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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

Alfie Evans

999 replies

IcySlippy · 01/02/2018 11:50

www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/alfie-evans-parents-plead-sons-14231597

Anyone following this?

OP posts:
GrumbleBumble · 22/04/2018 22:17

@pessismistic if you think Alfie can respond to touch, feel a dummy in his mouth etc then surely you must think he can feel pain? He cannot get better his brain is destroyed but if he has any sensation left he must be able to feel pain and discomfort. The PEG feeding and traciostomy that would be carried out by the Italian hospital to allow for longer term life support will mean further pain and discomfort. He is either in pain or in total oblivion - either way he needs to be allowed to slip quietly and gently out if this world. (Oh and I am a mother.)

OldHag1 · 22/04/2018 22:17

Shit.... my child has an appointment at AH tomorrow.

I do sympathise with the family it’s a truly awful situation but that post above from his Dad is very sinister.

andthislittlepiggywent1 · 22/04/2018 22:17

"...I do wonder who he is in touch with behind the scenes, and which groups are preventing him from facing reality (and why)."

This. I have nothing but sympathy for the parents but some deeply sinister groups appear to be pulling, or trying to pull, their strings. That worries me, and I think that's why this case needs to be discussed, even though it's such a painful and sensitive subject.

theredjellybean · 22/04/2018 22:20

Sorry pessimistic but he can't fight for alfies life, alfies is dying, whether it is peaceful with dignity being cuddled by his family, all tubes etc removed or if the army and TE have their way, he will die sometime in the future, probably unpleasantly from sepsis, his little body wrecked and with tubes, wires and God knows what else attached to him as doctors are made to pump him full of yet more drugs and pump on his chest to try to resuscitate a dead child.
Sorry to be so blunt but that is the two scenarios

Brendaofbeechhouse · 22/04/2018 22:20

Or when he looks back he will realise he spent the last few hours of his son's life raging on social media.

LetsGoFlyAKiteee · 22/04/2018 22:21

Its staff shall continue to go about their normal business, and unless they attempt to harm Alfie, they have nothing to fear

Don't see how that can be reassuring for any staff member.

Pessismistic · 22/04/2018 22:21

I’m sorry to hear that but Alfie’s dad is seeing yawns,sneezes. Maybe cannot accept like you did but he accepts he will die he just wants it to be natural if he can’t accept it why can’t he be left in peace why do people writing horrible things make it ok. You all see it’s best for Alfie he’s not your child. His life will be affected by this not people on this thread.

BlytheofWindyWillows · 22/04/2018 22:22

The sinister undertone of the post is worrying to say the least. I only hope he doesn't fo anything that prevents him being with Alfie at the end.

FreshTart · 22/04/2018 22:24

Compassion Yes I have been in his shoes. Yes I had to make the call to switch off the machines keeping my baby son alive. Yes I arranged my child's funeral. Yes I would do the same thing again with the same information. No I didn't act like Alfie's dad. I am not a murderer, I do not love my child any less because of the actions I took

FreshTart · 22/04/2018 22:24

Sorry Freudian slip with the name Pessimistic

myrtleWilson · 22/04/2018 22:25

@pessimistic - read the thread - There are many on here who have been in similar positions. No-one doubts the anguish and pain that Tom and Kate are going through. But the whipping up of an "army"... how does that help Alfie? How does that help Kate? How in the end will it help Tom?

Redglitter · 22/04/2018 22:25

So he now thinks that this ridicso called birth certificate is going to save him. The AA are in a frenzy now about that.

I think Alfies mothers absence in all this speaks volumes. Hopefully she's accepted things and is spending time with her little boy.

All this talk of his execution and murder is appaling. I see someone was encouraging them all to call Merseyside Police. She had and was told it was nothing to do with the police but her 'thinking' is if enough people phone them they'll be forced to get involved. Hmm Yeah cos that's how it works

I wonder how TE will look on this time in the future.... time he spent fighting or time he should have spent with him

JustAnotherSod · 22/04/2018 22:25

I feel so sorry for his parents but most particularly for Alfie. Alfie would have died 'naturally' many months ago if it wasn't for the staff and equipment at Alder Hey - I can understand his parents desperation but they a raging against the wrong people, the ones who have kept him alive for many months when his body was ravaged by whatever condition has caused his brain to degenerate.

Tattybogle89 · 22/04/2018 22:25

He is not writing these posts. There’s another long one up that has the army believing a helicopter is coming...

Leontine · 22/04/2018 22:26

@Pessismistic

He will die a natural death when they remove his life support.

GrumbleBumble · 22/04/2018 22:26

It's not a "natural" death - he is being kept alive by machines, his "natural" death would have been months ago. Dr's have actually prolonged his life, not sought to end it.

IronicWitttUsername · 22/04/2018 22:26

TE has posted an update on his page.

andthislittlepiggywent1 · 22/04/2018 22:27

I'm also not sure that I buy the argument that the parents will deal better with their grief if they know they tried everything. I know of a family (friends of a friend) who took a baby to the US for experimental treatment. The baby didn't survive the treatment. I understand that he was running expected to die anyway but, far from being comforted that they took that long-shot chance, the family was wracked with guilt over the circumstances of his passing, especially the family member who first suggested the treatment.

Pessismistic · 22/04/2018 22:27

Your not Alfie’s though your not living there nightmare unless you have been there. your all Ok to judge on here but if it was your child would it be so easy?

myrtleWilson · 22/04/2018 22:27

But @pessimistic - Tom doesn't appear to accept that Alfie is going to die. His post yesterday said he was not terminal, and the end of care life plan is not in any way aggressive - it is about setting out the best way for Alfie and his parents.

theredjellybean · 22/04/2018 22:27

Pessimistic.. If Alfie dad wants him to die naturally why is he trying to get the courts to agree to him being kept alive artificially?
That just doesn't make sense

TheFairyCaravan · 22/04/2018 22:28

Cocoa Flowers

I’d be really worried if I worked on PICU at AHCH. I’d imagine there will be a police presence on the unit soon which is all you want If you’re there with a very sick child.

MarvelleGazelle · 22/04/2018 22:28

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

JustAnotherSod · 22/04/2018 22:29

But this is Alfie's situation - he is dying and has been for many months. Alfie doesn't have the capacity to live anymore and his parents are trying to force him to continue living against his body which is dying. His interests are important, not those of his parents, and thats the way it should be, he is an individual not a thing.

Efrig · 22/04/2018 22:29

It’s the other patients, their families and the staff that I feel sorry for.

I think that life support should be withdrawn in the presence of the nurses and doctors who have been doing their upmost to provide the necessary care under extremely unpleasant and stressful circumstances. I’m sure that everything possible has been done to involve the parents, but sadly it doesn’t appear to be the right thing to do any longer.