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As far as Nunes can tell, none of us have even met with Trump

985 replies

PerkingFaintly · 05/02/2018 22:23

Devin Nunes Gets A Pretty Basic Fact Wrong In Defending His Memo
Nunes suggested that Donald Trump had never met with George Papadopoulos. There's a photo of them sitting at the same table.
www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/devin-nunes-memo_us_5a788b57e4b01fe513a60603

And we certainly didn't have a national security meeting right here:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3150505-The-one-in-which-Trump-orders-his-staff-to-fire-Mueller-and-they-give-him-the-finger?pg=1

OP posts:
Thread gallery
54
TheNorthWestPawsage · 14/02/2018 21:47

Mr. Do As I Say, Not As I Do

3 Trump properties posted 144 openings for seasonal jobs. Only one went to a US worker.
“America First” doesn’t seem to apply to the president’s own businesses.
www.vox.com/2018/2/13/16466542/trump-h-2b-guest-workers

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 14/02/2018 22:26

Fuck. This is the 18th school shooting in 2018. And there have been fatalities tonight Sad

lettuceWrap · 14/02/2018 22:38

Shocking to hear the news about the latest school shooting Sad

On Twitter, people (bots?), are already decrying those who are “politicising” the shooting by suggesting there needs to be legislative change.

Sleipnirthewonderhorse · 14/02/2018 22:48

Who needs legislative change when you have thoughts and prayers?

lettuceWrap · 14/02/2018 23:03

Oh yes, there are plenty of thoughts and prayers...

lionheart · 14/02/2018 23:04

I really don't know how it is tolerated.

lionheart · 14/02/2018 23:13

'China and Russia are challenging the military supremacy of America and its allies and the West can no longer rely on the strategic advantage it has enjoyed until now, a leading think tank states in its annual report.

The Military Balance 2018 report, produced by the IISS (International Institute of Strategic Studies) warns that while war between the great powers is not inevitable, Washington, Moscow and Beijing are now systematically preparing for the possibility of conflict.'

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/politics/china-russia-us-military-challenge-western-allies-nato-strategy-war-military-balance-a8209771.html

lionheart · 14/02/2018 23:19

Mr Trump said legislation that does not include his priorities will not 'deliver safety, security, and prosperity to the American People'

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-immigration-bill-veto-daca-dreamers-border-wall-mexico-a8211266.html

PerkingFaintly · 14/02/2018 23:53

Oh god, at least 17 dead in the school shooting.

OP posts:
AcrossthePond55 · 15/02/2018 00:49

Ensconced , indeed cozie. Sitting in my recliner in the caravan with the heater on. It's about 38f outside.

Campfire will be lit in an hour or so at which time I will emerge wrapped up like an Inuit

AcrossthePond55 · 15/02/2018 00:58

They've arrested a former student in the Fla shooting. Apparently he had been expelled. One report had him as Jr ROTC. I didn't even know they had that anymore.

And again, GOP lawmakers will cry big tears and lament but do nothing to change our gun laws. They'll blame it on 'mental illness' and move on. Bastards.

TheClaws · 15/02/2018 01:07

Schiff responds to Pence’s claim that Russia had no influence or effect on the 2016 election.

thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/373932-intel-dem-responds-to-pences-claim-on-russia-affecting-the-election

TheClaws · 15/02/2018 01:15

So sorry to hear about the school shooting in Florida, and disappointed to see some claim it would not have happened if the teachers (and perhaps even students) had been armed. I cannot even comprehend a society where this would be commonplace. If it became necessary, I would consider that society a failed one. You don’t solve a gun problem by adding more guns, surely? I’ve written this before, on these threads, sadly, when there has been a mass shooting in the US. In Australia, we have gun control. We don’t have shootings like this. It just doesn’t happen. I don’t walk down the street considering that the person next to me may be carrying. Who is winning, Donald Trump?

boatyardblues · 15/02/2018 07:17

Fuck. This is the 18th school shooting in 2018.

Just had to remind myself its only mid February. I, too, cannot understand why this is tolerated. It is beyond appalling - the thought that you wave your child off to school each morning with the very real risk that you might never see them again. Why aren’t there protests in the street about this?

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 07:37

Might explain why it’s thoughts and prayers but never actions (from trump anyway - it’s a problem that has spanned longer than him in fairness). From last month:

FBI investigating whether Russian money went to NRA to help Trump

www.mcclatchydc.com/news/nation-world/national/article195231139.html

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 07:42

Jim Acosta
Jim Acosta
@Acosta
SCOOP: At least 100 White House officials, including Ivanka Trump, served with 'interim' security clearances until November

<a class="break-all" href="https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/14/politics/security-clearances-white-house/index.html#click=t.co/xmyrVEz8qt" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/14/politics/security-clearances-white-house/index.html#click=t.co/xmyrVEz8qt

Neal Katyal
@neal_katyal
This story is unbelievable and a must read. The White House Counsel himself and others don’t have permanent high level clearances? Unforgivable. Never saw anything like this in 2 difft Administrations where I worked on these sensitive natl security matters

Mark S. Zaid
Mark S. Zaid
@MarkSZaidEsq
This is really astounding. I can't imagine this many senior level officials have ever lacked a fully adjudicated clearance so late in game. It is disturbing that they have been given access to SCI for such lengthy period of time while in interim status.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 07:44

Kyle Griffin
@kylegriffin1
Full report: More than 130 political appointees working in the executive office of the president did not have permanent security clearances as of November 2017, including Ivanka, Jared, and Don McGahn, according to internal W.H. docs obtained by NBC News.

