To think that Elsa was actually a bit of a shit?

[noodleaddict]

She ran away leaving her land in deep winter then was prancing about on a mountaintop singing about how wonderful and free she was without giving her people a second thought.

She struck her sister twice - ok, the first was a mistake but you'd think she'd have learned her lesson by the second time.

When Anna came to ask for her help she basically told her to fuck off then created a snow monster to chase her over a precipice (after striking her, as above).

Plus who would be happy living in an ice palace alone in the mountains? How did she eat? What did she do all day?

The other bit that bothers me is the 'sexy' hip-swinging walk she does when she first puts on the frozen dress. It's totally unnecessary. Why, just why?

Possibly overthinking this.

YANBU I agree. I watched it ages after it came out, and couldn’t understand why everyone loved her! I thought she was mean. Much prefer Anna.

Yes she was a bit of a shit, but mostly as a result of her parents’ terrible way of dealing with her powers. Repression, isolation, shame. She went off the rails but was saved by her sister’s love.

And also, if she had been a perfect sister and queen there wouldn’t have been much of a story...

Well she didn’t know that her land was in deep winter when she left, she spent her life being told she’s a freak and to keep it hidden so I can understand why she’s rebelled (bit like real life Disney stars ey?) and yes she chases Anna away but she is trying to protect her so good intentions bad actions?

Yes it’s true, and I also think this of Simba in lion king. He fucks off to be a hippy in the jungle while all his friends and family literally starve to death under murderous dictator!

I agree and so did my then 5 year old who didn't want to continue watching it.

@martellandginger Wooow, your 5yo is Ice-Cold Logic Queen!

BUT Simba was a tiny lion cub whose evil uncle killed his dad and then told him it was his fault! He had no idea what the consequences would be

Plus who would be happy living in an ice palace alone in the mountains? How did she eat? What did she do all day?
I’d be more then happy! For eating She’d be able to hunt and freeze the meat ASAP

It's a bit harsh to blame a child for the moral weakness of running from a problem when your dad is dead and directly or indirectly it's your fault. And then nila comes along and because of love he grows a backbone and does the right thing. I mean hamlet simba isn't exactly likeable but he is sympathetic...

If she wasn't awful, there wouldn't be a theme of unmerited redemption through love, which is the main part of it for me.

RiotAndAlarum, call him a queen he won't mind :) he is very moral - probably be his downfall...

we do sometimes do the actions to the main song off YouTube and cross them with Ninja moves.

Simba was emotionally abused as a child by his uncle.

Eh.... she is the snow queen 👸. Look her up she was Evil. In Frozen they made her nice again but only at the end. They tried to make her completely evil but it didn't work.

I blame the parents. Their approach to containing Elsa's powers was cold and brutal - motivated by protecting Anna from harm, so it's not surprising Elsa felt a little resentful towards Anna for her own 15 years or so of near solitary confinement.

But yes, dd agreed with you when she first saw the film, aged 4, that Elsa did not do the right thing in running away from her duty to look after her kingdom. (I don't think she realised how real the threat of being killed by the visiting 'witch hunting' men was).

She didn't know about the snow though and did come back when she found out and realised she had a responsibility to do something about it.

In Elsa's defence, she didn't know she'd set off an eternal winter everywhere. And she really can't control her powers yet and had no idea of the damage she'd done to Anna.

But the snow monster is wrong in my book, you're right!

I much prefer Moana anyway.. such an awesome story and songs :)

Elsa is a cow. Simba is a bit of a sap but he was manipulated as a child by an adult he looked up to.

Elsa was in actual fact supposed to be a villian but the story was changed last minute.

I like Frozen but that smile and hip swing at the end of Let It Go gets on my nerves.

I see the movie as a kind of allegory for a very common type of abuse, where young girls are taught to not to "own" their power, intelligence and confidence, and instead to appear humble, self-deprecating and conventional. The whole point is that she needs to learn to inherit and own her own power, but the way she does it ends up being quite literally anti-social. It's not the love of a man, but the love of a supportive sister that allows her to integrate her newly empowered self with the rest of society, and to bring that sister into her own as well.

Plus who would be happy living in an ice palace alone in the mountains? How did she eat? What did she do all day?

Exactly - lazy self-obsessed bint. Should've followed Rapunzel's example in Tangled who did chores,laundry, read a book or 2 or 3, painting, guitar, knit, cook, pottery, ventrilloqy....

I like that whisky sums it up nicely

Doesn't everyone else feel a bit heartbroken for Elsa at the end, when it turns out 'all you need is love' and we reflect that her parents didn't try that?

As whiskyowl says, they were more concerned that she cause no harm, and were content in effect to sacrifice her life accordingly, than to give her the opportunity to do good and be happy.

But she was basically abused by her family. Bound to go off the rails a bit... that said I've always found how sexy she is during that song a bit

She was awful but it wasn't her fault. She had been emotionally damaged by having to repress her true self. The total unconditional love of her sister, even when she absolutely did not deserve it, helped heal her.

The story has huge emotional resonance for us. We first saw this not long after my adult DD started to recover from anorexia. This horrible illness had completely taken her over. She became an obsessive manipulative liar and it drove a wedge between her and us, her younger siblings and her friends. About a month into her recovery as her true self began to reemerge we went to see Frozen. The 'Do you wanna build a snowman?' sequence when Anna shuts herself away from love hit us all so hard. Even now the song makes my (usually very stiff upper lip) husband cry.

Yup she was supposed to be a villain but then was changed into a normal girl who is isolated and understandably gets a bit overstimulated when back out in society!

I actually think they make her too "normal" in the ball scene, she is very confident and relaxed. Most of us would be quivering wrecks after being isolated in a room for about 10 years...

As for the snow monster, I think s/he was only supposed to get them out of the ice castle, forcefully but not dangerously. It's only because Anna throws a snowball at it that things go a bit Indiana Jones.

"The other bit that bothers me is the 'sexy' hip-swinging walk she does when she first puts on the frozen dress. It's totally unnecessary. Why, just why?"

Because she is discovering herself as a strong adult after being lcoked away for years. Part of that is discovering one's "womanhood".

Genuine question, what is wrong with embracing one's sexuality? Is it because it's a kid's film? If so I think it's a pretty subtle nod and therefore not problematic.