How on earth can I afford to work??

[Arrowfanatic]

Stopped working to become a sahm in the early part of 2011.

I now have 3 kids all in primary school and have been considering returning to full time employment.

However I've been totalling the costs of child care and I just can't see how it's worth it. Daily costs for before/after school care is almost £60 a day and that's after the sibling discount.

Holiday costs are close to £100 a day after discount.

I have no family or friends who could help, and the nature of my husband's work means he wouldn't be able to be reliable to do any school runs (works for the emergency services, shifts, minimum notice call ins, very rarely makes it out on time and is at least 1.5 hour commute away).

Any job I could get would not be a big earner, less than £25k. Even with childcare vouchers I can't see it being worth it. I feel like I should try to work, especially now the kids are all in school but it looks impossible. My husband's salary although good only just covers our costs as it is.

Is there anything else out there to help? We don't qualify for any benefits, except child benefit so no tax credit help.

It's pointless me working isn't it.

*Not even vaguely. I have done precisely all of that, which is how I know why its a stupid suggestion. It's not an easy option. YOU may be able to gain after one year, but most people won't.

Arrogant and self absorbed much?*

Oh yeah, researching the right degree before studying it is well arrogant...

This is one of the reasons I haven't returned to work after my fixed term finished when I went on maternity

What has researching the right degree got to do with anything?

This isn't about you.

For most people looking for a job NOW, "go back to university" is a stupid piece of advice.

It took me 7 years to get a degree and postgrad, and thousands and thousands of pounds.

Wow, that's a lot of replies.

I'll try to clarify.

My husband is very high ranking and whilst this is good financially it's means he is often called into work at a moments notice and rarely leaves on time. His work is very inflexible but it's just the nature of the beast.

When we had children I initially changed to part time work but when our second came along we jointly decided i would be a sahm. There is no "leaving it all to the mother" mentality here, it's just his job paid more and made sense that I stayed home. We're surely not the only family for whome this was the case.

I'm quite content being a sahm, as is my husband. He retires in a decade with a very good pension so we're not looking at working till I'm 60 plans. Even if he was to die, or leave I'm still entitled to his pension. Not that we intend that

I am thinking about working as I feel it could benefit me. However I'm not stuck at home, I run a club & have a very active life. Just sometimes miss working, I'm not 100% sure I want to work but I'm giving it thought hence my child care investigations. DH had said he'll support me whatever & we'll make it work, but as I say, the nature of his job means it would fall to me mainly to sort kids. He works shifts all over the clock, sometimes doesn't even make it home. It's not unusual for a terrorist attack for example to mean he works 24 hours straight, just is what it is.

Childcare is expensive. Breakfast club is £7 per child per day, after school is £13.50 per child per day. Holiday club £33 per child per day. Sibling discount is 10%. Child minders are few and far between here with availibilty. (And I couldn't be a child minder myself, no offence to those who are I just couldn't do it. Plus if DH on nights it's awkward). I have no family or friends to help & DH only gets 21 days leave. I doubt I'd get much more, but we could work it between us.

I would never ask my kids to give up their clubs, they enjoy them. It wouldn't be fair and that's that.

£66k sure sounds a lot right. Doesn't go far down London way believe me, and his pension is high contributions as that's what is set in his force. Reducing would make minimal difference. We are comfortable, but not splurging if that makes sense.

I feel guilty that he works so hard, and I don't financially contribute. He doesn't see it this way, says I work harder than he does and likes that I'm around for all the school stuff (as do i) but equally understands if I want to work.

But with a decade of work ahead before we private pension off, I'm looking for a job that financially makes sense, doesn't cramp family life too much especially given my husband's work, and that I can do. Maybe it's all a bit pipe dreamy, I don't know. Maybe deep down I don't want to work, or maybe I do??

I can't be the only mother to have had these thoughts right?

OP's husband works for the emergency services, I doubt he can take work home with him or put new rules on the table.

Or maybe he could transfer to a slightly different role that's not so front line. Maybe there are lines in the sand he can be drawn with regard to shifts. Do no mothers do this job at all? Really?

But yes, often much easier to insist that he's totally inflexible, therefore letting everyone off the hook, rather than ask the difficult questions.