<a class="break-all" href="https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/amp/scores-top-white-house-officials-lack-permanent-security-clearances-n848191#click=t.co/xjB31PXEYX" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/amp/scores-top-white-house-officials-lack-permanent-security-clearances-n848191#click=t.co/xjB31PXEYX

Partial list of W.H. officials lacking permanent security clearances as of November 2017, per NBC News:
Ivanka Trump
Jared Kushner
Don McGahn
Dan Scavino
Christopher Liddell
Sarah Huckabee Sanders
Raj Shah
Dina Powell
Nadia Schadlow
Fiona Hill
Kevin Harrington
John Rader
Ty Cobb

Gumpendorf · 15/02/2018 08:05

Appalling news. My heart goes out to Parklands. It's hard to know what else to say. Nothing will change Angry

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 08:51

On guns:

Photo courtesy of NYDailyNews

And

David Carroll 🦅‏Verified account
@profcarroll

“He always wore like really patriotic shirts that seemed really extreme, like hating on the Islamic religion. For example, … he would degrade Islamic people as terrorists and bombers. I've seen him wear a Trump hat.” – #parkland #douglashighschool student thebea.st/2BtZCEl

If suspect had been diagnosed with mental illness (sociopathy?) a law with 88% support could’ve had a 63% chance of saving 17 lives in #parkland today. RELATED: FBI investigating @NRA for Russian money. www.mcclatchydc.com/news/nation-world/national/article195231139.html

Where was he radicalized? nyti.ms/2BYaThb

“Broward County Mayor Beam Furr said during an interview with CNN that the shooter was getting treatment at a mental health clinic for a while, but that he hadn’t been back to the clinic for more than a year.“

The Boston Globe‏Verified account
@BostonGlobe
The suspect in the Florida shooting was expelled last school year after a fight with his ex-girlfriend’s new boyfriend and had been abusive to his girlfriend, a student said. bos.gl/e9LiKcb

PropOrNot ID Service
@propornot
More PropOrNot ID Service Retweeted David Carroll 🦅
Online radicalization isn't just for ISIL supporters. Russian propaganda is radicalizing Trump supporters, & encouraging them to engage in violence, against civilian targets, often for political ends. That makes it terrorism.

Simultaneously, Russian propaganda blames "antifa".

And

Caroline O.
‏**@RVAwonk**
In light of today's school shooting in Florida, here's your reminder that the NRA doesn't just oppose #GunControl — they oppose science.

How The NRA Silenced the Science of Gun Violence Prevention

If, as the NRA claims, more guns lead to less crime, why are they opposed to funding studies that could back up their assertion?

medium.com/@RVAwonk/how-the-nra-silenced-the-science-of-gun-violence-prevention-25a4e537c29e

And

The man responsible for the modern NRA killed a Hispanic teenager, before becoming a border agent

Harlon Carter led the evolution from sporting advocacy to political juggernaut

timeline.com/harlon-carter-nra-murder-2f8227f2434f?gi=58369f818d8f

And

David Frum
@davidfrum
As we brace for harrowing news from Florida, a reminder what happened after Newtown: states rewrote their laws to put more guns in more hands in more places

Mass Shootings Don't Lead to Inaction—They Lead to Loosening Gun Restrictions
The most probable policy response to the atrocity in Las Vegas will be new laws allowing more guns to be carried into more places.

www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/10/more-killings-more-guns/541905/

And

Brian Klaas
@brianklaas
In November, a Florida school started selling bulletproof backpacks for children so they would have a better chance of surviving school shootings. Try finding a market for this horrifying product anywhere that’s not a war zone. What a disgrace.

edition.cnn.com/2017/11/07/health/bulletproof-panels-backpacks-trnd/index.html

As far as Nunes can tell, none of us have even met with Trump
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 15/02/2018 09:02

There is more palace intrigue/russia investigation crossover stuff but first a handy recap of the Rob Porter situation:

Alexandra Erin
@alexandraerin
Okay. So. This Porter thing. There's a reason that this is the scandal that's sticking the best so far.

Well, no.

There are reasons. There are no rules to this stuff, only factors and cause

First, I kind of hate that word, "scandal". It's so broad and it covers everything from war crimes to high treason to a tan suit in the oval office.

But that's part of the point.

The media doesn't cover stuff based strictly on importance, but also on "how it plays".

And Porter's case is sort of sitting at the perfect intersection of Palace Intrigue, Salacious Crumbs, Government Corruption, and Age of Trump. It could be Kelly's downfall! It involves intimate partner violence! There was a cover up! This is normal now!

