To wish DSis-in-law would stop criticising MY parenting?!?

[NameChanged2349]

Just what it says in the title really! DSis-in-law has a DD in the same year at school as my DD (15yo) and they get along fine but are just very different, and I am accepting of this. They always have been. Yet whenever I meet with DSis or the four (or even all) of us do something together she constantly makes snide remarks about the boundaries I set for DD and how DD ‘behaves’. (“Ooh I wouldn’t let my DD do that.” “Do you really let her do that?” “I’m not sure that’s such a good idea.” “Don’t you think it’s a bit worrying that she’s doing XYZ already.”) It’s really grating on me.

So maybe this is almost a WWYD... I’ve called her out on it a few times now (I don’t judge your parenting/DD so there’s no reason to judge mine etc) and she just. Won’t. STOP. It’s almost every time we meet up and i’ve had enough!! Even DD and younger DCs have noticed because she’s started doing it around us all. AIBU to think it’s none of her business and wish she’d leave us to parent our teenagers differently?

I think we can guess which of the girls is going to go absolutely feral the moment she leaves the confines of her mother's opinions! (Sounds like yours will be fine!)

It sounds very annoying. I remember my mother being annoyed at similar comments when I was your DD's age. She shut up when I got my GCSE results as did did far better than her DD.. I have to admit that I wouldn't provide alcohol at a party for children that young though.

You have to be blunt. It's the only way with joy killers. Life is infinitely better when you screen such people. OH's sis is similar. Im with her brother, not her by association so I don't allow her too close to me and bluntly told her why. We aren't friends she only knows me as I'm with her brother so I've no time for her waspishness. You have to not care about people disliking you tho. Life is difficult enough as it is without the company of draining people so you're better off minimising any time with her.

I am a product of this. My cousin and I were basically rival of whose the best parent and it tore us apart. We’re no longer in contact because of the parental rivalry. Funnily enough, I was your daughter. We’re both in equally respected careers, I’m married with 2 kids and expecting a 3rd and very close to my family. My is engaged but doesn’t see her parents anymore...

I think 15 is too young for alcohol at a party. It’s Different at home as a family. She may be jealous or concerned. Hanging round with the older kids isn’t necessarily a sign of maturity. Perhaps you could listen to the messages of concern on here?

Wow - okay, definitely NOT a stealth boast. I would absolutely have preferred it if boyfriends and drinking had waited another year or two and was actually wary of getting a bashing over that. I think my own DD has almost tried to grow up a little too fast - yet I just don’t think my saying “no don’t do xyz” would have done anything to help that. She has one friend with a mum like that and it’s definitely not doing anything.

Also not naïve - i’m sure much crazier things happen at other parties, but that’s not really my control. As long as DD drinks within her limits and doesn’t come home chucking up, which judging from when she comes in after the events/ reports from other kids’ parents is the case, then I’m okay. The last party she went to she and her boyfriend actually spent a lot of time looking after another girl who was vomiting uncontrollably, and they walked her home and told her mum what had happened.

As already explained - I am also NOT obsessed with the “cool/popular” “nerdy” labels, I absolutely hate them - I was just trying not to bore you all with a long essay describing each child and they both sort of conform to stereotypes. And I don’t mean DN is less mature because of her love for Dr Who etc - I mean she seems a little less mature because she struggles to talk to adults. How she interacts with people feels a little younger. Nothing wrong with that, it’s just an observation - and she is 6 months younger, so it totally makes sense.

And I really hope it’s not jealousy because of the labels - I don’t know what “group” DSis fitted into and I’m actually not sure which one I was in either (probably just a middle ground then!) because it’s never really bothered me. Her daughter is fab and she has a lovely group of friends - DD likes them all. I don’t know how much they do out of school together, but when I saw them all together (at DN’s last birthday) they all got on really well and DD was entirely comfortable chatting with them even though they weren’t all in the same “group” at school.

It’s just the patronising/ I know how to parent your daughter better tone that bothers me. Both kids are on track for wonderful GCSE results, have hobbies they take seriously and are doing well in, and have a steady group of friends. It feels like she wants to compete - which there’s no need for! She’s always been quite competitive so I hope it’s just this mixed with a little concern (although the way she goes about saying these things doesn’t feel concerned - I’d have loved to be able to chat about my concerns re boyfriend when he first came on the scene and alcohol when it was first negotiated but she was so judgey about DD even being interested in that stuff that I was put off mentioning it to her!) and not jealousy.

