Scout leaders lost my kid then blamed him

[Eliza22180]

I am a newbie - seeking some reassurance / a reality check here...either is welcome! Scouts recently lost my child aged 12 for 2 hours at a mountain outward bound place. He was told by scout leaders he could go off and meet the others at lunchtime. Apparently they told him to take a "buddy" but he claims he did not hear this. By the time I'd dropped him off and spent half an hour getting my younger child kitted out against the cold, my older child was missing - alone, no-one knew where he was, no phone, not contactable. I believe this breaks a lot of scouting rules, plus as a qualified teacher I just feel these people are totally amateurish. So easy to set up a list of kids with "buddy" names and ensure each pair had a phone between them. It's a big place; I found him 2 hours later; he was in fine form. I know he is more than mature enough to spend a couple of hours alone outdoors...but surely that is a decision for the parents, not a random scout leader. My anger has been compounded by a) the scout leaders robustly blaming my son (for going off without a "buddy") and b) scout dads congratulating each other since the event on how well it went! I could comment "great, except you lost my kid then blamed him". Frankly, I feel they should stick to their day jobs! AIBU?

More detail needed still. A child should not be skiing on their own for 2 hours.
Would a buddy have been available if they were supposed to be in lessons? Physically how far away was he from the others? Has he been in the shouts long enough to know they always need a buddy to go anywhere if this is the normal protocol? How obedient is your son normally?

I'd be mad if I was the leader and a child disregarded normal rules and regulations, to deliberately go off on his own.
Given the sketchy details I'd be inclined to think the ops ds thought he was too good for the others and took himself off, but we need more detail to be sure.

My son, aged 11, was on a scout event where they could go off with a buddy for morning or afternoon but had to return for lunch. My son didn't follow the instructions and stay with his buddy. I made him apologize to the leaders and was offering my thanks and apologies to the leaders. Never thought to blame them for my son! All scouts know they have to be with a buddy and not go off alone so am sure your son must know this and parents would reinforce sensible behaviour. Surely at age 12 they would return to leaders or a marshal or other adult in authority if they had any concerns as they would be used to so much independence by that age. Totally thankless job being a scout leader, they are volunteers and give up whole weeks of their time for free where you get paid as a teacher.

Agree the op is a bit confusing. I'm a Beaver leader and do often help out at scouts as DS is a scout.

Is this an indoor thing with clear boundaries (in which case not so much an issue) or outside in a mountain in which case I agree that the leaders haven't done their job properly.

I'm confused though whether your DS was told to take a buddy or was told he could go off on his own but meet for lunch?

And is it that he didn't turn up for lunch ( and hence was lost) or that you didn't know where he was during the time before the lunch meet up?

Worth speaking to the GSL. We don't do skiing as a troop but I can't imagine ever letting a scout go off alone outside - inside it would be different.

But I agree scouts is different from schools, and some teachers have a hard time accepting that. We let beavers (6-8) have much more freedom on camps than they ever would have at home, and that's part of the fun. But some parents who are teachers have issues with that.

The bit I'm missing is a 12 year old still in scouts, but each to their own!

Scouts is 10.5 to 14 so 12 is normal age.

If I were thinking of letting a 12 year old go off skiing without the rest of the group, there is no way I would let them do that until I was certain I knew where they were planning to go and who they were planning to go with. It's far, far too slack just to wave them off and hope they take someone with them even though you know nobody else will be able to go with them, because nobody else can ski well enough to do that. It sounds to me like they did not actually have kids going off on their own on the agenda when they planned the event, so had not factored the possibility into their safety assessment. On that basis, if anything went wrong I would feel very guilty about my role in that and the shit I had dumped the Scout Association for not ensuring their rules were followed properly.

Has he only just joined op? My dc started in cubs at about 6 and it was always drummed into them thar you never leave camp or go anywhere on your own. At 12 your ds should understand the buddy system and shouldnt even need to be told that he shouldn't go off alone. I would be upset if my child went missing but I wouldn't be so quick to blame the 'amateur' leaders.

I usually just read and don't post but as a Scout Leader myself I feel the need to say something. Over the years I have seen good and bad leaders organising activities, but there are questions that need to be answered before anyone on here can make an informed decision. What sort of place was it? Did it have fenced boundaries or not? Was it dry ski slope or a mountain in Wales/Scotland somewhere? Are you sure the Leader said they could go off ( you seem to change this half way through ), if you knew your child was 'missing' within 30 minutes why were you not looking for them/had the centre staff looking for them rather than 'keeping an eye out' ? If you are absolutely sure that the Leaders are in the wrong then please report to the Group Scout Leader and/or District Commissioner there will be a full formal investigation into it and the leader in charge will be suspended whilst that takes place as it is a serious safeguarding issue. If it is that your child wandered off without actually being told they could then they need to put practices in place that means it doesn't happen again but its not so much the leaders fault. If it was a fenced in area then it could be that they were allowed to go off within the area, I don't usually have a clue where mine are on a camp site during free time. They would have been told they should always be with someone. In my group if we had one that was capable of the activity whilst the others were having a lesson then they would be asked to help 'teach'.

