Monroe Bergdorf on the Women’s March

[bambambini]

Aibu to be pissed off that Women are being told not to bang on about female reproduction rights in regards to the Women’s March today? Monroe has a huge following, has been vocal in interviews, articles, TV, radio etc. They recently were featured in Woman’s Hour’s celebration of women.

Leaflets circulated by a-holes I suspect.

Literally nobody said they are irrelevant, just that they aren't the only relevant thing and that focusing only on them does a disservice to women. You're fighting with a straw man of your own invention for god's sake!

Until women in South American countries are no longer imprisoned for 40 years under suspicion of having an abortion because they have miscarried.....then I will fucking well allow reproductive rights to be filed neatly under, " Things we can ignore while we play at being women."

I saw that story too. 30 years for a miscarriage???

Talk about invention Lyra, how could you be so inspired by seeing MB at the womans march today when she wasn't there?
You're just making up shit to wind us up.

Wow Lyra

Why are girls excluded from education in Pakistan and many other countries?

Why does the pay gap exist?

What is rape?

How the fuck can you say that Cyntoia Brown's incarceration is nothing to do with her reproductive organs? She was sex trafficked FFS!

Seriously, fuck this ignorant regressive shit to the far side of fuck

There are 100,000,000 missing women, overwhelmingly women of colour. Aborted because of their sex, killed in infancy or slowly starved. It's about sex not gender. They were killed because of their sex. Literally someone looked at a scan, or a newborn, saw there was no penis and ended them.

No, Monroe said that women attending the women's march ought not to centre on our reproductive biology.

Many women's orgs and charities centre around women's biology.

I have seen them attacked by TAs.

I know exactly where this person is coming from.

Out of interest, why do you think that Malala was attacked? Do you think it was because she was a girl, in the traditional sense of the word, who spoke out in favour of educating girls (in the traditional sense of the word) in a country where women and girls (the cunty sort) are oppressed and deemed low value because of their cuntyness?

Or do you think there was some other reason she was attacked?

Do you think that the Taleban ask people how they identify before deciding whether they should be allowed to go to school or not?

I mean what exactly do you think that attack was based on?

^Insisting that gender is a binary only benefits the patriarchy, and it's a crying shame that so many women will ally themselves with oppression rather than accept transwomen6

Give your head a wobble, Lyra. Transwomen reinforce the patriarchal bullshit binary.

"Talk about invention Lyra, how could you be so inspired by seeing MB at the womans march today when she wasn't there? "

hahahahahha

rumbled

not really sure why I am bothering but just in case Lyra is really a woman....
let's take education as an example of non reproduction related issue and how feminism might be concerned about it. Malala was attacked and had to flee the country because she and her father were advocating education FOR GIRLS, that group of people defined by er, what, oh yes, their reproductive capacity. In this country we might be concerned about ensuring the safety and dignity of GIRLS in schools, who may suffer sex based discrinination and harassment.
Other people may be concerned about the under achievement of white working class boys, that's an educational issue, but not a feminist one.

The women's march AGREE that female biology and issues related to female reproduction ie the entire basis of sexism and the cause of misery and death for women and girls all over the world every day should not be mentioned and it's out of line to mention it?

Indeed. Fucking ridiculous.

These have cheered me up though

Here’s one ‘stick your ‘cis’ up your [you can finish the rest]’

lyra the centering of women's reproductive biology is a natural result of that being what unites women as a class and as one of the two sexes of human. It is the overriding factor of a mutltitude of similarities and experiences that no men share. Biology is the cause of the pay gap, forced marriage, disparity in education, in politics, of abuse in the home because women are smaller and vulnerable in so many ways.

Turns out I cannot have children but that is an issue of my female biology, and I have all other the other consequences of my female biology. I share my upsetness at lack of children with my DH but that particular similarity/ shared experience does not mean that we aren't different in a whole host of other significant ways and it turns out that I share the vast majority of my similar experiences with other women. It does not mean that I ahve nothing in common with men, but that the most defining factor of my life is that I am born female into a patriarchical society.

What exactly is it that we should 'centre' and what issues, expressed in which ways would be acceptable to you and MB?

Is it that we can focus on education, but that we cannot actually say that females are disadvantaged in numerous ways including period poverty, because that excludes men and transwomen, and the WHY of that accuses men (as a class)?

What is that that we women are allowed to say if biology is not at the centre?

Because yes, to an extent if the word women has been snatched and is now dissoicated from biology so that it includes biological males, women as a class as it has been known for millennia, ceases to exist. Wow, home run to the misogynists.

Women who don't have wombs still get treated like women who do, not like men. This is why the arguments Munroe and Lyra are making are bollocks.

I don't have periods,can't reproduce and take her.I don't feel excluded because there are an awful lot of menopausal women out there who have life experience of how our reproductive organs have ruled our lives and affected what we do.
This march is inclusionary of all women,for all women including those who do not have the freedom to march.
Hope everyone hasa good day.

And I wonder what it will take for young women to stop pandering to males in regards to minimising female biology - practically apologising. This was on a young women’s FB page - would love to speak to her in 10, 20 years time to see if she changes her views at all.

People like MB and PL are doing far more harm than good within the trans community. Their disrespect/hatred of women shines through in their tweets and articles.

Years ago I would refer to trans folk by their preferred pronoun, whereas now I use pronouns like 'they', 'them' and 'their'. I won't show disrespect by calling them by their non-preferred pronouns but I no longer buy into the 'a transwoman IS a woman' bullshit. More fool me for doing so in the first place to be honest but this rabid TA agenda wasn't around (or at least so visible & accepted) back then.

FurCoat - I did too, out of respect but the respect isn’t reciprocated so until things are more settled and clear I’ll use they, them etc

I hope someone was sporting this bag at the march today.

Lyra I'm afraid you've completely misinterpreted Monroe when they say that women attending the women's march ought not to centre on our reproductive biology.

They aren't saying, 'hey everyone, we need to focus on lots of issues affecting women (like girls' education, the pay gap, etc. etc. etc.) and not just their genitals/issues affecting them like abortion. (I see you use the example of Malala and women receiving an education as being an issue away from reproductive rights)

In actual fact, Monroe is literally only saying, hey everyone, a woman isn't a woman because of their biology. She wants people to include, and actually CENTRE transwomen in this whole debate. She wants the march to be about transwoman's issues MORE than anything else, because to Monroe, intersectional feminism means examining who is the most oppressed. And a transwoman, POC scores way more points than a white woman on the oppression scale.

She is literally trying to take today's debate away from women when in fact everything affecting women is about their reproductive biology because the oppression of women is based on their biology. Every issue comes back to our sex.

Again coming back to Malala - I'm sorry but it couldn't be more inappropriate to even mention her name in all this. Monroe gives zero fucks about Malala or about girls' education. Again Monroe cares about transwomen. It would be completely different if Monroe cared about the things Malala was fighting for. If transwomen were genuinely joining in with campaigns about making things better for girls around the world, I'd budge up on the women's bench and say an honorary 'welcome. Thank you for adding your voice.' It would be an acknowledgement on transwomen's parts that girls are oppressed because of their biology, that they can't identify out of it and that feminism needs to focus on WOMEN.

You have huge faith in Monroe and I can't for the life of me understand why other than you having misread her twitter. She's being completely transparent in what she believes.

Trans Activism is proper MRA territory.

@marillacuthbert2018

Too late. The 'kill all TERFs' scum brigade is already onto it.

@mete0rstrike
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2h
Replying to @PollyLaBruja
I wonder if anyone recognizes her and can find her name?