AIBU to think some people should just grow up

[ithinksheisawuss]

Details changed and I’ve name changed to stop it being identifiable.

AIBU to think some people just need to grow up and get on with it at work?

I work in a busy fast paced environment. It’s a big office with two distinct areas. On one side are the sales people this is high stress and loud, on the other side is the support staff area which is much gentler. The support staff are mainly older women, the sales staff are a mixed bunch.

The sales side is very robust, lots of swearing and mickey taking. Some days people let off steam by shouting we all just laugh and get on with it, no one takes offence. When someone shouts we laugh at them then they laugh and the tension breaks. We need this release sometimes.

Anyway, one of the support ladies lady S was doing a job at the sales end of the office colleague A put the phone down and started to shout. Lady S asked a question of colleague A and colleague A shouted. She didn’t shout at lady S - she was just shouty iyswim.

Lady S has put in a formal complaint saying she has been bullied and colleague A was unprofessional. Colleague A often behaves like this it’s her passion that makes her good at her job.

If all the sales staff behaved in the quiet demure way the support staff do no sales would get made! But the whole support area is up in arms about poor lady S.

TBH I think lady S is a bit of a wuss but I am wondering if I am too harsh. Colleague A is really valuable to the business, lady S is easily replaceable.

Tbh, the Sales lot sound like a bunch of absolute knobs. It is not the support side that needs to grow up.

How far apart are the areas. Are the support staff expected to spend all day listening to the braying and immature shouting of the sales lot from the other side of the room.

Sounds like a stressful situation for them in all honesty.

If the sales lot cannot handle the "stress" of their job without acting like immature louts they need to get into a new career.

LucyMorningStar I think lady S is on MN which is why I am being careful.

Yeah I like the banter it keeps me going. We just need to make sure it stays in the team.

This is exactly what's wrong with capitalism and a reminder of why it needs to be regulated lest ball-bags like that bunch get to trample over anyone they perceive as weaker than them in pursuit of profits and bonuses.
Sorry, but for some reason this OP strikes me as deeply unpleasant.

Would it be acceptable for the support staff to shout at the sales staff?

We all know the rules and enjoy the game. It wouldn't be for everyone but we are actually a close team. Well as close as Sales gets.
A large part of your problem seems to be that you don't regard the support staff (who, by the sounds of it, have been doing their jobs a hell of a lot longer than you sales ppl) as being on the same team as you. You all work for the same company you know.
Maybe they last longer than you sales staff because they know how to behave appropriately in the work environment.

Is it finance?
Sounds very much like my working place, and I think most posters don't know what the ambiance is like on a trading floor... What you describe is the norm and I would say Lady S is BU. I can't believe she genuinely thinks it was bullying, more like she took the opportunity to make a complaint. She would NBU in most work settings, but not all.

I used to work on a busy insurance broker floor in the city of London, the sales guys got quite animated on the phone but they never shouted at support staff, they knew when to wind down etc. And they were dealing with millions...

I still don't get if lady s was shouted 'at' or shouted 'near'?

Ever heard the one about empty vessels making the most noise op?
Fits the lot of you to a tee. Brain work gets done quietly.

I am passionate about teaching. By your rules I think that next time I child gets something I will shout at the next person that comes in my room and see if they laugh or just think I'm weird. Or maybe I will shout FFS! next time a child doesn't get something and see what the child's parents think about it. Will quote you - it's just because I'm passionate and if I don't shout I won't be passionate!

Sounds very much like my working place, and I think most posters don't know what the ambiance is like on a trading floor

I’ve worked in 3 huge international banks in a variety of roles, very close to the sales teams. I still think all this shouting sounds pathetic and childish.

Pitiful excuses for unacceptable behaviour.

Places can be fun, lively and motivated, even quite boisterous, without being rude and unprofessional as you have described.
There is no need to be quiet and demure in order to be professional.

OP your sales team sound like twats. Also, why post if you're going to get uppity when people disagree with you? You asked if ywbu, people have said ywbu, you asked for it.

I sit right next to a sales team in two different offices in what would probably be considered a high-powered industry doing a job that requires concentration, and we all manage to get along. This is because the sales team, though louder than us, manage to behave professionally. The ones that sell over the phone also spend most of their time actually selling, rather than taking the piss. And their job would be a damn sight harder without the input of the other teams. Happily they are actually appreciative.

Urubu it sounds similar. It really isn't a normal office environment it's hard to convey the atmosphere. I can't explain how the shouting often becomes laughter and that picks you up.

Support person probably felt shouted AT because she’s asked a question.

It’s a bit like the difference between saying to someone ‘Oh for fuck sake I can’t get this to work’ and ‘You’re a fucking twat’.

I think it must have felt personal to Support person.

Colleague A should just apologise to Support person for making her feel it was aimed AT her but explain it wasn’t.

Leave HR to sort the rest out.

I think you sound quite unprofessional and I think that behaviour wouldn't be tolerated in most workplaces.

You also seem to look down on the admin staff. I wonder if they didn't show up for a few weeks would your company still be so successful?

If you don't see yourself at this job for the long term maybe you should take some time to reflect on the way you are coming across in your posts or you may find it very hard to get another position.

Be nice to those who you meet on the way up because you'll meet them again on the way back down.

OP - I cannot find a redeeming post about the team you work in.

In answer to your question - YABVU.
For all the reasons 95% of people have posted.

You are trying to defend the indefensible - shouting at/around people you have deemed as dispensible is bullying.

Show some respect to your fellow human beings. They are not beneath you.

It’s a bit like the difference between saying to someone ‘Oh for fuck sake I can’t get this to work’ and ‘You’re a fucking twat’

That is more or less what happened.

I'm not uppity. I don't think I've explained the situation well but I do think we need to be careful when the support staff are around. We know the rules they don't.

I thought she should get it because she can hear it in the background but obviously not.

Whether she ‘gets it’ or not, she doesn’t have to tolerate being spoken to like that.

YANBU

colleague A definitely needs to grow up and get on with their work instead of acting like some third rate Gordon gekko tribute act.

@LucyMorningStar there is a whole lot in between shouting at eachother and a deathly quiet office. Lots of colleagues enjoy work and have a laugh with eachother, sometimes they might even have a rant about something. But shouting at people who have just entered the situation is just downright bizarre.

The culture of 'them' and 'us' probably exacerbated the situation enough to make her feel like complaining. If they were all mostly nice to eachother, maybe sales lady would have put it down to a one off.

The sales side sounds like an insufferably smug bunch of aggressive arseholes.

Banter has its place, and sounds perfectly fine amongst the members of the sales team who seek it out.

However, has "S" ever shouted at A? If it's two-way, it's banter. If it's one-way, it's bullying.

Can you explain what it is people are "shouting" OP? I mean what words are they using? This sounds utterly bizarre and unlike anything I've come across in over 20 years of working in the City.