To be upset at a woman kicking my friendly 4 month old golden retriever?

[Marshmallowpops]

I am so upset. I've just come back from a walk with my puppy. She's a lovely friendly golden retriever. I've been letting her off leash in the local park as the trainer said it's best to do it early. She is really friendly and loves to play with other dogs- she often meets them all for a play date in the park in the morning- there are always lots of dogs off leash in this park. Normally when there aren't other dogs she trots along beside me, sometimes going off to sniff but coming back when called. She's not too bothered about people but will say hello and sit down (not jump up) as she is trained to do. Today it was dark at 8pm and I let her off as normal, she just trots along and comes back when called. But today she saw two women, one with a baby in a carrier) so went over to say hello (she's normally not bothered but today was a little hyper), but she just trotted over like she does, really gently and not aggressive at all. I said to the woman 'don't worry she won't jump up she'll just sit down and say hello', but before my puppy had even reached the woman, the woman started kicking her away! I could understand if the dog seemed aggressive but she's the sweetest thing. She kicked her repeatedly, my puppy came back to me, I put her on the lead, and the other woman started having a go at me asking if I thought it was acceptable for my dog to go over and attack her baby. She was smoking a cigarette. I wanted to say that is going to cause more harm to the baby than my dog ever would but I didn't. I know of course that as a mother you are very protective of your baby but I just would never attack a friendly dog. Maybe they've had bad experiences in the past. I'm just very upset. I know not everyone likes dogs but that park is so dog busy that I thought everyone was used to it by now. I think I'll keep her on a lead at night until she's really 100% with recall. She's about 90% now. So I know there will be people who say I'm in the wrong letting her off but if she had an aggressive bone in her body I would never let her off.

I know that not all dogs are nice dogs and not all dog owners are responsible dog owners but like anything in life, you can't brand an entire species as wortless because of your own limited experiences. Aside from dogs that actually work (farm dogs, police dogs, guide dogs, disability assistance dogs, the therapy dogs that work at my husband's place of work, to name but a few), dogs provide a lot of people (some who are struggling, lonely, etc) with companionship and comfort. There have been a few stories on this thread about encounters with poorly trained or nasty dogs so I thought I would add a bit if balance with a positive story of my own. A few years ago my mum was involved in an accident that left her paralysed from the waist down. She spent several months at a specialist rehabilitation unit in Middlesex and shared a ward with a group of patients with very similar injuries to her, some worse, some better. During a conversation with a nurse one day, my mum mentioned that I have a dog and the nurse said 'do you think she'd like to bring her in to visit you? That would be lovely?' I was amazed because I thought health and safety police would be all over the thought of an animal in the hospital. I phoned and had a long chat with the ward sister who confirmed that it was something they really welcomed, that no one had allergies, that no one had dog phobias and although she would be limited to one room and the outside seating area, she would be very welcome. So, I took her in. She was a lot younger then and I was worried about whether she might become over excited or something but this was the calmest I had ever seen her. The other patients (some of whom were in a very dark place at the time) were so pleased to see her and unbelievably happy for the uncomplicated interaction with an animal (I guess as much of a distraction from their day-to-day struggled through physio etc). She got a lot of fuss that day and was so beautifully behaved. I remember one lady in particular who was paralysed from the neck down and said that she would desperately have loved to have stroked her but couldn't - my dog just went and sat next to her for most of the day, just happily sitting next to her, wagging her tail. It was lovely. Now that my mum is home, I find that my dog radiates towards her, patiently lying next to her wheelchair during our visits. My mum is really cheered by it.

My husband now has therapy dogs who work with children. Yes, there are a lot of people who don't like dogs but there are also a lot of people who find they have a massively positive impact on their lives. I've talked to people at my local park who say that they got their dog after they were bereaved or went through a difficult time and it was a crucial part to getting out and about and enjoying life again.

This is of little relevance to the original post about whether or not a woman should have kicked a dog, but seeing as the thread seems to have been derailed by people who want to assert that dogs are a disgusting and dangerous inconvenience, I thought I'd add my own positive stories.

Ha - so only one person missed that I was parodying a dog hater comment earlier and made an unwarranted ad hominem attack. I'm a parent as well as a dog and cat owner, so can be a subject of hatred in several directions!