Thanks for all the suggestions - I’m definitely going to try and stop letting her get away with it. I think my tipping point was DD commenting on it!

My auntie was like this with my mum (my cousins are younger than my mums kids). Her kids soon rebelled against all the boundaries she set them and her children (at the moment) do a lot that I/my sister wouldn’t have done.
Her kids might be perfect in the long run but they could also rebel against her!
I would just ignore her or say ‘you might not let your kids do that but I’m happy with my parenting choices’

Just to reiterate - not saying the older crowd/alcohol/boyfriend/interests make DD more mature. Saying her ability to speak like an adult to adults make her seem slightly older than DN.

I 100% understand the concerns about the alcohol and I too was very concerned when she first told me she thought there’d be alcohol at a party she was going to. But where we live most of the parties with alcohol start around year 10, unfortunately, and another group in her year started as early as year 8! Me putting down a hard “no” would have been effective for all of a month I reckon - before rebellion would kick in. I’d rather be able to trust her, let her go to her friends’ events and know she’ll drink sensibly because we’ve discussed limits and the consequences of getting drunk, than say “no” but have her rebelling. I am actually teetotal (I’ve never had an alcoholic drink in my life apart from maybe one cocktail!) so it was a totality bizarre ground for me.

I have a friend who is very similar and it is extremely frustrating. She drones on about how there are 'the party girls' and 'the studious girls' and doesn't really understand when I point out that the two aren't mutually exclusive!! One of the most prolific party girls is an A* student and likely to end up head girl.

I just find it odd but have decided she's actually rather concerned about her sons lack of social life.

I’m also pleased that she knows she can call me when something does happen - when her friend was vomiting everywhere (and didn’t want to call her parents) DD and her BF looked after her and then walked her home from the party, by which point they were too far away to walk back to their own homes so called me to explain what happened and I gave them both lifts. I thought she dealt with that well and it showed me that she clearly wasn’t too inebriated to be sensible! I think if I’d been constantly laying down boundaries and judging her we’d have had a more difficult situation - she wouldn’t have wanted to call me, then she’d be making her way back from the other side of town in the dark/cold.

the two aren't mutually exclusive!!

Is exactly my point! DSIL is convinced that because DD parties and has a boyfriend she must be throwing away her life and not doing nearly as well as DN. Yet DD and DN are in all the same sets and revise together a lot, and both seem to be working really well towards their GCSEs (and, I know one DD’s case, actually started revising half way through year 10!). Both are on track for As and A*s and going out once or twice a month isn’t impacting that. Her DD often talks about staying up ridiculously late to binge a tv show - that’s her equivalent. Something totally unpractical that she enjoys doing and allows to mess up her sleep. Sure, I’d rather DD was doing that than drinking at a party for all sorts of reasons, but I can’t exactly force her to enjoy things she doesn’t enjoy and do things she doesn’t want to do.

You are in a difficult situation as you don't want your daughter to rebel but at the same time, I would say the drinking, partying, older boyfriend are probably more typical of a year 12/13. I know it also very easy for them to take 'their eye off the ball' and obviously this year is an important one - until you get into year 12 and you realise GCSEs are only a stepping stone (but one that needs to be navigated).
I would probably be having a few similar thoughts to your SIL at times but I wouldn't voice them. Having a 19 and a 20 year old DD, they were both different in years 11-13, with one being more outgoing than the other and one being more studious - both needed managing differently and the older one did need more boundaries. Now they are both at university, the older one has quietened down and the younger one is partying more which I wouldn't have predicted.
You need to ensure you emphasise safe sex with your DD - condoms and the pill but tell her it is far better to say no at this stage as it is illegal and her boyfriend could get into trouble. I am assuming she must be nearly 16 though as she is 6 months older than your niece.
With regards to the clarinet, could your DD give up lessons but still go to orchestra etc with the aim of just doing the enjoyable side?
Good luck with GCSEs etc.

