To think we don’t realise what modern life is doing to families?

[MrsGrindah]

I’ll own up here.. not a mother myself but a stepmother.
But I spend a lot of time travelling on trains for work and see so many parents on the phone to their kids ( in the mornings and before bedtime). Yes it’s great that technology allows this, but I just feel sorry for people missing out on being with their families. Last week there was a man talking to his little boy, apologising that he had gone before the boy had woken up and wouldn’t be back by the time he went to bed. I felt so sorry for everyone
Not blaming the parents and of course we all have to work. My point is as a society we are becoming used to this and almost expect people to be prepared to sacrifice a significant chunk of family life. Just makes me feel sad to see it and I wonder whether we’ll regret it in years to come.

I don't think my dcs would want to swap their ft working parents for their friend's blended family and split week in 2 households with changeovers

I don't think that's really helpful. I could easily counter that saying "I know my DD wouldn't want to swap her two homes for parents that worked full time" but it would be nonsense because what works for US doesn't work for you.

Well it's not a new phenomenon.

During the industrial revolution, or before that really when agriculture was the only game in town, families didn't sit around just being with each other. Everyone worked, had a role, contributed.

In the 50s my Gran had four children and worked as a cleaner before breakfast and in the evenings so the kids got themselves to and from school.

My parents both worked two jobs in the 80s so my brothers and I looked after ourselves in the evenings, doing chores and homework.

I think this pressure to find the time so that we can all sit around and emote together and feel #blessed is new though. It pisses me off tbh.

@alphajuliet123 I do think plenty of people wish they'd reached their potential though, and found out what they were capable of.

I hate that saying with a passion.

Really? I think its very natural to hang out and chew the fat with your tribe. It's what hunter gatherer tribes do. It's what we are evolved to do.

I was just thinking this the other day. My mum was constantly around when I was little but I'd struggle to fit children into my life if I had them. Not without significant sacrifice.

I think this pressure to find the time so that we can all sit around and emote together and feel #blessed is new though. It pisses me off tbh.

Quite.

Thing is though, agriculture is seasonal. There were long winter evenings when, actually, people did just sit around being with each other. That's why we have songs and stories and myths and legends. It is this constant need to be on the go that is an invention of the industrial revolution.

I can't think of a nicer part of the day than the evenings when everyone is home after their busy day and we get a chance to chill and chat to each other.

True @TinklyLittleLaugh but I'm not sure I place that above all other available activities in every instance.

I love my job, traveling for work, going to the gym, reading in silence, running, cooking, etc. I love sitting round chilling with the family too, but I don't consider it a holy grail for which I forsake loads of other elements of my life. All of those things make me, me, not just the parent part.

When I was a child my father's work took him away from home for up to three weeks at a time, and around four months of the year in total. I would have loved the opportunity to face-time him, have a phone call, or exchange emails.

No, I don't think we understand what modern life is doing to families, in giving them so many ways to connect.

Sorry but that's not true. I don't think its true in Europe and it sure as shit isn't true for the rest of the world.

I think other countries have a better balance don't they? Sweden or others has a better life/work balance, so dad is home more.

I think we will regret this. A lot. In years to come.

I had a conversation with my dad on that subject at xmas, conversation prompted by the fact i was getting really pissed off that not only my DH works long hours but in the past few months was nearly constantly connected to his emails and the news (relevant to his job).

I said to my dad that when we were growing up (we are 3 siblings) he workedlong hours too. BUT and that is a massive difference the technology didnt existed for him to be connected in real time. So when he was off for holidays snd weekends, he was properly off and with us.
The expectations were that so and so are on holidays and if there was a problem you would telephone but it was usually a huge issue.

Now there is no real time off and the expectations are you must answer nearly instantly.

I think it s gone too far the other way and it is not healthy.

I'm not clear in what we are going to be regretting about now as opposed to all those other time periods where people worked long hours and we're out of the house much more - without technology to allow on-the-hoof communication.

The expectation of what constitutes healthy family life is different now; in generations past adults weren't expected to be mother, best friend, chauffeur, entertainer, and domestic servant rolled into one. Now we are supposed to do everything and feel #grateful while we're at it.

In the 1950s and 60s and to an extent the 70s a middle ranking civil servant could support a mortgage on a 3 bed semi in the Home Counties , a wife at home , a Car , 3 kids and an annual holiday.

