...to have said no?

[BabsPym1]

7 year old DS is very wilful. Says no a lot. We've had thick snow but easing up. He wanted to wear shorts to school...it escalated into a row where I snapped, shouted, he cried. So I said fine. Then he said no to getting ready in the time frame I asked him to. Another mini row. Then he wanted to wear a particular pair of boots to school, take his school shoes, and two pairs of footie boots for his club (not knowing if it would be outside or inside). I refused, saying 4 pairs of shoes to school is too much, especially when he's got form for losing everything.

So I'm saying no. He's saying no. We're arguing. It's horrible. He's saying he hates me, I'm the worst mum.

And I'm thinking, should I have just said fine, and avoided the confrontation?

Honestly, I really have no idea how to avoid these spats without capitulating.

He’s 7, not 3 - he should be growing out of this behaviour by now. You’re the adult!
It’s cold, he can’t wear shorts it’s common sense.

As you were being wishy washy over the shorts (are you in a hot place coz it's - 5 here?!) he pushed for his own way with the boots also. Clear instructions on a morning will make for an easier day imo. At 7 I would be handing out consequences for him shouting at me too.

Yes, but he can't bear being told to do something. It's like he has to find his own (Natural consequences). I can't bear always having to do that - especially in a hurry - but I worry that my way of responding is making the situ worse

But I shouted too. That's my point. I know where he's going wrong, but how much of it is about me?

You are not saying no enough.
Does he have consequences for bad behaviour?

At times I shout at my dc to follow instructions. They don't shout back they do what I have asked. I am wondering how you are going to manage a teenager tbh.

I have a shorts loving child too. We had an agreement (aka I told him in advance) that he had to wear trousers when snow was lying on the ground. I don't mean a little dusting obviously but 'proper' snow.
But I suspect we came to that arrangement after a morning like yours .

April 'I am wondering how you are going to manage a teenager tbh.'

HOW HELPFUL IS THAT COMMENT?

We do have consequences for bad behaviour. I think I'm quite strict. But there are situations when I say no, he pushes, and for some reason it spirals.

Well if a 7 year old can run rings around you...

Meh if they want to wear shorts I'd let them. Ds only owns school shorts and wears them whether it is warm or snowy. If he gets cold that's the natural consequence of the choice they make

Thanks Lady S.

I don't understand Mumsnet sometimes. I came on here, clearly knowing I was getting things wrong, and snide comments and predictions about my future parenting are just totally unhelpful and say more about the poster than they do about me. If you have nothing helpful to post, please say nothing.

You need to get that foot of yours placed firmly down ASAP. Shouting back at you is a no no NO! Do not accept that. It's a slippery slope. He's 7. You're in charge and make sure he knows it. The only decisions he should be making are of the choices you set.

I actually hate the term "pick your battles" if I'm honest. My children are to do what I say. I give them options but I don't allow them to get away with what could be seen as less important (but important to me), things like shorts on icy cold days. If they can go against my wishes and "win" that battle, why should they care about the bigger stuff?

If you've said no to something, you need to stick to that. Everything turns I to a battle otherwise.

And I completely agree with PP - there needs to be consequences for when he shouts at you and when he isn't doing as he's told.

No choices on school mornings. Uniforms are put on the sofa for DS2 and the bed for DD, if they wear boots they give them to me in the playground, because they never remember to put them back on anyway, when DD did football she just wore trainers, as they have an all-weather pitch. She just left her PE kit at school and brought it home after club.

Yes, we let him wear shorts most of the time. Even on really cold days. He doesn't seem to care. But today it was so cold and he would be throwing and receiving snowballs and I worried it was a step too far. But I handled it badly.

Yes, I need to be consistent. I struggle with it. It's a war of attrition with him. Some kids accept no. To him, it's like a red rag to a bull.

Just have everything ready the night before. That's what your wearing.. end of ! I wish I could take my own advice as mornings are often chotic to say the least And to agree to shorts on a day like this is just bonkers ..his little legs will freeze !

@19lottie82 - It’s cold, he can’t wear shorts it’s common sense

Depends on the child. My dd wore shorts to school every day throughout primary school, even when the temperature was below zero. She was more comfortable that way. Thankfully, the secondary she attends has a skirt option so she wears that with socks in order to keep cool.

Op - you need to pick your battles. What's the worst thing that can happen if he wears shorts? He feels cold and doesn't do it again.

Re the boots - I agree, 4 pairs is too many. However, if he loses them, do you make him pay for them out of his pocket money? That might deter him the next time. Or don't replace them (I know that wouldn't work for school or sport shoes).

Another option is to get him to organise his stuff the night before. Then, when it becomes apparent he doesn't know whether soccer is indoors or outdoors, you could text the coach to find out. Advance organisation would also reduce the pressure on you in the morning and make you less likely to overreact.

You have to step back from the arguing rather than get caught up in it. You need to be calm and not get drawn back in.
"I've said no and I'm not going to discuss it any further. You've been rude and we will discuss the consequences of that when you calm down" then walk away. He will probably still kick off but often I found that eventually they will calm down and accept they've been unreasonable, even maybe apologise off their own bat. Then you can think of the consequence.

When the red mist of rage has descended over them there is no point in saying anything. They are incapable of hearing anything you threaten and incapable of hearing logic. I could have grounded my son for the whole of his life in incremental stages during an argument and it would have had no effect whatsoever. But he would be absolutely fine with a consequence later on when the red mist had lifted. So walk away from the argument but stick to your guns or if he gets away with it at the time make sure there is a consequence for not doing as he is told.

perhaps the posters smirking and raising eyebrows could offer helpful advice instead?

You weren’t wrong to say no. Sometimes confrontation is unavoidable and your son has to learn how to cope with being told no.

There is certainly a lot to be said for picking your battles but that also comes alongside knowing that when you say no you mean it.

If you feel bad have a chat to him later about it and apologise for shouting but don’t apologise for giving firm boundaries

Childless person here so feel free to attack me. However, I just wanted to pass on a maxim of my German auntie's (who was a kindergarten teacher and highly regarded by pupils and parents as such): "Your "no" should be "no" and your "yes" should be "yes".

yanbu to have said no. He is 7 - you are the parent. We have all become a bit shouty on occasion. You can't capitulate to a 7yr old. He is 7 - you can't just say 'ok crack on son' to avoid the confrontation.

Ugh. ‘Natural consequences’

You’re the parent. There’s going to be times when you have to make the decisions and he’s not going to like it. Most children don’t! What’s the worst he’s going to do if you say no and stick to it? By all means pick your battles but you also need to get stubborn.

mrsjoyful I live by that, but they still think they can wear me down (they can't).