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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To really hate it when atheists take the piss out of those who believe in God?

845 replies

sharkirasharkira · 05/02/2018 14:10

I have several FB friends who are obvious atheists, and often share things about science and/or about the concept of God being stupid -basically saying that anyone who believes in God is an idiot, a child (with an 'imaginary friend') or someone who has no idea about science and the universe.

I get that not everyone has faith in a higher being/religion etc but why the childish name calling and the necessity to take the piss out of those who do? It just really irritates me! Belief in God and an appriciation of science are not mutually exclusive. I find it quite offensive that people who don't know my personal beliefs are essentially saying that if I believe in God I must be an idiot or a child who believes in magical sky fairies, because theres no possible way I can believe in evolution (for example) and be an agnostic.

Aibu to think that people should just let others believe what they want to believe without mocking them for it, even if they don't agree with it?

OP posts:
Vitalogy · 09/02/2018 18:40

the default position is to assume their non-existence unless any confirming evidence can be found. What about if you use yourself as the measure?

PatriarchyPersonified · 09/02/2018 18:49

Vitology

I'm afraid it's still bollocks and I'm not saying that to be provocative, I'll tell you why.

For everyone who swears blind that Jesus has appeared to them or revealed himself to them or spoken to them in some way, I can find you someone else from another part of the world that says that Lord Krishna has spoken to them and is prepared to swear it on their mother's life.

The interesting point to note is that Jesus never appears to non-christians (or at least to people who don't already know who he is supposed to be), or Krishna to non Hindus.

Strange that, isn't it?

JassyRadlett · 09/02/2018 18:51

What about if you use yourself as the measure?

Of what? The existence of god/s? I don’t think I understand.

catkind · 09/02/2018 19:21

That's how I feel about no one on the thread addressing the spirituality that Alan Watts describes in the videos I posted and I feel to be as is too.
I don't know about the rest but I never follow video links. It's a very slow way to convey information and I can't turn volume on when kids are settling anyway. If you think there's a relevant point, feel free to summarise the content on thread, you're more likely to get responses.

Vitalogy · 09/02/2018 19:29

I'm not sure about that as no one spoke to me, ie Jesus, Krishna etc.

Of what? The existence of god/s? I don’t think I understand. The truth of what we really are, spiritual beings, having a human experience.

TabbyMack · 09/02/2018 19:31

And what evidence can you present that demonstrates that that's "the truth"?

catkind · 09/02/2018 19:33

What we are is superstitious beings. We like to see patterns and reasons and make sense out of the world. Wanting something to be true doesn't make it true though.

Vitalogy · 09/02/2018 19:38

And what evidence can you present that demonstrates that that's "the truth"? I can't show you but you can use yourself as the measure.

Vitalogy · 09/02/2018 19:41

Wanting something to be true doesn't make it true though. That's right, but the truth will always be the truth.

JassyRadlett · 09/02/2018 19:43

The truth of what we really are, spiritual beings, having a human experience.

As evidence of what? ‘Humans doing what humans do’ does not immediately seek evidence for the existence of a particular deity, or any deities.

JassyRadlett · 09/02/2018 19:45

I can't show you but you can use yourself as the measure

As the measure of what? Empirically?

I can use myself as the measure of things that are 174cm long or that weigh mumble mumble .

TabbyMack · 09/02/2018 19:47

*You can use yourself as the measure
*
What a load of twaddle.

CardinalSin · 09/02/2018 21:20

And this is part of the problem. You get people like Vitalogy spouting pseudo-profound nonsense in an attempt for sound like they are saying something, well, profound, when actually all it is is unmitigated bollocks.

WildWindsBlowing · 09/02/2018 22:51

God or Gods
And what exactly is that [God] as perceived/felt by the person Valerie felt deserved to be mocked?

UnmitigatedBollocks · 09/02/2018 23:22

It’s just all so ridiculous. I don’t understand how believers can even begin to expect to be taken seriously.

Vitalogy · 10/02/2018 06:03

mumble mumble, What a load of twaddle, unmitigated bollocks, It’s just all so ridiculous. Some well thought out responses there.

PatriarchyPersonified · 10/02/2018 07:54

Vitology

I'm afraid the responses you have received have been far more well thought out than your offerings last night. I still dont even know what you were going on about.

