Dad taking dd to ladies toilet

[AdaHopper]

MN - help dh and I with a disagreement please.

When dd(4) needs the loo in a public place, he takes her to the ladies' loos. I told him that women don't like that and he should take her to the men's loo. Aibu or is he?

The other woman challenged her Say saying there's very often only one disabled toilet so it shouldn't be used. She answered that most malls have more than one, so if it's occupied and a disabled person needs it they can go to the other end of the building.

Cos that works when you have mobility problems, or urgency or all of the other reasons why you are needing the disabled toilet in the first place.

Exactly, or if you’re anywhere other than a ‘mall’. Say in a supermarket or restaurant. One toilet. That’s all we have. Apparently the people who have the most options are fathers! They can use the men’s, ladies or disabled and no one will say or do anything about it.

Piers Morgan just touched on this briefly on GMB. What’s your husbands reaction OP?

A few points of interest.

1. Do you have separate gents/ladies toilets in your house?
2. In pubs, clubs, at concerts or anywhere it is really busy you will see women using men's toilets to avoid the queues.
3. An office where I once worked had 16 staff split equally M/F and two separate single toilet cubicles. Staff voted unanimously for the toilets to be unisex, and never regretted it.
4. Trains and planes have unisex toilets.
5. A disabled toilet is NOT for the exclusive use of disabled people - the regulations make this quite clear - it just means it is equipped for them to use it. Think of small establishments where the only toilet is disabled accessible, and again, the toilets on trains.

The thing is though, with unisex toilets you are aware they may be a male in there.

You don’t open the door of the ladies and expect an adult male to be standing there.

1) Do you have separate gents/ladies toilets in your house?

No. But then how many if your husbands/brothers/life partners/fathers would barge into the room while you were in the toilet.

2) In pubs, clubs, at concerts or anywhere it is really busy you will see women using men's toilets to avoid the queues

Women shouldn't be in the men's either.

3) An office where I once worked had 16 staff split equally M/F and two separate single toilet cubicles. Staff voted unanimously for the toilets to be unisex, and never regretted it

So you we're actually asked then. and everyone who joined the staff after would know they were unisex and expect
It.

4) Trains and planes have unisex toilets

Yes but it's one loo behind a door. No one's in their with you.

5) A disabled toilet is NOT for the exclusive use of disabled people - the regulations make this quite clear - it just means it is equipped for them to use it. Think of small establishments where the only toilet is disabled accessible, and again, the toilets on trains

Again if it's just the one universal toilet then it's for everyone

If there are men's female and disabled you use the right one. And you certainly don't use the disabled toilets when out of 2 other rooms with multiple toilets in are provided. Leave that one toilet for someome who actually needs it.

I've always used mens at events, festivals, clubs when I was younger. In Italy they were all mixed when we went out in our 20s. Holes in the floor often too. I personally wouldn't care if a daddy rook his daughter in the ladies. They are all in cubicles in the women's so who cares really?

Plenty of people wouldn't mind china

But the question is more "do you think it's right to assume all women in the loop won't mind and walk in" ?

Don't you think a man walking into the ladies loo is being selfish? He's at that moment thinking to himsekf. I don't care about the fact it's a women's space. I don't care who I upset. I don't care I should not be here or what anyone thinks of me being here. I want to use the ladies so I will.

Isn't it the attitude that bothers you even if the actual issue doesn't?

I personally wouldn't care if a daddy rook his daughter in the ladies. They are all in cubicles in the women's so who cares really?

I would care because I may be using the open area of the toilets to get changed rather than using a cubicle. I may also have the pushchair in front of the cubicle door and the door open. I have the right to expect only women in a designated single sex area.

HardKnock - he still doesn't know I started this thread. I daren't tell him now...
And I still don't know if I should bring it up again. Opinions seem so divided ...

Don't tell him about the thread.

But do ask him how he would feel if when his dd gets to 12 and is at secondary school and using toilets in town or at the bus station, she came out and kept finding men in the ladies. See how he woukd feel when it's not him who is the dad in the room but someone he doesn't know in the loo witg his dd.

I'm a man with two DDs, one younger and one older. I take them into the gents as I wouldn't dream of going into the ladies.

To deal with all the objections...
1 - Yes the gents can be a bit smelly but your DH would take a DS into them so that's not a reason to not take a DD.
2 - I have never seen someone else's genitals when using the urinals. We men are generally very discreet so there's no chance of DD seeing anything untoward. And I make sure she doesn't go near them.
3 - I don't want to leave myself open to an accusation from any woman who might object to me being in the ladies. I also wouldn't want any woman using the ladies to be worried that a man might be in there.

So I would be telling your DH to take her into the gents.

If it's unisex it's unisex - you know you can encounter a person of opposite sex there, and you can choose not to use the toilet. If it's single sex toilet (with multiple cubicles) then people of opposite sex have no business there. The fact that they have daughters don't make men any less men.

This thread has been mentioned several times today on Five Live.

This one must break some sort of mumsnet record for being referred to in the media.

Some time ago I wanted to use the public bathroom in an airport waiting zone. An elderly man with 2 grandchildren, a boy and a girl, asked me very kindly if I would take the girl with me to the ladies. She was 7 or 8, and he considered it wrong to take her in the guy's bathroom, but was worried about her safety going to the ladies on her own. Of course I did, she was very well educated and polite, only needed some help with the hygienic seat-cover and of course a bit of motherly watching over her. I still think grandpa was right to ask me.

So is the general consensus that it's perfectly safe to send your young child into a bathroom with a completely strange adult?

That sounds like a better plan than accompanying them yourself. 😂

Yes I think that’ll solve all our toilet related troubles here Ilovelampandchair - if dads send daughters into the ladies with strange women and mums send sons into the men’s with strange men. Sorted.

Well to the other kids in the toilets you'd be the strange adult surely?

Are the young children in the loos meant to know your Ok? Especially when your the strange man on the ladies or the strange women in the men's.

A man should always be in the men's loos, never the women's loos, whatever the sex of the child, if the child is young enough to need accompanying to the loo.

If the men's loos are a problem, then the men should bloody sort them out, not steal the women's loos.

I did ask dd(10) what she would think if she saw a strange man in the womens. She looked at me stragely and said: nothing :)

Whereas my daughter would be freaked out.
She unfortunately has witnessed the harassment, sexual comments and cat calls in the street and has figured out in her short life they never come from women.
Despite having a lovely brother and father, she feels wary of strange men in certain situations. Being in a toilet and seeing a man there would be one of them.

I’ll ask this again:

Why is it okay to send your sons into the men’s toilets but not your daughters? Are you saying your daughters are more precious? Is the smell less offending to little boys? Why are you not treating your children equally?

How would you react to a man taking his young son in the ladies?

I may also have the pushchair in front of the cubicle door and the door open. I have the right to expect only women in a designated single sex area.

Incredibly value point here. If you are peeing with the door open because you have your pram with you, you don’t expect some strange man to waltz in!