Dogs give a huge amount to us, asking for very little in return. As well as loving companions they work tirelessly in many roles, including dogs for the disabled, guide dogs, dogs for the deaf, hospital/hospice/care home visiting dogs, police dogs, army dogs, drug sniffer dogs, airport dogs, sheep dogs, mountain rescue dogs, RNLI dogs, sled dogs, guard dogs, there’s probably more.

As humans we owe dogs a lot, like it or not.

Whilst I agree kicking a dog is not good, I had an unpleasant dog related experience in the park with my DD when she was tiny. The worst one occurred when I'd taken her out of the pram and was holding her on my knee. She was wearing a purple hooded cardigan and a big dog suddenly appeared from nowhere and grabbed her hood in its jaws. I was terrified and DD was hysterical. The owner finally caught up and said 'oh he likes colourful things.' No apology. I was so shaken that all I could do was put DD back in her pram and run home, where I burst into tears.

Luckily DD is not scared of dogs as a result - she loves them - but it has traumatused me and I'm still angry that that woman lets her dog rove around a park which is heavily populated with small children and babies wearing brightly coloured garments. If a dog comes near us now I still flinch, obvs I wouldn't lash out at it but I'm extremely wary.

I'm afraid I'm of the school of thought that a dog is an animal and therefore can never be fully trusted.

What an incredibly ignorant and insensitive post, bluesky.

Are the elderly people whose dogs are their only company selfish?
Are the lonely, divorced,, widowed Ines who have a dog selfish?
For mant having a dog brings social interaction and benefits, and I find fellow dog owners friends the best help in crisis.

How about the people who have depression and a suicidal who only manage because they have a dog to keep them going? Are they selfish?

Who are you to judge these people? Who are you to say their dogs bring no benefits to society?
Children grow up and leave the house, families grow apart, friends die.

If you and the likes of you can't see all this then I feel sorry for you and your children and I do wonder where the hatred come from.

If your going to have your dog off the lead you have to accept they are at risk from other dogs and people.

Other dogs fine - but at risk from people really?! If a grown human kicked my dog for no other reason that it walking up to them I'd be so angry.

I understand you’re upset but she was protecting her baby.

Yeah, she must really care a lot, smoking a cigarette whilst holding said baby.

the lives of those who don't matter and their precious offspring.

This sums up the entitlement of some dog owners.

People do matter more than dogs, no dog has the right to be bothering anyone else in their vicinity and its the owners responsibility to make sure that doesnt happen not the persons responsibility to accept a strange dog bothering them.

And lets get real, ops dog is not a service dog, nor a companion to the elderly etc etc, these dogs are not part of the thread. It is a pet and its her responsibility to ensure it doesnt impact on anyone else. And she has taken this on board which is great.

Crikey OP - you’ve been given a hard time on here. I think what this thread illustrates beyond a shadow of a doubt is that not everyone likes dogs, quite a few people are scared of them (with reason) and some positively hate dog owners. I think that’s probably something the bear in mind when walking your dog - as well as keeping up the training. For the record, I don’t have a dog, but I would love your puppy to bound up to me and would give him a stroke.

The comparison with humans doesnt hold water, we have children to be the next generation of workers, taxpayers, innovators, carer for the elderly etc.

You're aware that the population is increasing by two people per SECOND right? Two people die per second around the globe and four are born, approximately.

Willow2017 "And lets get real, ops dog is not a service dog, nor a companion to the elderly etc etc, these dogs are not part of the thread"

But if others are going to make vast, sweeping generalisations about all dogs and all dog owners then it is fair enough that some people point out, with practical examples, about some of the good that dogs bring to the world.

The thread was derailed long ago by people saying that all dogs are 'disgusting shit machines' etc and that 'all dogs are dangerous and should be muzzled.' If those kinds of statements are going to be made in reference to one isolated experience then you need to acknowledge that there are lots of positive examples out there too and not totally disregard those when it doesn't suit you. If anything, the original post proves that dogs aren't always wild, dangerous animals because even when being kicked, this dog didn't turn on anyone, or do a poo, or hump anyone's leg (just like lots of faithful service dogs, loyal companions etc).

I am sick of people letting their dogs off the lead and not being in control of them, and having them charge up to people, intruding on their personal space, spooking them, barking at them, and generally being a nuisance

This.

