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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Very worried about child - got off Surbiton train yesterday!

109 replies

worryingminnie · 01/03/2018 14:09

Hi all,

I'm so so upset about a scene I saw on the train last night. Mum and (I think DS got on train for two stops. Obviously freezing cold and it was 6pm ish. DS approx 4 yrs old. He was dressed up well (hat, scarf, wellies, hood) and she was well dressed too (SuperDry jacket etc). Crammed train and son holding on whilst standing. She was SO AWFUL to him - kept goading him and telling him off - saying random things about cancelling Easter, making him walk home etc. He clearly wanted to sleep and yet she kept on and every so often he's start crying again - he really didn't want to speak. All of the adults were horrified and one older Man was muttering "leave the kid alone". I was about to stand up and offer him my seat and try to engage her in conversation but they got off at Surbiton and suddenly she started screaming again at him - it was all you could hear. But the train pulled away.

I texted British Transport Police (no idea why really) and said, when where in the hope they might be at the station or look on CCTV (but sure they won't) and used the City of London 'worried about a child' email address but got reply to say they would need address etc. - of course!

The Mum talked about a sister. At one point he started bashing his head on a pilar and she did put her hand their to stop him but she was awful to him.

I can't stop thinking about his poor little face. Keep getting tearful.

WHAT CAN I DO????? Am I over-reacting??? Could have been the end of a bad day for her but she certainly didn't have the sense to shut up in front on the train adults.

OP posts:
selftitledalbum · 01/03/2018 14:34

@seawitchly
Bugger off if we can’t say anything helpful?

OP didn’t say anything helpful when a small child was being verbally abused in public but is now sitting ‘getting tearful.’ Ok.

Soubriquet · 01/03/2018 14:36

I would be worried about intervening

What if she takes it out on the child because I intervened?

Marriageoftrueminds · 01/03/2018 14:37

Seriously OP, phone the schools. He likely attends one in surbiton, Kingston or nearby as the catchment areas around there are tiny. The school will pass it on, it’s their duty.

Missingstreetlife · 01/03/2018 14:38

If she is like this a lot the school will know?

tinkywinky2018 · 01/03/2018 14:38

Seriously OP, phone the schools. He likely attends one in surbiton, Kingston or nearby as the catchment areas around there are tiny. The school will pass it on, it’s their duty

Don't be so silly! Pass what on to who? They have no way of identifying the child at all, so what do you expect them to do?

ShawshanksRedemption · 01/03/2018 14:38

Op here's a link to a reporter who faced the same thing.
www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/aug/08/mother-shakes-child-in-public-do-you-step-in

GreatDuckCookery6211 · 01/03/2018 14:39

Intervening is a difficult one. She might think because nobody did say anything that she's doing ok to carry on. Even the most hard faced and hard hearted people don't like being called out on their actions. She may have retaliated but it might have sunk in that her actions were intolerable.

JaneEyre70 · 01/03/2018 14:39

I would have filmed her OP, as slyly as I could and then sent it to your local SS helpdesk or Police station. Confronting her may just have made it worse, as she would probably take it out on the poor wee lad. If you see her again, I'd try to get a photo of her. Sadly there's nothing you can do today.

Marriageoftrueminds · 01/03/2018 14:39

Yes but it will help to build up a bigger picture. There might be bits of the jigsaw known to various authorities eg the school, GP etc but the more info the better to help the child.

tinkywinky2018 · 01/03/2018 14:41

Yes but it will help to build up a bigger picture. There might be bits of the jigsaw known to various authorities eg the school, GP etc but the more info the better to help the child

Of what? Nobody knows who the person is! There is NO info.

Original poster
worryingminnie · 01/03/2018 14:41

There's no need to defend me honestly - I did something which was 100% more than any of the other 50 apple watching. I know it wasn't enough - I wouldn't be so bloody angry with myself if I didn't feel that.

OP posts:
OnionKnight · 01/03/2018 14:44

The OP can do fuck all unfortunately.

Phoning schools is a waste of time.

taratill · 01/03/2018 14:45

OP I think you have to let it go. If she has behaved like this on public transport and this is how she always is then people will be aware of it.

I have an autistic child and once he was trying to escape my moving car and steer me into on coming traffic. I was on a dual carriage way with no hard and a car next to me thought I was attacking my son, I was not I was just trying to stop him from getting to the steering wheel and gear stick.

They wound window down and said they would be reporting me. I pulled over got us safe and phoned the police myself.

I'm only mentioning this because things are not always how they appear to onlookers.

If the child was well dressed and warm then she's caring for his basic needs. I hope therefore that this was just a bad day.