Horserace journalism plus titillation equals = pro wrestling journalism. Or maybe reality TV journalism. And the Porter scandal is that, but with actual consequences and implications thrown in.

It's also somewhere between a clip show and a crossover event. All the other scandals keep popping up in relation to it.

Let me interrupt this stream of metaphors and get with the specifics.

At the crux of this all is Rob Porter's aborted security clearance. The White House said his background check was in process, but the FBI has since made it clear that the process was completed.

Trying to figure out how to parse a White House statement that's at odds with reality to find the "exact words interpretation" that makes it technically true, like they're wishmaster genies or contract-writing devils is usually a fool's errand.

That's a den of straight-up liars.

Buuuut I think we've got a kernel of truth(iness) in the White House's interpretation. The FBI considered the process completed but the White House hadn't accepted the answer and didn't realize a bossman-style "Well, what are we going to do about that?:" would not change it.

So the file was open at the White House, but going nowhere.

Now, there was a story (I think in the Post? I read it on my phone, which is currently updating its software) about how Kushner's little security clearance problem has become everybody's problem. If you raise a question about Joe Nobody's clearance, it's a double standard.

So nobody's saying anything about anybody's security clearance, because nobody wants to be the one who raises the possibility to the Loser King that his loser crown prince might have to stop reading him the morning report.

So it literally didn't matter what the FBI told them or what information they passed along later. There is no process in the Trump White House for dealing with someone's security clearance problems because the official unofficial stance is eyes down, keep moving.

Now, Kelly has shown a perfect willingness to blatantly lie to protect Donald Trump and the regime, since the days of the first Muslim ban (when he contradicted everyone else to say that they all been fully briefed and completely involved in drafting it.) It's just what he does.

But he's doing it in a magnifying fish bowl environment now, and about sillier (in the sense that Rob Porter was not worth protecting, not that domestic violence is silly) and more sensationalist things.

The White House "strategy", such as it is, in cases like this is for everybody to say whatever they think needs to be said in each given situation to deflect, obfuscate, and basically make the question go away.

It inevitably turns into a game of hot potato.

And the last person to have lied definitively before the truth comes out is the one holding the potato. In this case, it's Kelly. It might not have mattered, but he was already heading towards a breaking point with Trump.

Never mind that Kelly didn't do anything except what Trump would have wanted him to do (deny, lie, defend Porter). Never mind that Trump kept defending Porter after Kelly changed his tune. Kelly's the one who caused the embarrassment...

...by making the statements that were immediately contradicted, and he's the one who can be fired.

Kelly hasn't been fired, yet, and Trump is very slow and very reluctant to fire anybody (part of why the response had to be to defend Porter). I know, I know, he's famous for firing people... on TV. Most of the people "fired" by his White House were forced out.

Some by Kelly!

When Kelly is gone, I'm going to celebrate, because the most corrupt Trump crony he can install in that seat is going to be far, far worse at actually getting things done than Kelly was.

Anyway,t he Porter scandal has stuck around in large part because it plays into the existing narrative of Kelly being on the bubble, and it is fed by and feeds back into the story about Kushner's security clearance, and for one other big reason.

And that is... well, it's the same thing as the Kushner clearance thing, where no one wants to bring up security issues since they're all avoiding the elephant in the room.

The more people chased out of the West Wing on domestic or sexual violence, the bigger Trump's elephant is

And people aren't really doing any substantive writing about that in the mainstream press. It's almost like the shape of the Rob Porter story is filling the space around it. But I think this is giving it weight and moment, sticking power in the public eye, that it wouldn't have.

Now, there's more going on, too. (There's always more going on.) There's the "feud" between the FBI and the White House being fed by it. There's the fact that it took everybody in the GOP outside the White House by surprise (and they likely resent the scramble it put on them).

Donald Trump's statement today, which was way more about how much he resents being forced to condemn domestic violence than about condemning domestic violence or putting forward a new position on Porter himself, is not likely to lay matter to rest but extend it.

Roussette · 15/02/2018 09:09

So sorry to hear about the school shooting in Florida, and disappointed to see some claim it would not have happened if the teachers (and perhaps even students) had been armed. I cannot even comprehend a society where this would be commonplace. If it became necessary, I would consider that society a failed one. You don’t solve a gun problem by adding more guns, surely? I’ve written this before, on these threads, sadly, when there has been a mass shooting in the US. In Australia, we have gun control. We don’t have shootings like this. It just doesn’t happen. I don’t walk down the street considering that the person next to me may be carrying. Who is winning, Donald Trump?

The NRA is winning. Until they stop bankrolling the political system in the US, I don't think anything will change. What Australia did all those years ago after their worst shooting ever was brave and it worked.

I cannot begin to imagine what it is like to fear when sending your children off to school, it is beyond our comprehension over here in the UK. Unfortunately 45 is adding to the divisiveness of pitting people against each other. An interesting fact I read though was that gun sales are down with Trump at the helm. People feel comfortable he's not going to do anything about gun control; with Obama gun sales went up as he did try to talk about the gun problem.

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