To think it's not the end of the world if you can't have children?

[Jaygee61]

I speak as one who couldn't. Ttc for 10 years. It broke my heart. But I healed. I have a different perspective on things now. I feel there were worse things that could have befallen us, being diagnosed terminal cancer (OH did have cancer but it eas treatable fortunately) motor neuron disease, being paralysed in an accident. We live lives of joy and dignity.. We have created a great marriage and I'm proud of that. I love spending time with my nephew.

But society seems to view being childless by choice as a fate worse than death. Something not to be accepted but fought against at all cost. . If you're not prepared to go to any lengths to have a child you can't have really wanted one in the first place....

It’s the oddest thing though, the crippling want some people have, and others not.

My DH desperately wanted kids. I didn’t. We had some, I love them.

But I never desperately wanted them and I can’t imagine ever wanting anything that badly. It’s awful and I feel desperately for anyone who can’t get past it.

I have travelled to lots of exotic places on holiday and seen many parents with kids there

YABU

I struggled to have my DS. 2.5 years then a round of IVF that failed. Thank god my frozen cycle worked.

It would have been the end of my world if I couldn't have a child (or children but have had more IVF which hasn't worked for me yet). I would've committed suicide if I didn't have DS. No word of a lie.

What always puzzles me is the different response to people who want a child and can't. Someone with fertility issues preventing it is rightfully given sympathy, but someone single or financially not in the right place, with time running out is meant to just suck it up and get over it.

As to childless by choice, I think some parents have difficulty separating not having their living, breathing, loved dc, and not having dc in a general sense. Personally I view childless by a choice in the same way I view my decision to only have one.

Naturally my life would be misery without my dd in it, but I'm not missing out because I don't have a second child. Sure there would be pleasure, but there would be disadvantages too, which for me wouldn't make it a preference. As a young mum I definitely wouldn't want to wait & start round 2 as an older mum when dd is an adult. I imagine that childless by choice is a very similar decision.

How society views it puzzles me too. Dd is a teen now and will be in her 20's when I'm in my 40's, and I already get positive comments about my freedom compared to peers with young dc. I'm pretty confident that by mid 40's my independence will be viewed as a positive, whereas a woman that age who chose not to have dc is quite often thought to have missed out, with independence viewed as second best. When really our lifestyles will be similar at that point.

We all miss out on some life experiences.

YANBU OP. I'm infertile and I've found a path in life that is fulfilling for me, and I have plenty of friends who don't have dc and are happy with the situation. Yes, it's definitely meant I've had more financial freedom and a chance to focus on my career, in ways that my siblings who have dc, haven't been able to. I have travelled a lot (and to many places where it would be unsafe to travel with a family) but I don't drink much alcohol these days, and I don't have pale carpets . We spent some time and money on fertility treatments years ago but it definitely isn't the end of the world that they didn't work - I don't feel any sense of void in my life and I have put that time behind me.

My family live abroad, I used to visit them 3-4 times a year. All my parent friends used to tell me I would never be able to do that with kids as though this was a positive to being childless. And how nice it must be to get to see my nieces and nephews and how I had the best of both worlds

I still visit them as regularly as DD. Yes, it might be less regular when she starts school. But given a choice between 2 visits a year with a child and 3 visits a year with no child, it's kind of a no brainier

Tips - I'm writing this because I could have written your message myself not so long ago.

Well, maybe not the bit about the perfect home. But the stuff about the overwhelming sadness and devastation of it. And feeling like I would never get over it, or that it would shape me forever. I think IVF, in particular, is an awful, awful experience to have; I actually would go so far as to call it a major trauma for those who do not find a 'happy ending' at the end of the trial. I found it particularly difficult when I had lots of friends with very small children under 2.

However, I have come to feel, as time has passed, that I've actually dodged a bullet. My friends with kids - with one or two exceptions who have not chosen the normal middle class path - their lives are boring. They don't go out much, they spend their lives in a circle of pretty unending and thankless toil, ferrying their kids from pillar to post, their relationships are almost uniformly not what they used to be - and nor are their sex lives!! Weekends and holidays revolve around doing boring child-friendly stuff, or lying on a beach because they are too exhausted to do anything more exciting. Half of them spend their time trying to rationalise the misery by looking down snootily on the childless like any life outside of theirs is somehow really immature or unrewarding (witness all those on Mumsnet who are confirmed teetotalers who just can't see the appeal of dining in a restaurant ), the other half are more honest (and more likeable) and admit that, while they love their kids, it can be really unhappy at times.

I don't think it's true, either, that the "highs" of kids are higher, and the lows lower. That's just another rationalisation. There's tons of joy in life without kids, if you just make your own values.

Everyone’s experience is highly personal and I find it incredible that so many people can’t understand that:

• not being able to have children is the end of the world for some people, at the very least during the time when they are experiencing infertility, treatment, miscarriage etc. it takes time to heal and recover.

• that being childless can be incredibly positive but only after you have come to terms with it, if not by choice. People’s worth is not and should not be based on their ability to have children, but so much in society doesn’t help that view.

• that not everyone can have or wants the stereotypical child-free life that is expected of them.

