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As far as Nunes can tell, none of us have even met with Trump

985 replies

PerkingFaintly · 05/02/2018 22:23

Devin Nunes Gets A Pretty Basic Fact Wrong In Defending His Memo
Nunes suggested that Donald Trump had never met with George Papadopoulos. There's a photo of them sitting at the same table.
www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/devin-nunes-memo_us_5a788b57e4b01fe513a60603

And we certainly didn't have a national security meeting right here:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3150505-The-one-in-which-Trump-orders-his-staff-to-fire-Mueller-and-they-give-him-the-finger?pg=1

OP posts:
Thread gallery
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OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 09:10

On the security clearances:

Third White House official resigns after being told he wouldn’t qualify for full clearance

National Economic Council official George David Banks departed amid increasing scrutiny of the Trump administration's decision to let multiple staffers work on interim clearances.

www.politico.com/story/2018/02/14/third-white-house-official-resigns-after-being-told-he-wouldnt-qualify-for-full-clearance-409246

[slowly ratcheting up pressure on Kushner]

And

John Dean
@JohnWDean
Trump’s staff is not concerned about national security secrets. They know their boss could not get a Security Clearance if he was not POTUS. It is only surprising Trump has not quietly granted them all waivers, rather allowed the problem to become a scandal. #WorstPOTUSever!

Palace intrigue:

Kyle Griffin
@kylegriffin1
Five sources in and outside of the White House tell The Daily Beast that Scaramucci has been in direct contact with Trump over at least the last month; three of those sources say Scaramucci has received phone calls from Trump recently.

www.thedailybeast.com/anthony-scaramucci-and-the-trump-b-team-plot-revenge-with-john-kelly-faltering

And

(I know the article was posted on here yesterday but note the similarities)

"The president, Priebus said, speaks with him often on a phone that is unmonitored by John Kelly, who replaced him as Trump’s chief of staff—sometimes just to chat, sometimes for counsel."

www.vanityfair.com/news/2018/02/reince-priebus-opens-up-about-his-six-months-of-magical-thinking

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 09:27

Katelyn Polantz
@kpolantz
HIGH DRAMA among the lawyers at Rick Gates/Manafort hearing this a.m.: Tom Green sauntered into the courtroom as public was exiting (first time we’ve seen him at court or with Gates).
He whisked Gates away to chat privately—without Gates’ trial lawyers.

edition.cnn.com/2018/01/23/politics/rick-gates-new-attorney-mueller-russia-investigation/index.html [article is from last month but gives background]

And

Manu Raju
@mkraju
MORE DETAILS about Hill’s standoff with Bannon. WH sends letter late tonight to lawmakers explaining why the transition period can be covered by executive privilege. Rs have so far pushed back on that notion. Will they now? latest w/@KaraScannell.

House panel weighs contempt if Bannon fails to show for Thursday hearing

edition.cnn.com/2018/02/14/politics/bannon-contempt-hearing/index.html

Unlike Bannon, GOP does NOT want to subpoena Lewandowksi for not coming back to committee. Several GOP members say his answers were sufficient; Ds say Lewandowski wouldn’t answer questions about topics after he left Trump campaign in June 2016

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 09:31

Immigration bill

Maggie Haberman‏Verified account
@maggieNYT
In other news, a senior administration official says the White House is “actively considering issuing a veto threat” against the Rounds immigration bill.

This is the bipartisan bill that a group of senators have been working on

Alan Rappeport
@arappeport
More Alan Rappeport Retweeted Maggie Haberman
So much for “my positions are going to be what the people in this room come up with.”

