Phone taken away dd on sleepover?

[upsideup]

DD(10) was on a sleepover last night, first sleepover with this girl but we have had the girl at ours a few times before, her mum has always asked that we take her dd's phone off her before bed which we have done( we plug it in outside dd's bedroom so she could still get it if she needs it) but I remember having the conversation that my dd likes to have her phone with her on sleepovers so she is able contact us.
The mum took dd's phone of her at 8 last night and put it in her bedroom, dd did ask if she could keep it turned off in her bag but she wasnt allowed, shes' quite anxious about sleepovers and knowing she can text us to come pick her up etc without talking to the parents make her more comfortable, she also does contact us a bit anyway to say goodnight and check when we are picking her up etc. Shes also didnt get her phone back untill we picked her up at 11 because she was too nervous to ask for it.
We were a bit worried that she hadnt replied when we text goodnight and we were on are way, but I had assumed she was having too much fun and hadnt thought to check her phone not that she wasnt allowed to.
DD was upset when we picked her up, obviously not to tears or anything but it did make her feel uncomfortable that someone else took her phone and she wasnt able to contact us, she wasnt able to get any sleep because she was worried about it.

AIBU in that she shouldnt of done that without contacting me first?
The girls are quickly becomming close friends so its likely dd will get more sleepover invites, can I or how can I tell the mum that I would like dd to keep her phone?

I would think children using phones need to have adult supervision, when the phones allow them to text and take photos. WiFi isn't the only issue. It isn't a good idea to let kids have unsupervised access overnight. Because you don't know that they won't misuse the phone.

Sorry but I couldn't allow that here, and that's that.

Huh? Why does an 8 year old have a phone? I just cannot get my head round this. This is bonkers

I know in real life that it is not odd at all, I have never met anyone who is so strongly against children having non-smart phones everybody always agrees its a really sensible and useful idea.
Smart phones, I agree are dangerous for children.
They have the most basic phones possible, they only have contacts of adults who we trust. They both go out alone often, to play with their friends, to the local shops etc and both stay home sometimes when I am out for a short while, its useful to be able to contact them and for them to contact us, Its not bonkers at all.
People survived 50 years ago without them but we are not living 50 years ago, phones have been invented and everyone has them.

In rl my experience is I know 2 10 year olds and that's because they stay with idiot dads who refuse to allow them to contact their mums on eow. Everyone else gets one in time for secondary. Who does and 8yo even call?

All kind of technologies exist now which didn't 50 years ago. We don't all have all of it, and lots of technologies need a level of maturity to be able to use them sensibly in my view.

Yes, phones can be used to text friends - and we know about all the unpleasant texts and bullying texts sent by phone. Children see their friends at school on a daily basis - why do they need to text them? Yes they can contact Grandma - but can't they do that with the landline or using an adults mobile?

It seems to me that the genuine benefits are very few for 8 year olds, but the potential downsides very significant.

What about 7 year olds? 6 year olds? 5 year olds?

Perhaps it's just me, but the kids mine have mixed with haven't had phones until the summer before secondary. Their school did not allow any phones and as a school going up to 13 (some left at 11 and some at 13) the kids just didn't have phones until either 11 or 13. They simply didn't need them or ask for them...but funnily enough they managed to make contact with their friends and relatives when needed and if ever an issue arose at a sleepover, contact was always possible.

This is starting to look a bit like the TV in bedrooms thing to me.

Having seen the havoc silly games with phones can create on sleepovers, I think this mother is absolutely right.

m0therofdragons

Me? His dad? his grandparents? Maybe the emergency services?
Does no one where you live let their under 10's go out of the house alone? Can you not understand why even if not 100% neccesary it could be very useful for me to be able to contact my children and for them to contact me when we are not together?
How can it be bonkers that I do that, thats what phones were invented for.

But you said your dd likes her phone with her in the context of a conversation at a different sleepover at your home , she may well have forgotten the conversation entirely, and you said her answer was ‘yeah I get that’ , meaning she can see why your daughter likes to have her phone not saying she would allow it in her home . You should have had the conversation when you dropped your daughter off on the night .
This ^
It was your responsibility to have a conversation with the mother about this and what your daughters expectations were.

No 8 yo round here would go far on their own other than play out in the street. The primary schools don't allow children to walk to school without a parent until year 5. Even if dd 10 went to the shop (which she does) I wouldn't expect her to call me.

We must be living in very different areas. I'm in the south west and honestly an 8yo with a phone would be judged round here. Kids go on Brownie pack holiday and have to cope without phones.

I can think of the very odd occasion when being able to contact an under 10 might be useful. However, in each of these circumstances, I can think of other ways to get in touch if it were absolutely needed and couldn't wait. At the same time, I can see far more potential downsides - so on balance, the weight of evidence just seems to tip against younger children having them, in my view.

I think that what happens, is that in certain schools or areas, it is more common for young kids to have them. Then not surprisingly, the others want them too.....so it becomes the norm. It's hard to say 'no' if most people have them or if the kids claim most people have them. And once they've got them, it's very very hard to totally police - we all know that, and anyone who says their young child can be totally trusted with a mobile in their bedroom at night, especially when with a group, clearly hasn't been on those parental phone use training sessions which schools frequently offer....but perhaps they offer them to older children, because they can't quite believe kids who have just left Infants have their own mobile!

Honestly, get on the websites about children and phones, whether internet enabled or not.....see all the issues that arise from young use, and especially from children having them in bedrooms and even more with groups......and then see if you can really make a case for being outraged that a hosting mother asked phones to be left downstairs. I cannot believe that people don't know this stuff or give their kids phones without reading up in this stuff first.....that they justify it because the child wants to text grandma.