People don't let their kids do this even if they do let them play Peppa Pig on speakerphone. Your dog is your pet. So please keep it away from other people.

However, there's no excuse for kicking a dog, puppy or no, unless it's hanging onto a piece of your anatomy by its teeth.

"I have tried to read the whole thread but failed. Human babies/ toddlers get away with everything. But young dogs are somehow a "menace" whatever they do when they are learning. Puppies have to learn, same as humans (and they tend to be a lot quicker about it) On the numerous occasions that a toddler (off the lead) has approached my dog (s), would it be acceptable for me to kick your child?"

Please do tell what everything do human babies get away.
Maybe you should read the whole tread and it would do you some good because right now your thinking is incredibly weird.
Human babies might be annoying to people who dont like children but they dont have the potential to hurt you or cause lasting damage or even kill you with their teeth. Noone is allergic to babies/ toddlers and noone is terrified of them. The same can not be said about dogs.
And no, you should not kick a toddler if it approaches your dog..

Purplepillowcase, where exactly are these wonderful fenced in safe places that you can teach your dog recall?

I can assure you there are none near me

^
Today 09:34 mydogisthebest

Purplepillowcase, where exactly are these wonderful fenced in safe places that you can teach your dog recall?^

I can assure you there are none near me

then ask your council for permission to make one in the local park and fund it.

She was a nasty stupid bitch and I would have told her that loudly. She is also scummy for smoking while holding a baby

A very tiny minority of dogs have a working role the vast majority are just living toys, their owners enjoy having them but to everyone else they are a nuisance.
The pet industry has encouraged dog owners to think of their dogs as furbabies .....equivalent to humans, purely in the interest of profit because it's the best way to get owners to spend a lot of money on their dogs.
Because the dog owner sees its dog as quasi human it begins to think of the dog as the moral equivalent of the human that's why we have all this nonsense about 'my dog must have the freedom to blah blah blah'
Not much point arguing with the dog owners they just dig their heels in and defend their fur babies all the more

Incidentally I don't hate dogs many of them are cute and friendly and of course dogs don't have the mental Capacity to make moral decisions, it's not logical to hold the dog responsible for its behaviour in human Society
I do have a strong dislike for dog owners who use their dogs to inconvenience annoy and intimidate other people

Will somebody please explain to me how I can tell a dog that will bite me from one that won't? I have been bitten by a dog, and so has my DS - so I know it happens. Neither of the dogs who bit us looked like 'the type' that bite. They were both cute and fluffy.
So when a dog is running towards me in a park, I have maybe 5 - 10 seconds to work out what kind of dog he is. Having been bitten (and then wasted hours in A&E getting the bites cleaned and having tetanus jabs), I think I am entitled to feel a bit nervous. And entitled to defend myself.
But if one of you lovely dog owners can explain to me how I can tell a dog that will bite from one that won't, that would be fantastic. And if you can tell me how I can spot that difference in the short time it takes them to run over to me, even better.

"She was a nasty stupid bitch"

For trying to keep a dog away from her?

Why shouldn't she?

then ask your council for permission to make one in the local park and fund it.

Judging by the number of threads on here about dog owners ignoring such spaces and letting their dogs run free to annoy adults and kids alike it would be a complete waste of time and money!

She was a nasty stupid bitch

Why?
For not wanting some random dog running at her and her baby, for not knowing if it was going to bite her, jump up on her or not?
When did we all become telepathic?

My MIL’s dog had a big fight on another dog off the lead, it was bloody and brutal and in a park by children.

Thank heavens it was the dog and not a child.

Bloody menace they are - yes, even Fifi who wouldn’t hurt a fly. Should be on a lead at all times.

You hear it on the news, time and again, dog kills child - makes my blood boil.

Ddl she was nasty and stupid for having a small baby out in November at 8.00pm at night and filling their tiny little lungs with toxins. Chest infection waiting to happen really isn’t it.
So if she has that little regard for her own tiny human baby she probably was overly aggressive to the puppy. We should have respect for all living creatures including babies and dogs. She doesn’t sound like she has much respect for baby. Kicking a puppy before you have attempted a less aggressive “shooing” is cruel and out of order.

MeAndMyElephant

You can tell by body language. Are the ears back or raised? Is the tail up or down, is it holding its head high or low?