Also

Greg Sargent
@ThePlumLineGS
NEW:

A spokesperson for a large organization of Dreamers tells me Dems must be ready to walk away if Trump continues to use them as ransom to extract the Stephen Miller/nativist wish list:

Democrats must be ready to take this drastic step against Trump
www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2018/02/14/its-time-for-democrats-to-take-this-drastic-step-against-trump/?utm_term=.5df799581721

And

Manu Raju‏Verified account
@mkraju
Despite bipartisan deal, chances are extremely low for any of these immigration bills to become law. There's little consensus bw House Rs/Senate Rs/WH about what they'd accept + plus Dems are not willing to give nearly as much as WH wants - keeping issue alive ahead of midterms

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 09:38

GOP drama (this is flippant I know - how Grassley so blithely put out in the public domain that he "protected Sessions" is beyond me):

ChuckGrassley‏Verified account
@ChuckGrassley
Incensed by Sessions letter An attempt to undermine Grassley/Durbin/Lee BIPARTISAN criminal justice reforms This bill deserves thoughtful consideration b4 my cmte. AGs execute laws CONGRESS WRITES THEM!

Manu Raju
@mkraju
More Manu Raju Retweeted ChuckGrassley
Grassley not happy with Sessions

Also

Steven Dennis‏Verified account
@StevenTDennis
Grassley tells me he's incensed at Jeff Sessions for torching his sentencing overhaul after Grassley stood up for him when Trump wanted to fire him and after he protected Sessions for months from Democratic demands for public hearings on Russia.

'Incensed' Grassley Rips Sessions for Torching Justice Overhaul

www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2018-02-15/-incensed-grassley-rips-sessions-for-torching-justice-overhaul?__twitter_impression=true

Notable: Grassley also told me he has met with White House officials multiple times in his office and at the White House sympathetic to his bill but feel "corralled" by Sessions and a president who hasn't dug in on the issue. Wouldn't say who (I asked if Kushner or Ivanka)

Grassley said he didn't even get a headsup that Sessions was going to send his letter; Grassley also slams on substance. Says overhaul would save money, improve fairness and outcomes. Key committee votes tomorrow.

Grassley said criminal justice bill was put on shelf in 2016 to protect 5-6 vulnerable Republican senators; says that's not the case with the map this cycle. And says Trump needs bipartisan wins and this would give him one.

Manu Raju
@mkraju
More Manu Raju Retweeted Steven Dennis
Grassley says he’s protected Sessions from Dems and defended him against Trump attacks .... and this is how he repays him?

And Hmm

David Jolly
@DavidJollyFL
Trey Gowdy on why he's leaving Congress: "I like jobs where facts matter."

PerkingFaintly · 15/02/2018 09:40

WH sends letter late tonight to lawmakers explaining why the transition period can be covered by executive privilege.

It's almost as if they have something to hide...

OP posts:
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 09:48

Shock what are you suggesting perking? That they might not be entirely trustworthy or honorable?

Twitter deleted 200,000 Russian troll tweets. Read them here.
Twitter doesn't make it easy to track Russian propaganda efforts — this database can help

www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/now-available-more-200-000-deleted-russian-troll-tweets-n844731?cid=sm_npd_nn_tw_ma

Also

Molly McKew
@MollyMcKew
This article on impact, or not, of "fake news" appeared in @nytimes couple days ago. While I respect author's point re needing evidence/data & not speculation -- the data provided doesn't answer questions on the impact of fake news. This is important /1

www.nytimes.com/2018/02/13/upshot/fake-news-and-bots-may-be-worrisome-but-their-political-power-is-overblown.html

There are three broad characterizations that miss the mark in this analysis:

1-- that the content in question is political advertising or comparable to political advertising. It is not. The content in question was often not branded political advertising. /2

The content was video, visual, memetic, & text elements contributing to narrative themes, conspiracies, character attacks. It wasn't sponsored by a candidate or PAC, so it was absent the label that allows people to reject or accept its source as easily. This difference matters /3

2 -- it uses the idea of "persuadability" as the metric of concern. It's not. The metric of concern is activation. This is why targeting a hardened 10% is more effective than trying to persuade people to change their minds. /4

In strict voter turnout terms, a radicalized base is more powerful than most other factors /5

This is mirrored, for example, in the Manafort strategies to win Ukraine for Yanukovych and the US for Trump. They were never going to win the swing voters. They just needed an activated core. /6

However, would also note that persuasion using social media is very effective. Especially when it is matched with data-driven psychological profiling/targeting that is sending one of 100,000 unique pieces of content to your eyeballs that is meant specifically to convince you /7