• that others may feel differently to them about the importance of children in their lives. If you regret being a parent, that’s fine too but it’s a choice that you were able to make. The powerlessness of infertility is crippling - you can’t plan anything, and you have few choices.

• if you’re thinking about how much better your life/marriage would have been without kids, I’m assuming you’re not imagining the scenario where you spent your life savings on ivf and five years of your life ttc, and all you have to show for it is a little box they gave you at the hospital containing a small teddy bear and the scan picture taken the moment you found out your baby had in fact died inside you. That is not a winning situation for any marriage, I can assure you.

I do think that those posters who have come out the other side of infertility should be absolutely proud of their lives, of themselves and of where they have got to, but please don’t forget that others might not reach the place you have got to, or are still on their way to it.

Interesting about the comment those who struggled ttc then had a difficult first year etc...
This is what we experienced not sure if it is related to the ivf/our slightly older ages/the genetic cause of the infertility or the stress and anxiety of 2+yrs infertility 9m of doing ivf them a very stressful 9m of pg. No telling what affect that has on the baby. I know how i felt would have been unlike people who conceived easily

Of course you can, it just takes more planning

of course you can . You can appreciate that not everybody has the budget for it and that families have other priorities and a lot less disposable income.
You also get a much bigger mortgage with no kids than with them. It's not a judgement of value, it's a basic fact. You can have a career, but not everybody can afford a 25k a year nanny.

Why does everything has to turn in a competition? It's not helping anyone to dismiss issues and problems people with children have.

The point is that it would be horrendous for anyone to say (and think!) that your life is worthless if you can't have children, and there's no point carrying on. Of course it's not, not having kids doesn't make you any less and no one should live through their children anyway!

This does not apply to all individuals. But on average research shows those without kids are happier than those with kids.

You’re supposed to travel, even if you’ve fuck all interest in travelling.

Travel, sleep late and drink alcohol.

LOL, that is what parents think hey woudl be doing if they didn't have children. But with out the broken nights.. you don't need to sleep late. And without the stress of children.. you don't need to reach for 'gin o'clock.

I have travelled to lots of exotic places on holiday and seen many parents with kids there

Well... yeah.

But if you have to pay for yourself to go to Thailand.... or you have to pay for yourself and 2 children (and go in school holidays) - guess which one costs more so you can't do as frequently?

Great post @ShottaSherrif

This does not apply to all individuals. But on average research shows those without kids are happier than those with kids.

I’m not surprised to read that, tbh.

I'm not making a competition of it, of course personal circumstances are going to be difficultly for everyone.

What I am saying is that for me, in my situation, having a child has not left me unable to visit my relatives abroad or continue working. I could have told you that before I was a parent. And that is why being told, hey, I'm childless but at least I can carry on flying home a few times a year and having a career, was pretty much the most unhelpful thing those parent friends could have said to me.

Because obviously all childless folk are stress free and full of energy..

@twinkledag

I completely understand. After 5 cycles of IVF I was standing on the edge and there is only my husband and parents to thank for me not 'jumping off'. Thankfully the 6th cycle worked but I would have carried on trying till the clinic no longer let me cycle.

I think it has to be for individuals themselves to decide if it's the end of the world for them or not.

I found out at a fairly young age (12) that I would probably never have children. As a result, I kind of viewed it like climbing Everest, becoming Prime Minister or winning an Olympic Gold medal. Kind of cool if it happened, but highly unlikely and therefore not something to particular desire or yearn for.

'However, I have come to feel, as time has passed, that I've actually dodged a bullet. My friends with kids - with one or two exceptions who have not chosen the normal middle class path - their lives are boring. '

That's a brave thing to write, but I agree with you! 'Dodged a bullet' is increasingly how I feel, now I'm coming out the other side of the grief. I was consumed with envy when my friend had her children, absolutely knocked sideways by it. Now looking at her life with a 2 year old and a 5 year old (and a controlling husband, just for extra fun), I am so grateful that is not my life. I have imagined so many times how my life (our lives) would change if we had a child and these days it makes me feel panicky!

So we are back to: kids aren’t that great anyway,

It’s the oddest thing though, the crippling want some people have, and others not.

This. I tried to get pregnant for five years, saw some of my friends be devastated. I was upset when we decided to draw a line and move on, but...I'm fine, really. It would have been lovely and life changing, but I guess I quite like my life as it is.

I'm at the point where I have accepted that I am childless, I am not TTC anymore, there will never be a child. It is a relief to put those raw TTC days behind me. Has the world ended? No, but it bears no resemblance to the world I had envisaged for myself and at times it hurts like buggery but not all the time anymore. Life has gone on. That said, if someone had told me all that I would have to go through and the years of pain I would probably have hurled myself under a bus.

Oddly the logical part of my brain does believe that life is probably better without children, less of a slog. I do believe that my marriage is easier too (the fact that it survived infertility means that it is strong) but that doesn't stop my heart wanting children or my life feeling empty and meaningless. It doesn't make me feel any less like I have failed at something most others find so easy. I will always feel like I am looking in at the world through a window. Also to clarify, as someone else up thread said, our childless life looks a lot like everyone else's ;life, it just doesn't have children in it. We are doing all the same mundane stuff. I am not on some perpetual exotic holiday or burning fivers in the garden of the house that is every shade of white & cream.