Our job is to protect our children. The risks to them of having phones at too young an age far exceed the risks you think you might be a aerating by having one, or the advantages. Get on those websites or go to an event at your school.

ChocolateWombat

My kids dont text their friends, they dont need to text their friends. They call me and their dad or we call them, when they go out somewhere and say they will be 20 minutes they can call and say is it okay if I stay longer, I can call and say you need to come back now etc.
At our junior school you can hand your phone in at the begining of the day and collect it the end of the day for the children who walk home alone, I really dont understand how thats such a terrible idea.
My kids have enough maturity to know how to use it sensibly.
Theres no benefit to children with tv in bedrooms, there s no benefit to children with a smart phone but a basic phone is much different.

Of course phones are useful, mine had phones at 10 (old, hand me downs that could only make calls) they were very useful and gave them independence, when they went out to the park or riding their bikes I could stay in touch, or if they were at a friends house, skate park or at a sleepover they could let me know when they needed to be picked up. They didn't always use them, but sometimes it was useful.

As they got older they would text friends too and by the time they were in secondary school they graduated to better phones with internet access.

Op, I agree that there are instances that mobile phones are of use for children. It’s definately of value when they start to become more independent and can travel on their own and stay at home for a short time. It’s good to have in an emergency. Under the supervision of other trusted adults in their home overnight isn’t one of these instances. If you don’t trust family your child stayed with, don’t let your child visit alone.

All of the advice (and there are huge info campaigns about both phones and Internet use - not just smart phones) says phones and devices should not be in bedrooms. All of the advice makes clear that younger children and teenagers who might seem sensible and mature are very easily susceptible to doing daft things with said devices.

Surely, younger children shouldn't be far from home or for long alone, in a way which needs them to be able to make contact with parents? Again, phones are not a substitute for properly looking after children, setting approaprauet boundaries and teaching them how to cope with situations, apart from ringing mummy.

Why would anyone ignore this advice which is given widely?

My kids have enough maturity to know how to use it sensibly.

No 8yo is mature enough as they are a child and judging by the "sensible" teens I've worked with it'll be a while until they are mature enough. Our primary doesn't collect phones in as no dc bring them. You sign to give permission and inform the school dc is walking and they check those dc have arrived before checking the others. Any lone walkers who haven't arrived at school have their parents called. It's not complicated.

Phones are extremely useful but not for primary dc. Totally unnecessary. (But then my dc don't have TVs in their bedrooms either).

I think there's nothing wrong with using technology positively, so having a phone as a safety net for a child who is out with friends/ walking home from school seems really sensible.

But I really worry that we are bringing up a generation of children who are totally reliant on technology for everything - conversation, social activity, reassurance, falling out, making up, managing minor anxiety etc ad infinitum. It's really important for children to build resilience and confidence and such reliance on a phone wont do that.

Thanks for answering @upsideup What kind of phone does your DD's friend have?

If your child isn't confident enough to have a conversation with the parents to tell them they want to go home, they shouldn't be going to sleepovers

We havent ignored any advice, we read all the advice and made it safest for our DC. No where does it say children under 10 absolutely under no circumstances should have a phone, there actually lots of support for children having a basic phone.
Thats why we said no to smartphones, they have no games, no internet access, no social media, no friends numbers. They can only text and call me and their dad and a tiny number of close family relatives.
What do you really think they are going to do on them?

My DC had non smartphones from age 9 - which was when they started to walk to school, play out and go to friends houses without an adult. It was handy for me to be able to text "dinner at 6" or for them to text "fallen off bike, wheel won't move" or "is it ok to go round to x friend's house".

DC who never go anywhere without a parent until they go to secondary school probably don't need a phone.

That said, my DC wouldn't have taken them on a sleepover, because they had no need to keep in touch with anyone. I'd assume that in an emergency the host parent would contact me, or DC would ask to use their phone. If the DC was too nervous to speak to the host parent I'd expect it to be relayed via their friend.

m0therofdragons

But maturity towards technology decreases when your a teen IMO.
A 16year old with a smartphone, internet access, social media, peer pressure, random numbers, an interest in sex etc is dangerous and I will be very concerned and active when my kids get to that stage.
An 8 year old with a brick phone and no friends numbers really isnt the same at all.

Wow, YABU. If you don't trust the family she's staying with, why the hell are you letting her sleepover.

Their house, their rules.

I had an experience where my DS's friend (11) reacted so badly to the no phones upstairs rule that he promptly seethed paced around , then burst out crying before asking to have his phone to call mum to collect him. I called mum, who did collect him. Her excuse was that he wasn't used to sleepovers as he was an only child ( PFB I suspect- he also stated he wasn't used to stairs/ fireworks/ hadn't toasted marshmallows before and these were all mega dangerous!) and preferred being at home.
Funnily enough, he attended a sleepover for another friend a month later and was fine because they're the parents who allow phones/ iPads / xbox/ movies all night!!! My DS is only allowed to attend on this boy's birthday because he is a particularly good friend.
I was livid and won't be inviting him back.

Where does your 8 year old go that he would need a phone? An 8 year old with a phone around here would certainly draw some comments.
8 year olds around here are never without an adult.

Why not just leave it up to your daughter.

"Sarah's mum doesn't allow phones at night on sleepovers and she has invited you again, do you want to go?"

Sounds like this may be a little bit your anxiety too.

It is ok for your child to be uncomfortable and outside their comfort zone sometimes.

It sounds like she was anxious but coped and was in a safe environment while doing so. I'd encourage not discourage that if I were you, especially if she has a history of anxiety.

I'd also encourage her to come up with some coping strategies... for instance, if she was too shy to ask for it back what could she do? Write a note and leave it on the kitchen counter? Ask her friend to ask? These are good life skills to work out how to deal with difficult situations.