I have 2 DDs close in age, one of whom would probably be considered "cool" (DD1) and the other a bit "nerdy" (DD2). I dont think either thinks it better to be one than the other (just different), and i dont think they equate "cool" with "popular" in the same way as on this thread (and indeed in life).

DD1 knows her group of friends are described as the "cool" group and the "popular" group. She gets the reference to "cool" but does not really get "popular". She says that her group of friends is no larger than any other and she is not aware of people who are not in their group who are desparate to be so, so she does not see why their group is considered more popular than any other group. When this phrase is used, she will ask "popular with who?" DD2 is well liked within her year and has a good group of friends, but they are definitely queiter personalities. i dont see any jealousy towards the equivalents of DD1 and her friends in their year or the same desire to be pushing the boundaries.

I am pretty sure that issues like alcohol, boyfriends etc will come up relatively earlier with DD1 than DD2. I think your SIL's approach would be fine with DD2 as she does not like breaking rules herself anyway and in reality she is less liekly to be invited to that kind party quite so early. However, i just cant see zero tolerance working with DD1. She is very sociable and works best when she is happy,. Tryinh to stop her goign ot parties where there might be alcohol etc will in reality mean telling her she needs ot socialise with a different group of friends, which will definitely not make her happy! With her, i think it will be a case of giving her incremental amounts of freedom and ensuring she is alert to the risks, dangers of peer pressure etc, and then reining her back in if she oversteps the mark. Not sure I would go so far as making alcohol available myslef pre-sixth form, but would not judge another parent who decided to do so in y11, as long as they checked first.

So in summary i think it is easy for your SIL to judge because she is not facing the same issues. However, her younger DCs may well be more like your DD1's personality, and it will be interesting to see if she changes her parenting style to reflect that.

One thing i dont get on this thread is the idea that the cool people at school dont do well in life. That is certainly not my experience. In my school, several of the group that would have been considered to be the cool group (some underage drinking etc) went to Oxbridge and from what i can work out from social media and the school friends I keep in contact with, many of them seem very successful (QCs, professors, doctors etc). Fair play. They were never mean girl (or boy) types (I think this also gets conflated with "cool" and "popular") and it was an acadeically slective school (state grammar) where doing well in exams was not judged as uncool, so maybe that made a difference. I think in many walks of life there are advantages in being outgoing and sociable, just as in others there are advantages in being more nerdy and studious!

Sorry, I forgot to add that your response to your SIL should perhaps be along the lines of 'yes, whatever' and then change the subject.

Niece is introverted and awkward around adults, has little interest in appearance, and instead obsesses over Dr Who/Harry Potter/maths/science. Enjoys studying, going to STEM club, playing in an orchestra. She’s also 6 months younger than DD which might be why she always seems a bit younger/ struggles a little with grown up conversation.

You sound as judgmental if her child as she does yours tbh.

My dds are a lot younger but personally I agree totally with your approach because my DM was your DSIL and my best friends DM who became "my second mum" was you. My relationship with my DM deteriorated quite badly as I couldn't talk to her about anything as she was judgemental and quite controlling, if I wanted to give something up or change a subject it was the end of the world and she couldn't believe I had maybe thought through the reasoning behind it. We weren't really the cool group in school but had friends in the village my friend lived in and bf Dm took the attitude she would rather provide limited alcohol under her supervision and know where we were and who with etc and I had the relationship with her very similar to her own daughter (she joked we were like twins). When bf went to uni in England (remained in contact)and I stayed here to work full time through uni I still went to bfs mums a couple of times a week. I was still in regular contact for years until bf recently returned home with her kids and now we are all still close and I'm now 35

It's all very well for people to criticise but if you have an outgoing, very social teen then you have to give them a degree of freedom, while they still think it's yours to give.
If you say no to everything, a rebellious teen will lie and do things behind their parent's backs. Better to have a degree of control over what they are doing.

It's easy if you have a malleable teen who is content to sit at home. Your sil thinks it is her fab parenting, but really a lot of it is just down to the personality of the child she has. She may well find that her parenting doesn't work on a different child and that child could rebel.

Have you told your brother that this is really pissing you off. (Is she brother's wife, or bil's wife?)