I do acknowledge that there are a handful of jobs that are impossible, but really, I think it's very easy all round for the DH to insist on the status quo because it suits him.

Whatever, have it your own way. If they can't do what you did they just aren't trying, are they?

Transferring isn't that simple you know. At his rank roles are few and far between. Not to mention he would have to transfer out his force so mess his pension up. It's not like he's a simple front line officer.

Most public service jobs are great for part time, term time. I used to be in the civil service and worked 9.30-2.30, 4 days a week. All school holidays off. I finished in 2008 but even then I took home about £600pcm. Ideal.

Let me make something blatantly clear. This isnt about my husband pulling his weight, he works so hard in a very difficult job that I suspect very few people on here will truly understand the impact that has not just on him but family life and everyone should thank their lucky stars that there are still people like my husband in post making the difficult decisions.

This is about whether it is possible for me to get a job that child care can work with, without relying on my husband, friends, family as it's just not possible. I'm content if it transpires that it isn't, happy if it does.

@PersianCatLady

I know, I can read... I was referring to another poster who had said it was expensive. I've seen another thread on here asking about wraparound costs and they vary massively by school and area.

I'd love a 50p breakfast club and a £1.50 afterschool club ran at the School for instance but they don't all exist.

@Arrowfanatic

I can completely understand that you want to work but only if it fits with your life. If you've got the luxury of choice in the matter, I'd feel the same way.

OP, qualifying as an aromatherapist or reflexologist doesn't require a huge amount of time or money. You could also join the Baby Sensory/ Toddler Sense franchise. Both would be very compatible with school hours.

I think OP, that you should reframe and try something different. Don't focus on going back to what you did before - in order to get back into work id look at different jobs. Cleaning, retail, data entry- flexible and yes low paid but you weren't earning loads before anyway.

My Friend has just gone back and had no problems getting a 11am1 2pm retail job. Really popular shift as it covers full time workers lung breaks.

I think what you really need is to meet people and get back into the work lifestyle. Just do whatever- then you can wait to be inspired by what you really want- maybe to go into something else or retrain, or maybe just carry on with that. I do think though, you're better off working than not. Pension, NI contributions, self fufillment etc

Or look at the council for a term time school hours job - like admin?

OP you've got a typical problem that as a sole earner your husband has been allowed to, and very likely had to, make his job centre and his job first. It's understandable- it's been supporting you all. But start changing that today. My husband wouldn't be able to have a job with mad hours because my work is as important as his is. Your balance might start to shift

not every child is happy with holiday clubs either

The majority of children in holiday clubs don't have a choice because they are there so their parents can work. It's more fun than school FFS.

I think OP that your DH needs to look at finding a more family friendly job, or taking the hit to his career progression to support your return to work. Ask him how you'd cope if he were to die? You need to be able to support yourself and his children in that situation. If you could return to a 9-5 job then he could afford to do a job that fitted round the family better. If you were both on £33k you'd actually be taking home more money than he is now. It is not just the OPs task to make her return to work feasible.

You also need to look at different childcare options, wrap around care at a nursery is the most expensive option (I know, I've been paying it for the last 4 years!) but now my youngest has started school DH and I rejigged our hours and can now pick up from school 4 days a week and our childcare costs have been slashed (context: 3 children, no family nearby but DH in a very local job and I have a commute of 20-25 mins). See what all the childcare options are and work out which is the best balance of cost v flexibility. Could you get a childminder for X no of days a month but with flexibility on those days so when your DH isn't working he can look after the kids?

OP, you need to work from the starting point that since you and your partners are equals any childcare costs would need to be paid from both of your salaries, as would food/clothes/etc.

Assuming the OP can walk straight into a job that pays £66k, absolutely, great.

If she'd be earning half that or less, insisting on paying half of everything would be nothing but martyrism.

Equality manifests in different ways. The OP carried, grew, birthed, and has taken the primary role in caring for their children. Her DH would likely not have got to have a family without her making that career sacrifice - or he'd have had to give up his own career.

I don't know what's up your arse and why it's there, but try not to project your issues onto other people...

Ok, I'm going to say this one more time.