I suspect that's the whole point though. A lot of religions, especially spiritualism, have started with these kind of profound, half scientific sounding, spiritualistic statements that sound like they have meaning but don't actually say anything.

Spiritual beings, having a human existence

What exactly does that mean? Presumably that we are some kind of ghost or soul inhabiting a human frame? How does that work then? Do you have any evidence?

I can't show you, but you can use yourself as the measure

Eh? I don't even know what you are saying.

Seriously, can you expand on any of this or do you think your going to prove your point by being all woo and mysterious?

JassyRadlett · 10/02/2018 08:55

mumble mumble,

Some well thought out responses there.

What, me making a joke about not wanting to say my weight? I think you missed the actually point, which was around the measurement of things.

Did you have an answer to my substantive question, or do you prefer to sidestep when your contentions (you can measure the existence of a deity) are questioned?!

CardinalSin · 10/02/2018 10:37

Vitalogy, if you could see your way to making a well reasoned point, I would more than gladly engage in it, but I'm afraid that rubbish about the feelz is so very far from offering evidence, or even argument, that I can only laugh at the stupidity of it.

QuiQuaiQuod · 10/02/2018 11:18

OP, mumsnetters, you mean, taking the piss out of believers.

Isntead of a adult debate the usual suspects and trols and goaders are out totake the piss exactly that.

your Op shhould have read

AIBU to ask all the trolls here to start taking the piss because I am a christian?

even though I respect and accept that people have differing way of life?

Im totally with you OP BTW.

headinhands · 10/02/2018 11:32

Aibu to think that people should just let others believe what they want to believe without mocking them for it, even if they don't agree with it?

How do you feel about the posts that giggle at flat earthers? Think of a belief you feel is ridiculous and that most people do like flat earth? That's how an atheist views a belief in religion.* It just seems laughable. And then there's the fact that religion is responsible for people having some fairly homophobic and sexist views. (I know most Christians who post on MN don't hold those views but data shows that that's not the position of most Christians in the uk).*

headinhands · 10/02/2018 11:41

I don't wish anyone to pussyfoot about my beliefs. If someone felt my beliefs were ridiculous I would actively welcome them to explain why. For example, as a Christian, when someone calls god a sky fairy, if I was a Christian I would explain how that wasn't an appropriate label. I wouldn't just feel hurt and ask them to stop. If I could I would deconstruct their position. I would use it as an opportunity to educate people. But I don't think I've ever seen a Christian do that, the stock response is to cry for respect in hopes to make it stop.

namechangerbob · 10/02/2018 13:11

In regards to religious schooling, I really don't see the issue unless it is a case of brainwashing, which it isn't. You don't have to send your child to a religious school, and if you chose to you can opt them out of religious activities, or certainly here you can.
Here the 'Curriculum for Excellence contributes to pupils thinking for themselves and making their own decisions about what they believe to be true about human living' and children are encouraged to learn about all religions.
To work in a RC catholic school here you do need to be approved by the church, but you don't need to be RC. I can see how you may view this a discrimination but I would expect the same if atheist schools were introduced (which I would support), teachers needing to be approved to make sure they aren't going to bring any religious propaganda with them.
You also don't have to be RC to get a schooling place. The percentage of RC attending is less than half.
They aren't getting state funding to promote their faith, it's for the same resources as any other school to follow the curriculum and educate the children which go there. Faith just happens to be part of the school ethos.
I don't think anyone is more entitled to a school place, nor do I think prayer must be part of all schools.
I went to a denominational school, where prayer was part of the school day. However, my DP went to a non-denominational school and never had to do a single prayer.

Heregoeseverything · 10/02/2018 13:22

@namechangerbob The best primary school near me is a Church of England one. We have no hope of getting a child into it. Proximity to the school is the 8th priority criterion for entry after 7 religious criteria, eg 1 Children of vicars/ministers 2 Children of those with other roles in the church 3 Children who can show weekly attendance at church and active membership of Sunday School 4 Children who can show weekly attendance at church 5 Children who can show monthly attendance at church...and so on.

PatriarchyPersonified · 10/02/2018 13:32

Namechangerbob

I can see how you may view this as discrimination

That's because it is discrimination.

Nobody wants to set up atheist schools. What we want are secular schools, where religion is taught as a subject in RE and not mentioned anywhere else.

Special privileges and access rights based on religious affiliation is completely unacceptable in a state funded institution.