I do think you are going to have to be more blunt. She isn't worried about offending you, so I wouldn't worry too much about telling her to get her sticky beak out of your business.

hellsbells absolutely agree that I would have preferred year 12 for all of that - but unfortunately it is quite typical around here. DD’s group of friends weren’t the first to start going to parties and of her really close group of 4 girls 1 (gay) boy 4 of them have older boyfriends - between 1 and 3 school years older. She is 16 in January, and we’ve discussed all that multiple times, and I especially outlined that it’ll be best if she waits until then because of age of consent/ emotional maturity/ relationship stability (they’ll then have been dating 7 months). Luckily I think she’s his first proper relationship, so he doesn’t seem to be trying to move things too fast.

WhyOh I totally do NOT understand the friendship groups. DD has lots of friends from all different “groups” - I asked her why one of her closest friends from dance wasn’t coming to her party and she had to explain to me that she invited her but this girl doesn’t really know any of DD’s friends so didn’t really want to come, which was also DN’s stance. I kind of understand... I also don’t think it matters as a lot of people here seem to be implying? I don’t think it will impact their futures massively. DD is perhaps more outgoing/confident socially, but DN has more confidence in her academic ability and is wonderfully passionate about all sorts of things, which as you say, will aid her in different ways. I see both doing very well in the future - both motivated and hard working, and both very kind. Which is why they’re still such good friends!

Ergh. The 'cool' kids. I hate that expression. Yes, at my dd's school they gave a bad reputation too.

I'm afraid you do sound very critical of your DN. My dd is a very mature 13 yet old who gets on well with teens roughly 2 yrs older. However she still has no interest in appearance (still waiting for that to kick in) and like all the nerdy stuff and gets on with the nerdier friends.

My own 'nerd' DN is currently studying Aerospace engineering in college and looking ahead with the ambition of becoming an astronaut (among many other possibilities).

Sorry, went off topic there but just wanted to stick up for the nerds

TBF i'd probably comment if you were encouraging 15 year olds to drink too, but them i'm probably an old prude

MsGame - do I? I don’t think any of the traits I outline there are negative. I think it’s great that she has interests and passions? Not sure what’s judgemental in that passage. The thing about seeming younger is entirely down to her struggling to hold grown up conversation, not about her loving Harry Potter etc. I love Harry Potter - DN and I chat about it all the time!

Thanks for the support TheWhyte. This is definitely what i’m going for - she absolutely has boundaries. She knows that it she came home ridiculously drunk I’d give her less freedom and be far more wary about letting her go to parties. As long as she shows she can make relativelt (for a teen) sensible decisions on her own, I’m happy for her to do that, and very happy that we have such an open relationship.

IWanna I have mentioned it to DB but he works a lot (and is away from home a lot) so is a bit laid back and just says things like “i’m sure it’s nothing”. DSIL is definitely the strongest figure in the household!

Just don’t get into a discussion about parenting. Say ‘Oh, gosh you’re being so judgmental. I guess it’s your insecurity about your own parenting choices’ and repeat 100x

Or simply have a long break from them each time a comment is made. Next time say ‘I’ll go home now, I’m not giving time to your judgmental behaviour.’

Yes, I think you do. Maybe you're doing it because you feel so defensive of your own dd? Maybe because SIL regular criticism has created a situation where you feel you have to compare the two? Honesty I would say in a tired voice "oh mind your own business". I really would but accept that others might want a more diplomatic route

Trampire you’re totally misinterpreting - I LOVE DN and all her quirky ways and am not judging her AT ALL! I don’t think her being “nerdy” has any connection to her by being great with adult conversation - I think they’re unrelated. They’re just two ways she differs from DD, if that makes sense.
I was trying to say (unrelated to one another) the main differences are:

1. DN would rather binge watch TV than party, DD would rather go to parties.
2. DN prefers science/maths while DD prefers languages/the arts
3. DN loves playing classical music and doing music grades and being in an orchestra, DD prefers playing a few pretty tunes on the piano and instead takes dance more seriously
4. DD is interested in fashion and makeup, and social media (groan). DN has a “studygram” she tells me (she posts pictures of her study notes I think) and isn’t interested in makeup.
5. DD is good at talking to adults while DN is still learning how to chat to adults - which is where my comment about stages of maturity came from. I don’t connect those with one another - those are just interests and features that make them different teens!