My husband's job isnt up for debate. His job is good, stable, steady and with his pension will provide us and the family a future we couldn't otherwise have. He can't just change it, we won't be changing it. I support his job 110%, it's important. He can't change hours, reduce days. The job isn't like that. Emergency services are not simple jobs, but they're important. More important than any job I could ever do. He's a hero, and just the person you want in charge next time isis takes a swing at us.

If I work it needs to work in conjunction with his job. This isn't a wife job vs husband job debate and it annoys me that pps keep trying to turn it into that. Surely I'm not the only one with a partner who works a job like this, and whose oh can't just chop and change roles and in a family where one person's job IS more important than the other.

Before we had kids I earned equal to him, after kids part time i earned less and now nothing. We manage financially. My question was, is there options I'm missing regarding child care? Extra help out there for the "high earners" who actually relatively aren't that high?

Her DH would likely not have got to have a family without her making that career sacrifice - or he'd have had to give up his own career.

Wow, what about all those men with working wives? Who somehow managed to also have families and also not give up their careers. Who knew that could happen, huh?

. My question was, is there options I'm missing regarding child care? Extra help out there for the "high earners" who actually relatively aren't that high?

lol

At no point did I "give up" my career, we jointly discussed it and his career had way more benefits to our growing family than mine. WE decided I would be a sahm.

Why do mumsnetters seem determined to turn this into some husband work vs wife work debate? It's not. I'm not competing with my DH.

OP, my DH did long hours for a while, leaving at 7am, he could be home anytime between 6pm-8.30pm. Also, often worked part of Saturdays either in office or at home depending on things and the odd Sunday, so I know where you're coming from.

It hasn't given me a career and mega money, but I work lunchtimes at a local school (who are fantastic if I need time off for childrens appointments/sickness) and we found we could work around the odd Sunday so I got a job in a shop. I'm only working 14 hrs per week, hourly rates aren't great £8.10/9.39 but have no childcare, it gets me out and makes me use my brain. Particularly with the shop job, it would be very easy to get more hours even ad hoc if I wanted them.

It's very difficult OP, I totally get where you're coming from. I have many friends who are unable to work due to the nature of their partners jobs. Be it shift work, or because they travel away a lot. It's not possible for men or women in these types of jobs just to change their hours to accommodate their partner's job.

DH and both work, but can only do that because we rarely travel and have PIL nearby to help out if we do. I also work from home which helps. If either of us were to take a big step up to a much more demanding role, then the other would have to make changes to accommodate that.

Admin and book keeping for local small businesses. Holiday and lunch break cover for local small shops. Trades often need an extra pair of hands on an ad hoc basis. Local events and fundraising. Seasonal work or piece work for local industry. Look on your town or village Facebook page. If you have a women’s initiative or self employment group locally go along to a meeting and see what you might feasibly do. A local business group or forum can help you. If you are a part of a local community, as a SAHM with a club, you can build on the skills you have from your SAHM time - local connections, trustworthy, with roots in the area.

To reduce commuting time and costs, and to make short shifts worthwhile, remain local. What do you have on your doorstep? Jobs I have found purely from local contacts are networking include pretty much all of the above. I’ve don’t everything from working the butchers counter when a friend of a friend needed holiday cover to putting together greetings cards at home for a local cottage industry, I’ve made sandwiches at a bakery 11-2 for the lunchtime rush, I’ve done bar work in the evenings. eBay shops. I’ve done everything from being employed as a cleaner in a bookshop at the end of my street for two hours a week to managing social media for local tradespeople working from home, to babysitting in the evening, taking my own children with me.

Look locally. Ask yourself who do you already know, and what do they need. When I was at home with my children, with no childcare, single parent, made redundant in pregnancy, a student, and sometimes all of the above at the same time, I did pretty much anything and everything to bring in a little bit of money.

You don’t need to do that, but the principle is the same. You feel like you have limited time to offer an employer, that childcare would take too much of your wage, and that you aren’t going to work nights, shifts, or weekends. Really, you are saying you would like to work 9.30-2.30. Make sometime of that. You can, if you want to.

Try volunteering at your dcs school. The majority of TAs seem to get these jobs as a result.