be best suited to us

Twittle I do agree to some extent. I had extra scans with DS because one scan showed excess fluid by a tiny amount. It never showed up at any other scan and no cause was found, and I was told it was most likely a measuring error on the day and there was nothing wrong. Obviously if I hadn’t had the original scan it wouldn’t have been an issue.

That said, I’d rather safe than sorry. I do wonder why there aren’t more MLU in hospitals, so women can immediately transfer if needed. That seems incredibly obvious to me!

I’d probably opt for an ELCS like I did anyway for numerous reasons but obviously that is not for everyone, and other than that it sounds like you would have had more individual care at home (which says something about the hospital).

It says everything about the hospital. And that's why women should stop instantly judging other women based solely on their own experiences.

You likely wouldn't have got the choice of a ELCS here. I was a twin pregnancy, classed as moderately high risk throughout and then more so because one was footling breech position. ELCS wasn't an option they'd even discuss...

I just worry low risk is assumed to be risk free

There's no such thing as risk free childbirth. Even a well planned ELCS has risks. Childbirth is dangerous, but sometimes the dangers aren't just the ones you think of first hand.