This kind of content targeting cannot be compared to "advertising" or "political advertising." Most of the time it isn't showing up as an ad, but native content posted by someone you know, or some account an algorithm thinks you might like. Algorithms can be gamed /8

"Bots" and other influencer accounts, for example, can be designed to influence specific groups and thus game specific factors to trick the algorithms into amplifying them. /9

So, while persuadability is the wrong metric -- persuasion via social media also can't be estimated via in simplistic ways; it required looking at network effects. It is about the impact of a complex media environment with many layers and inputs, and its impact over time. /10

3 the idea that it's hard to know how many people were exposed to disinfo, or actually saw it. Coming to a concrete number is, of course, not realistic. But again - the issue is the network effect /11

The question is not "how many people looked at X misinformation website". It is "what is the idea/narrative that was on X website that made it into mainstream media, influencers, verified accts, etc". Not a numeric evaluation, but a "mainstreaming" one -- /12

did specific disinformation or conspiracies bleed into news sources or amplifiers who legitimized it? /13

There aren't good tools to evaluate the impact of shadow campaigns.
Anyone trying to tell you there was little impact on political views from these tools doesn't know. Because none of us know. No one has looked. Social media companies don't want us to, and obfuscate. /14

What we do know: social media is pretty good at radicalizing people.
There isn't much evidence it is good at deradicalizing people.
Confirmation bias is powerful, and commonly used in these kinds of operations. /15

Information warfare is not "fake news" and "bots". The holistic information environment and the narrative it constructs via specific storytelling vehicles to achieve subversive goals and activation is what must be evaluated. /16

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 09:51

Kyle Griffin
@kylegriffin1
In a new election security report, House Democrats' Election Security Task Force says state and local officials lack the necessary funds to safeguard voting infrastructure. In some cases, Governors are actively undermining election security efforts.

democrats-homeland.house.gov/sites/democrats.homeland.house.gov/files/documents/TFESReport.pdf

PerkingFaintly · 15/02/2018 09:52

From that Bloomberg link www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2018-02-15/-incensed-grassley-rips-sessions-for-torching-justice-overhaul?__twitter_impression=true

He had a tough nomination, a tough hearing in my committee," Grassley, an Iowa Republican, said in an interview in his Capitol Hill office.

"They wanted to call him back every other day for additional hearings about his Russian connection, and I shut them off of that until we had the normal oversight hearing in October I believe it was, see?

So... what does that mean? That additional hearings about Sessions' Russia connection were delayed, or that they were reduced by not giving them time?

If it's the latter, that looks bad for Grassley. These weren't hearings about whether Sessions had mowed his lawn after 8 pm: they were about how much a hostile foreign power was influencing the government.

OP posts:
TheClaws · 15/02/2018 10:10

Actually, it is a weapon issue, and a gun problem. Those with mental health issues - or anyone, really, without a licence - should not have easy access to weapons. Fox, of course, is attempting to muddy to waters.

Fox News @FoxNews 3 hrs
More
Aaron Cohen: "This is a security issue; it's not a weapon issue. That kid had parents. Where's the parents? Who raised this kid? What was going on in the house? ...There is a mental health epidemic here, which is being confused for a gun problem."

TheNorthWestPawsage · 15/02/2018 10:13
Sad Heard the word “tragedy” 100 times already about the school shooting - not really, by the classical definition: tragedy is fated and inevitable. This isn’t inevitable. This is America. twitter.com/billmaher/status/963882790897950720
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 10:18

Maddow noted that the sheriff and other government officials said they weren’t going to talk about the details but when pressed on the role of guns, quickly deflected to mental health issues, despite not having made any statements about the shooters mental health. This from family guy won’t stop being relevant for awhile, sadly (I know it’s been posted on these threads numerous times)

As far as Nunes can tell, none of us have even met with Trump
TheNorthWestPawsage · 15/02/2018 10:27

Don't have a source to credit for this, but ...