This was my family - my father had a specialist Civil Service job and we had a semi on the outskirts of London. My mother was at home with 3 children, he never worked late or brought work home, never had any performance targets to meet and he made full use of flexi-time for a bit of extra holiday (sometimes taking us out of school to do so). There wasn't a huge amount of money around for treats, but it seemed a fairly low stress lifestyle.

The equivalent job now is paid £50k, but the same house is worth £675,000 so I think two incomes would be needed these days.

When he retired on a generous pension - at 56 - my parents moved to a remote part of the country. He is now somewhat mystified by the fact that his children and their spouses (all working, mostly in professional roles) can't be visiting on a regular basis...

Yesterday I didn't see my daughter at all because I worked 14 hours, leaving before she woke up and returning after she went to bed.
Every other day this week I've dropped her off and picked her up from school. I'm freelance and my working patterns vary. Don't assume that one overheard phone call means that a parent is consistently absent.

As a pp said as long as the parent is 'present' when they are together that is all that counts. Someone could spend 24/7 with their child but spend most of that either looking or speaking on their phone.....or they could have the weekends and half hour before bedtime but spend that time playing, reading, listening to their children talk about their day!

This was my family - my father had a specialist Civil Service job and we had a semi on the outskirts of London. My mother was at home with 3 children, he never worked late or brought work home, never had any performance targets to meet and he made full use of flexi-time for a bit of extra holiday (sometimes taking us out of school to do so). There wasn't a huge amount of money around for treats, but it seemed a fairly low stress lifestyle.

I think this is what lots of people remember from their parents generation and lament the loss of in their own.

I accept that this is a relatively privileged existence, but the same privilege doesn't seem to be possible nowadays without much more effort and stress from an employment point of view.

And at the same time as work environments becoming more pressurized, it seems that so has parenting. Our whole weekends are organised around our son in a way that didn't happen when we we children. Now, I wouldn't have that any other way, but when both parents are working, parental 'downtime' is virtually non existent.

YANBU! Yes, people have always had to work but I don’t believe it’s always taken so bloody long to get anywhere. My DH often works away. My Dad did too when we were kids. Difference is that my mum had a relatively local job in manufacturing and jobs like that just do not exist anymore. I’m currently a SAHM but am chomping at the bit to get to work. It’s the commuting required that would mean I wouldn’t see my children.

i think it's a lot to do with commutes too.
my mum was a sahm and my dad worked 9-5, he was at home for 5.30 every night.
I agree OP, we are ignoring the future impact on our children, but not sure what society can do about it tbh.
we can manage on one low income, but there's not much left for luxuries at all.
For us it was important to have a constant parent at home so we lived very frugally, nothing but the essentials.
It's not for everyone but was what we wanted. no amount of money would have tempted us to miss out on our dc when they were little, but not everyone has 2 parents to have the choice.

LaurieMarlow see I don't feel like we should organise weekends round the kids, necessarily. We do do fun stuff, but sometimes they have to amuse themselves while we do things we need to do, like exercise, or they have to trail round the supermarket because we need food.

I am not a huge fan of treating life like the whole thing is an adventure for kids - sometimes you have to fit in with grown ups, and then when you're the grown up, it's your turn to decide what happens.

I think much of this constant need to be entertaining kids is often born out of guilt; if you don't see that much of them, you feel the need to make every minute special.

We are fortunate to spend lots of time with our kids; we don't see the need to be rushing about doing amazing stuff all weekend. I know people who plan trips and activities for practically every day of the school holiday. Quite often, kids are happy just hanging out with their mates, messing about on their bikes or running round the woods or whatever.

80s I was latchkey kid, FT working parent.poor single parent family,council scheme
Ticks all the 😥head tilt boxes if one is inclined to such stereotypes
Except my mum was attentive,loving,installed a fierce work ethic and we were happy
Fast forward, I work FT, kids at Afterschool & nursery.theyre loved and safe children

I mean latchkey jokily, not in a pejorative sense.it was primary onwards but I had older siblings
I really want to disavow people of the well it’s ok to work FT if you have to Responses
As if well there must be a compelling reason a mother wouldn’t sahm or be there for pick up etc
I don’t have to work,we’d not be in penury, I chose it,I want it,solely Being mum isn’t enough

Just because parents work full time with long commutes does not mean that they spend weekends guiltily planning activities for every minute of their "quality time" with their children. Sounds like a lot of conflation and stereotyping.

Modern in a narrow first world definition and compared to historical life eg 50 years ago?