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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be worried about the Russian retaliation?

187 replies

alligatortoss · 14/03/2018 06:21

just think you don’t fuck around with them. Anything could happen

OP posts:
wanderings · 14/03/2018 08:46

Has warmonger Bliar suggested we invade yet, as he keeps sticking his nose in?

Figmentofmyimagination · 14/03/2018 08:48

So soon after separating us from our neighbour's. What a surprise, not.

Those who voted to leave the European Union might like to revisit what experts on Russia and Eastern Europe were warning before the referendum, although it might be a touch late now.

IllustriouslyIllogical · 14/03/2018 08:48

but we've done ourselves no favours by isolating ourselves from our allies

I love how many people have no concept of what NATO is! It's nothing to do with the US of EU & we'll still be in it when we leave the EU.

Also, pretty sure that 200 nukes would reduce this globe to a glowing cinder, so 7000 is just a waste of cash! The reason they have so many is because most of them won't get off the ground in the first place!

gussyfinknottle · 14/03/2018 08:49

We are an insignificant little country these days. Why do you think they did it here? I doubt that our NATO allies want to escalate this and our stbx EU friends won't do much for us. As for US, Trump just sacked someone who was pretty pally with Russia because he wasn't pally enough with them.
I'm sorry for his daughter, for the police officer who helped them and I'm sorry for all the people whose lives and businesses are temporarily disrupted by this. I'm sorry for the way they went for this guy.
Imagine if this was Burgess or Maclean or Philby etc. That's what they think of him.

Squishysquirmy · 14/03/2018 08:50

They are NOT going to nuke us in response to "strong condemnation" or financial sanctions.

They just aren't.

Putin might be a dickhead, but he is not dumb enough and suicidal enough to do that! Its not even to do with any moral reservations he might have about doing such a thing; it wouldn't be in his own interests. He and his super rich cronies quite like the world habitable.

Figmentofmyimagination · 14/03/2018 08:52

Which external economic or political powers were positively thrilled at the referendum outcome? Russia, Isis and trump's USA. Funny that.

Helmetbymidnight · 14/03/2018 08:55

Putin has done well dividing us from the rest of Europe. Of course us not being in the EU is destabilizing and makes us weaker.

They are laughing at us.

Eltonjohnssyrup · 14/03/2018 08:57

Russia are only the 17th largest economy in the world. It’s doubtful Putin’s claims about missiles are true. Their military infrastructure is old and creaking and they can’t afford to upgrade it. They know they couldn’t win a war.

Nothing is going to happen. Honestly, it only takes a sneeze and a load of people on MN will start hysterically predicting WW3.

Eltonjohnssyrup · 14/03/2018 08:57

And the EU is not innocent in this. Their attempts to destabilise the Ukraine started this.

YoloSwaggins · 14/03/2018 09:01

The whole thing makes no sense. Why would they do it when they've just poured shedloads if money into the world cup, and about to have ab election? This spy guy was 0 danger to them. It makes no sense.

Also, where is the evidence? In a court case you would need CCTV, witnesses, forensics and fingerprints. Here, Theresa May says the Russians did it therefore they did it. Hmm.

It seems more likely to have been done by a party that wanted to stir things up between UK and Russia. Convenient distraction for the Brexit failure/Saudis visiting.

Commuterface · 14/03/2018 09:03

Russia may be regarded as a lone wolf nation, but we've done ourselves no favours by isolating ourselves from our allies.

How many time on this thread? Our closest allies are (OPCW and UNSC) and NATO! It's nothing to do with fucking Brexit!

Squishysquirmy · 14/03/2018 09:03

So the EU interfering in Ukraine is to blame, years later, for a nerve agent attack in the UK?

Nope.

LarkDescending · 14/03/2018 09:03

Even Putin might pause before pressing the nuclear button.

But he is dangerous, and there are well-founded and long-standing concerns as to whether severing vital undersea cables might be on the agenda, with Russia setting up its own parallel infrastructure so that it would not suffer the fallout.

He’s having fun taunting the UK just now. If he had wanted a sterile and plausibly deniable takeout of a target he could have achieved just that, but instead picked an obviously Russian nerve gas which can kill or maim bystanders as well as targets - a ‘dirty’ weapon, just to make the impact more damaging and worrying. A blatant calling card, saying everything Russia wants to say to our government.

LittleLionMansMummy · 14/03/2018 09:04

The reason they have so many is because most of them won't get off the ground in the first place

If this is true, which we don't know with any certainty, what's to stop them scattering Novichok around instead? They've already put a UK police officer in hospital - innocent bystander or not, they've shown no regard for ordinary citizens. Nukes or not, I don't exactly feel safe.

I love how many people have no concept of what NATO is! It's nothing to do with the US of EU & we'll still be in it when we leave the EU.

