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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

What kind of person jumps off a cliff with two children? **MNHQ warning: upsetting content**

553 replies

Leafyhouse · 06/03/2018 17:08

I've been really shaken by that story about the woman stabbed at home, and the father found at the bottom of the cliff with 2 dead children, 10 and 7.

Their home is about 400 yards away from me. I also have 2 DS's, aged 8 and 10. It's just made me sick to the core. Police and forensic officers all over this lovely house, in a really nice area - and for what? Why would someone do that? Have your own problems, but why take the children?

Just reeling at the moment, am going to hug my kids extra tight tonight. This one's just so very close to home.

OP posts:
stopfuckingshoutingatme · 09/03/2018 00:08

Disrespectful that on a thread about the murder of their family (I refer to the Murdered people not the murderer ) people seem keen on arguing amongst themselves , and asserting their opinions as ‘right’ . It’s just seems off . Even if people are right

pallisers · 09/03/2018 00:21

stopfucking I do think I know what you mean although disrespectful isn't the word I would use - more how horrible it would be for them to see people discussing the death of their child/grandchildren/sibling. But it is horrible because of what happened - not that there were other women trying to puzzle out what went so awfully wrong. There is no disrespect to that woman and those children on this thread - just differing opinions on what might caused him to kill them.

If you are murdered, your death enters the public sphere in some way - it is another terrible consequence of the murderer's actions. And given how many women are killed by spouses, maybe we could also see it as extremely respectful of the horror of her death that her fellow women would try to figure out what went wrong so it might not happen again.

I suppose I think NOT talking about these kinds of crimes, won't make them less likely to occur. Talking about why might help even to raise public perception of the problem - - even if there is some argument in perspectives. That seems more respectful of the victim to me.

Okadas · 09/03/2018 06:15

In a former life I had to work with a man who tried (and failed, thankfully) to kill his own family.

He...explained...that there had been a long history of violence between him and his partner. Things "got out of hand" one day and he thought he'd killed her. He panicked. Decided the only thing he could do was to kill himself, but he didn't want his kids to grow up without their parents and the shame of what he'd done, so he tried to gas them in the car.

He was neither evil or mentally ill. For some people murder just seems to be an option. It's terrifying.

WomanWithAltitude · 09/03/2018 07:18

He was a domestic abuser. Even if you don't want to use the word 'evil', he was a piece of shit.

WomanWithAltitude · 09/03/2018 07:20

a long history of violence between him and his partner

I hate euphemisms like this. He had a long history of seriously physically abusing his partner is far more accurate.

WomanWithAltitude · 09/03/2018 07:23

Some people could do with reading this:

www.theguardian.com/society/2017/jun/17/we-didnt-recognise-that-he-was-dangerous-our-father-killed-our-mother-and-sister

Bettyfood · 09/03/2018 07:25

How would you do it logistically with two older children? It's almost always selfish bastard violent men who imagine their children can't go on without them.

WomanWithAltitude · 09/03/2018 07:52

Children who have been raised in an abusive household don't tend to fight back, struggle against, or contradict their abuser. They will placate, comply, stay silent, and do anything they can to avoid incurring further wrath. They have been quietly living in fear for all their lives.

I think that answers the logistics question, sadly.

stopfuckingshoutingatme · 09/03/2018 08:02

I think completely normal to discuss it . It’s just some people can get a bit carried away arguing . It reads like they are more interested in getting their opinion across . That’s AIBU for you .

Ref the children being subdued as abused/ scared - yes . My DC are the same age and there is NO fucking way they would let me do that . Sorry but they would fight back / and Call for help . I can’t even envisage it Sad

Lizzie48 · 09/03/2018 08:13

There was a car at the scene, I think he might have driven them over the cliff, which would make it impossible for them to stop him. I also don't see how he could have jumped off with 2 older children either.

How horribly scary it must have been for them. Sad

Okadas · 09/03/2018 08:21

To the two people who commented on my post - both of them were violent. It wasn't one sided. She had the children taken off her in the end for abuse.

Anyway, my point is there is no such thing as evil. It's just humans choosing to do bad things.

AlexaAmbidextra · 09/03/2018 08:33

Lizzie. They were not in the car. The car was found at the top of the cliffs, the bodies on the beach below.

InSisu · 09/03/2018 09:09

Of course they wouldn't have bloody jumped off willingly. I don't want to upset anyone, but it isn't hard to imagine what would've happened.
Good grief.

ToffeeUp · 09/03/2018 09:24

He was neither evil or mentally ill. For some people murder just seems to be an option. It's terrifying

This is what it comes down to.

KatherinaMinola · 09/03/2018 09:35

I remember that case Glitter - it was one I was thinking of when I posted above about women doing it for different reasons, PND being one.

Lizzie48 · 09/03/2018 10:07

Ok, in that case, yes it would have been because they were so intimidated by him. I didn't stand up to my F's abuse of DSis and me, so I suppose it's the same thing. Although survival instincts kick in when at the point of being killed.

But then again there might have been a struggle, we'll never know what happened obviously.

Totally tragic for the mum and the children. Sad

stopfuckingshoutingatme · 09/03/2018 10:10

I keep thinking of the family
The granny , uncles and aunts / and the friends she might have confided in
And their little school friends . How do you fucking explain to your child why their BFF isn’t at school ?

Sorry I know this happens all the time but it’s so close to home and ....Sad

DarthNigel · 09/03/2018 10:14

I don't know. But I've found this so upsetting when I heard it on the news. My dd is 11 and I can imagine how fucking terrified she'd be.

blastomama · 09/03/2018 10:46

He was neither evil or mentally ill. For some people murder just seems to be an optio

You have no idea if someone was mentally ill. What posesses people to imagine they can say that?

This whole thread is in extreme bad taste and full of offensive bollocks.

Okadas · 09/03/2018 10:56

You have no idea if someone was mentally ill. What posesses people to imagine they can say that?

If you actually read my post you would see I am not talking about the same man you are talking about. Or if you did then I would think he would know better about what was going on inside his head than you.

blastomama · 09/03/2018 10:58

No, I know who you were talking about: someone who you cannot know whether or not they were mentally ill or anything else.
What are your qualifications for diagnosing people?

Okadas · 09/03/2018 11:02

This man went through a trial and went to prison. At no point was he diagnosed with having a mental illness.

blastomama · 09/03/2018 11:08

And no-one ever ever has a mental illness that isn't diagnosed Hmm

NerrSnerr · 09/03/2018 11:14

And no-one ever ever has a mental illness that isn't diagnosed 
If there was any doubt during the trial the judge would have adjourned and requested a psychiatric assessment. His solicitor would have recommended this anyway if it was a concern.

blastomama · 09/03/2018 11:19

Or maybe you just don't know everything. You clearly don't know much about mental illness at all.