As far as Nunes can tell, none of us have even met with Trump
Roussette · 15/02/2018 11:50

Ditto with this one

As far as Nunes can tell, none of us have even met with Trump
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 13:28

Kushner Investors Subpoenaed by U.S. Tax Authorities, Source Says

www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2018-02-15/kushner-investors-said-to-be-subpoenaed-by-u-s-tax-authorities?__twitter_impression=true

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 13:31

And with wearying predictability, here comes that narrative

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
So many signs that the Florida shooter was mentally disturbed, even expelled from school for bad and erratic behavior. Neighbors and classmates knew he was a big problem. Must always report such instances to authorities, again and again!

[it is worth noting that trump ended gun checks with people with mental illnesses]

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 13:34

NRA-PVF
@NRAPVF
The NRA-PVF is proud to endorse @JudgeScrenock for the #Wisconsin Supreme Court. It’s important that all pro #2A voters get to the polls on Feb. 20 and elect Judge Michael Screnock to the state Supreme Court! #wipolitics #2A

www.nraila.org/articles/20180213/nra-endorses-screnock-for-state-supreme-court

Olga_Lautman NYC ✨
@olgaNYC1211
Perfect example of politicians being bought..

Supreme Court potentials should NOT be entangled with the NRA!

We need to get the @NRA away from politics if we want to stop these mass murders. These are our kids!

#ParklandSchoolShooting #GunControlNow

TheNorthWestPawsage · 15/02/2018 13:43

BBC News website has interview with17 year old who was student at Florida school. He may be too young to vote but I doubt when his time comes he'll support the NRA.

Excerpts:
David is a student journalist, so started interviewing people, using his phone to record them.
"I figured, if I died, at least this [the recording] would be passed on to other people, so these voices would echo on."
David tried to stay calm and help others. The classroom had two doors: if the shooter entered one, he thought, they could escape through another.
But he knew that might not be enough. "I realised I may not survive," he says. "It was going through everybody's minds at some point."

In the early hours of Thursday, David was still outside the school where 17 people died hours earlier.
"I feel a mix of anger, sadness, but mostly passion," he says.
"I don't want this to ever happen to anyone else again. The fact is there are 17 families that now have empty rooms…
"These are people's kids. They've poured all the love, everything they could ever get, into these kids. And it's all been taken by one piece of metal, and bled out onto the floor."

BiglyBadgers · 15/02/2018 13:48

[it is worth noting that trump ended gun checks with people with mental illnesses]

This is exactly my thought! So he had a mental illness. What are they doing to make it harder for people with a mental illness to get hold of guns? At the moment they don't check for mental health issues in the person owning the gun or others in their home. In my view having a mental illness and suggesting that this person did not have capacity or was a known risk to others puts the onus even more on government to introduce controls that protect them and those around them. Mental health is not an excuse for not having gun controls it is an argument for why they are so important! Angry

lionheart · 15/02/2018 13:49

That'll do it.

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account
@realDonaldTrump

So many signs that the Florida shooter was mentally disturbed, even expelled from school for bad and erratic behavior. Neighbors and classmates knew he was a big problem. Must always report such instances to authorities, again and again!

lionheart · 15/02/2018 13:55

'Nikolas Cruz, 19, had been expelled from Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School for ‘‘disciplinary reasons,’’ Broward County Sheriff Scott Israel said, but he insisted he didn’t know the specifics. Math teacher Jim Gard told the Miami Herald that before Wednesday’s fatal shooting of 17 people, Cruz may have been identified as a potential threat - Gard believes the school had sent out an email warning teachers that Cruz shouldn’t be allowed on campus with a backpack.'

www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2018/02/14/florida-school-shooting-suspect-made-disturbing-social-media-posts/In8NVjDOX68Xl7QYHTibdL/story.html?s_campaign=bostonglobe%3Asocialflow%3Atwitter

Roussette · 15/02/2018 14:01

I'm sick to death of reading tweets saying something along the lines of...

'when will people realise it's not the guns but the people that are the problem'

A cop out. Safety measures work (like banning automatic rifles)

So when car crashes occur, it's not the car but the person driving it that's the problem. Why bother with airbags and safety belts then because if everyone drove carefully there'd be no road fatalities.