It has everything to do with the EU. Putin detests it and it suits his agenda to weaken it. He will have been rubbing his hands in glee when the referendum result came in. Not that it will have been a surprise to him of course. The biggest danger to the world is not nuclear weapons, it's instability and discontent sewn by cyber warfare.

Squishysquirmy · 14/03/2018 09:05

The EU is not a military alliance.
The most sensible (and probably only) retaliation we could make is an economic one though.

Economic sanctions are more effective when Allies are on board. So our relationship with the rest of the EU is relevant here.

user1466690252 · 14/03/2018 09:05

I think we should try and cooperate with them. They are right, we havn't given them 10 days or a sample we have seemingly decided they did it. We could at least try to make relations good. the UK certainly isn't innocent in everything. It all seems a huge fuss and a major distraction from something. Maybe I am naive tho

mudhoney · 14/03/2018 09:06

they won't do anything. nothing will happen putin is a psychopath

Squishysquirmy · 14/03/2018 09:10

User, they unleashed a nerve agent on British soil which put other British citizens at huge risk. They could have chosen another way to assassinate their target, but they chose to use an internationally banned substance instead.
It really cant be ignored. I am not sure what you mean by "cooperate with them".

IllustriouslyIllogical · 14/03/2018 09:11

Nukes or not, I don't exactly feel safe.

Seriously? Suburban Sue doesn't feel safe - Woo.....

Grow Up & get on with your life - you have no influence, you can't change anything & you can't do anything if something did happen - why on earth are you worrying about it?

Worry about things within your sphere of influence, prepare if you think it'll help, but don't worry about Putin & May FGS.....

Helmetbymidnight · 14/03/2018 09:11

Russia may be regarded as a lone wolf nation, but we've done ourselves no favours by isolating ourselves from our allies.

How many time on this thread? Our closest allies are (OPCW and UNSC) and NATO! It's nothing to do with fucking Brexit!

How many times?

Brexit is destabilizing for the UK. It will make us poorer and weaker.

That's why the Russians were involved in the Leave campaign.

Helmetbymidnight · 14/03/2018 09:13

How many time on this thread? Our closest allies are (OPCW and UNSC) and NATO! It's nothing to do with fucking Brexit!

Meant to put this in bold. No way do I want to be associated with such a dumb-arse response.

LittleLionMansMummy · 14/03/2018 09:13

The EU is not a military alliance. The most sensible (and probably only) retaliation we could make is an economic one though. Economic sanctions are more effective when Allies are on board. So our relationship with the rest of the EU is relevant here.

Precisely this. If you don't think the EU is relevant, how else are we to exploit economic and diplomatic sanctions before even needing to consider military action?

voiceofnoreason · 14/03/2018 09:14

Ok - there are a few nuances i think to this.

Firstly - the chap on R4 who was our diplomat there said talk of world cup embargoes "will hardly change the weather in Moscow" - we are reliant on Russian gas and over the last few years, the slump in oil prices has wrecked the Russian economy. Destabilising the middle east through supporting the only remaining Soviet era ally left in the ME (Assad) consequently did the economy good by keeping up oil prices.

It also gave them a chance to try out some new shiny kit. Which while the majority is creaking as state upthread, they have some new very effective bits of kit that certainly give Nato a headache. Namely the s400 air defence system. Putin has spent a lot of Rubles upgrading a large amount of kit. Militarily i gather they are more potent a force at projecting power than at any time in the cold war.

So when faced with an election year, a poor economy and a stack of new shiny kit - what better to give the domestic ratings a lift with international force. Appparently the domestic ratings do like a "strong man" in the old soviet style. This looks good to ordinary Russians, it gives them prestige.

Add to that a few traitors get knocked off - albeit overseas? Plays to the gallery in Moscow. (lot like Trump and his base).

So look at the recent events through the lens of domestic approval of Putin and it makes sense as far as I can ascertain.

Now - as to what we do. We shouldnt seize assets - that is how banana republics like Venezuela operate. We use the rule of law.

We will tighten sanctions, expel an diplomat, perhaps even get it condemned at the security council (I imagine that Russia will abstain!)

That will be it. Nato doesnt want to escalate and neither do the Russians.

user1466690252 · 14/03/2018 09:14

cooperate in the sense that we give them the sample and joint investiagtion they are entitled to. the whole 24hour deadline was bollocks. May knew they wouldn't give answers and now we look to be the aggressor as we don't have proof they did it.
Remember the whole weapons or mass destruction thing. We went to war, invaded a whole country and didn't have the full facts. this feels a little bit like this, Putin is facing an election and wants to look strong. He is looking strong right now as we are playing into his hands

Helmetbymidnight · 14/03/2018 09:17

He looks very strong. While our country looks like a little shit-hole inhabited by morons.