Marriageoftrueminds · 01/03/2018 14:46

Tinkywinky i work in education, I’m curious to know why you think my suggestion is silly - since I have seen exactly this happen, and this is what we advise people to do. It can really help build up a wider picture of how a child is being treated. To answer your specific questions:

They have no way of identifying the child - well of course not if he doesn’t go there. But if the child attends their school they will recognise the description. Just as if I described a child/adult you knew well and saw every day, saying where I had seen them which you know is their route home, you would recognise the description. You would need to phone a few schools, but as I said the catchment areas there are small so it’s not such a long shot that you might find the right one.

Pass on what to who? - pass on the description of what OP saw, to their school safeguarding officer, who will decide what to do with the info.

user1474652148 · 01/03/2018 14:48

If it makes you feel any better this mother will continue this behaviour elsewhere publicly I am certain ( at school etc) orba neighbour and someone that knows them will report her to ss.
You may have made thing me even worse intervening, that said I think we could all do with being a little less polite.
There is nothing wrong going over and saying is everything okay. She honestly sounds past caring, so doubt you would have had an impact beyond making yourself feel better.
I was that child once and my father would have made me pay for any humiliation he endured ten times over and would have blamed me. I survived and am happy well rounded adult ( of sorts ) he will be okay

GreatDuckCookery6211 · 01/03/2018 14:48

No point in being angry OP. When you're in the middle of something like this it's very hard to know exactly what to do, I think it's natural to wait for other people to speak up first.

Once I did speak to a man who was swearing at his young child in the supermarket next to me at the self checkout. He was really aggressive to me and stormed off. I worried that I'd made it worse for the child tbh. All I could do do was hope that he reflected on what I'd said later on. I highly doubt it though.

MsGameandWatching · 01/03/2018 14:49

It's dangerous to intervene. My Mum would have been ten times more angry at being challenged and we'd have paid for it when we got home. I was asked if I was ok once and she was terrifying with rage. The only time I ever told anyone and they challenged my Mum she came home and went utterly bat shit on me and so did my Dad once she had told him. Disloyal to the family you see 😒

tinkywinky2018 · 01/03/2018 14:49

Tinkywinky i work in education, I’m curious to know why you think my suggestion is silly

Hi school, I saw (incident) yesterday, child might be about 4, dressed in hat and coat.
Yes sure, we know exactly who you mean, we'll get onto SS right away and make sure it goes on Xs file!

WTF?

Original poster
worryingminnie · 01/03/2018 14:50

I just hope he's old enough to be at school and not stuck with her all day.

She asked if he was missing his sister - he didn't answer (obviously).

OP posts:
ivehadtonamechangeforthis · 01/03/2018 14:52

Hmmm as a commuter I've seen things I wished I'd spoken up at the time but didn't and it bothered me afterwards.

I saw a girl begging at Waterloo, looked about 15/16, I was running late for work so didn't stop but it bothered me for months afterwards because she looked so vulnerable, such easy prey, I wondered if she'd fallen in to the wrong hands. That was about 20 years and I've never forgotten it!

Unfortunately the time to intervene was as you sat witnessing what was happening. It is too late now. They've gone. You don't know who they are or where they live. Her behaviour sounds awful but hopefully the fact he was dressed for the weather is a sign that he is well looked after and it was just the end of a stressful day. That would NOT justify her behaviour to me but I'm hoping she was just having a rare bad day.

RhiWrites · 01/03/2018 14:52

OP you can contact social services for the area and describe the mother and child in as much detail as possible.

Probably they will be not be able to identify these people but if they are already known to the service it will add a data point.

jessei · 01/03/2018 14:53

This is really sad!

Mummyoflittledragon · 01/03/2018 14:54

I have read it is best to say words of consolation to the child, not the adult. I don’t think there is anything else you can do unfortunately.

Marriageoftrueminds · 01/03/2018 14:56

tinkywinky, I’m sure you can appreciate that the OP would be able to give much more information than what you suggest above, as she heard the parent and child and watched them for some time, and schools know their kids and families well. They will likely already have concerns. They will know where their families live and how they commute - ie getting the train. They will recognise the details if they know the child. That’s what we do. All school members are trained in safeguarding and have extremely robust systems in place to recognise and support vulnerable families and children.

So I’m passing on that advice to the OP in the hope it can help, it may not work if she doesn’t hit upon the right school, but it’s the best option she has right now. I’m sorry you don’t agree but nonetheless that’s my advice.

Good luck OP.

chirpyburbycheapsheep · 01/03/2018 15:01

If the child was well dressed and warm then she's caring for his basic needs. I hope therefore that this was just a bad day.

And that's why so much emotional abuse can go unreported. That is unbelievably ill informed. There can be instances of terrible abuse against the most 'well cared for' looking child. I suspect we cling onto the fact he was wearing suitable clothing to make ourselves feel better at a really awful situation so we can say 'I'm sure it's not that bad'.

Flowers for you, OP. Try not to beat yourself up about it.