OP, OP, where are you?

round yes they had a number in case of emergencies, the events organisers, but these could have been several miles away depending on which route they took. Unsupervised as did not make contact with leaders for 10-12 hours, yes.

My DS have been doing this competition between them for five years now so I've made no assumptions at all. I know how it works.

your son is 12, not 6 and he should have listened to instructions.
Anyway isn't scouts supposed to teach resilience and initiative?

He is 12 old enough to listen and old enough to take care of himself

CPtart - yes, in your event there were responsible people in mobile phone contact and everyone was seen to depart in groups after their leaders had made 100% certain they both had their emergency mobile phone with them and that they all knew to stick together. Don't tell me that nobody thinks to remind the kids of the importance of sticking together at the time of the event and makes sure everyone has taken that in, rather than assuming they know this because they were told it when they first joined the scouts... The OP made the perfectly valid point that her child had no mobile phone contact with anyone, and was on their own because the leaders literally said it was OK to head off without the rest of the group, as the whole of the rest of the group were having lessons, meaning there wasn't anyone for the OP's son to go off with whatever they subsequently said about buddies who didn't in this case exist!... I still think it sounds very off that this child was literally allowed to wander off on his own when absolutely nobody else in the group was doing this, because it was not designed to be that sort of an event. If Insend my childmoff for skiing lessons with the scouts, I expect them to stick with that plan, not decide he can go off on his own to do a dangerous sport.

In fact the OP specified, "I'd been told he would have a lesson." The scouts told her one thing and did another, meaning she did not consent to what they allowed him to do, buddy or not. They were therefore on shaky ground if anything went wrong.

Op seemed to have departed. The intitial post was asking if she was BU or if she needed a reality check - she wasn't making an outraged complaint, but seemed to be asking for opinions about what had happened.
Then came the sudden info that had never been mentioned before about skiing and suddenly we are told that he he had been told by leaders he could go off alone, when previously he had apparently been told to have a buddy, but not listened.
I just wonder if the OP only had a vague idea about it all when she first posted and since has spoken to DS a bit more, and info has come to light which means she hasn't come back....because it's a bit embarrassing to have to say that actually things weren't what they seemed at first and perhaps DS was in the wrong over this. Who knows why a ski slope of an unknown type, size or location suddenly popped up.
Anyway, unless OP returns and clarifies it all, we really cannot comment on who was right or wrong. All I would say is that it would be a shame if people read this and decided Scout leaders aren't to be trusted and don't have rigorous safety procedures, based on this half, constantly changing story.

Why would anyone decide scout leaders aren't to be trusted on the back of one isolated event? If anyone is so incredibly dim that they think that, then that really is their lookout. Admitting fault is no bad thing, where fault has occurred, though - people don't learn from their mistakes if they refuse to recognise when they have even made them. The ds was at fault for going off on his own and the scout leaders were at fault for saying they were organising skiing lessons but actually letting a child go off to ski on his own, unsupervised. Don't sell one thing to parents and provide another.

The OP isn't very clear, I can't tell whether the skiing teacher was a scout leader or an outward bound instructor, it's all rather confusing!

Does it matter who was giving the skiing lessons? It was the scout leaders who gave the ds permission to leave the lesson and do something else and the scout leaders who told the parents that their children would be having skiing lessons. If this changed, the scout leaders were responsible for whatever happened to the child not attending the skiing lesson their parent consented to.

YANBU to be annoyed at the scout leaders, even if they are volunteers. Skiing on your own is a risk that needs careful consideration, not something a youth leader (volunteer or not) should be blase about. And even though your son was told to take a buddy, they didn't notice that he hadn't and that should have raised alarm bells and got them looking for him. It would be reasonable to take a measured complaint higher so that the volunteer leaders of the troop receive more training that emphasises their responsibility to do more than make the odd verbal instruction to the kids. They must put a lot of effort into their volunteering and likely want the very best for the kids, but haven't really taken on board their role as protectors, not just enablers.

On a separate note, if at 12 he's a reasonably good skier, you should probably be educating him on the need to ski with a buddy so that it wouldn't even have occurred to him to go off on his own when the scout leaders told him he could go. Not that it makes it your or his fault - but he'll be in this sort of situation more as he gets older and he ought to be aware that, like with swimming, skiing on your own leaves you particularly vulnerable in the case of something unfortunate happening.

round spot on, that's exactly the set up it was for my DS. So no assumptions on my part. And for mama who accused me of "being silly", definitely no timed checkpoints!
It seems as I said with the limited information we have here, there was fault on both sides.