To ask WWYD re inheritance

[littleteethies]

I'll try to keep this as brief as poss, more of a WWYD I think
DM and DF bought a house 20 years ago (v nice location, meant for their retirement) months before DM passed away (v sudden and unexpected). DF met someone else (let's call her W from witch) v soon after (months) and again v soon after that he retired, sold his business interests and moved in with W into said house.
I did find it all rushed at the time but I was 20 hrs old, devastated after losing DM and just wanted DF to be happy. There was never any conflict between me and W, quite the opposite, although as the years went by I came to realise she was very selfish towards DF and just not a nice person.
About 5 years ago, DF's health deteriorated and I believe he and W have arranged wills. In a casual convo they told me that the agreement is that the surviving partner gets to remain in the house until their death, at which point it will be sold and split equally between me and W's son.
I had no objection whatsoever, my main concern was DF getting better and I even refused to talk about wills and inheritance and things like that. The justification was that W has sold her property whilst living with DF and given DF half the value of the house - I find this vv hard to believe as DF also sold another 2 properties whilst with her (again bought together with DM), had a pension and still worked; there's no way he could have spent all that money. But as it was now her home as well I felt that was the right thing to do.
My DF passed away too a couple of years ago, it completely floored me and the last thing on my mind was this house. Before the funeral she told me it would cost £8k to "read the will" and as we already know what their agreement was, there is no point to waste so much money.
I kept in v close contact with W, mainly because I felt she was a kind of link I had with DF's memory but as months went by this link started to fade and she became somewhat disinterested. However every time I went to see her, take her out for lunch etc she made a point of telling me how her son has given her money for various home improvements and generally pointing out many negatives about the house - they all seemed if not made up, then greatly exaggerated.
This made me somehow suspicious so one day over lunch I've casually asked to see DF's will. All hell broke loose, she started screaming at me, calling me names and stormed off. Just like that.
She has not spoken to me since, although bar a birthday card and a card for an anniversary, I've made no attempt either. I have though searched online and there is no will logged with DF's name; I've also looked up land registry records and the house has been in her name since 2003 (I presume DF's name was also on it and taken off).
I guess my question would be If there's anywhere to go from here? If the house is now solely in her name and I don't have a copy of DF's will, does that mean I have no claim whatsoever? Is there any point paying a solicitor?
It's hell of a lot of money to say goodbye to, but what kills me is it's the house DM bought and envisaged retiring in and this nasty woman got everything DM didn't have a chance to. And why didn't I say anything to DF at the time, but that's another thread.

I agree OP, it’s very sad but where money is concerned all morals and decency goes out the window. I suspect that if anything happens to FIL, DH will be in a similar situation. His W is already hostile and is making sure he is slowly pulling away from his biological family.

I know DF wrote a will as he told me so. But as I couldn't find it online, I assume W never registered it with solicitors (I'm pretty sure DF would have let her sort out the legal bit)

This would also explain the nonsense she told you about it costing £8000 to read a will, so "let's not bother" - I'm afraid I'd have smelled a huge rat right there

Certainly it could be worth a chat with a solicitor, but sadly it looks like she's stitched the whole thing up. If your DF made her joint owner of the house (indicated by her being on the deeds) then it will pass to her, and any money she's managed to ... errr ... acquire could easily be described as a gift since there's nobody to prove otherwise now

If the house was in joint tenancy with rights of survivorship then W inherits the house. Just as if she had predeceased OP's dad, he would have inherited it. If the house was tenants in common then each 'tenant' (W and OP's dad) owns 1/2 of the house and can leave their share of the house to whomsoever they wish. An agreement for life estate (partner remains in the house) is normally done when the house is in the sole name of one person and the other has no ownership interest. This is not uncommon when the original homeowner wants the house to go to a third party (i.e. kids) but wants their current spouse to be able to live there the rest of their life.

If the house has been in W's name since 2003, then this was done (I presume) with your dad's agreement. This would have taken the house out of your dad's estate and W would have know that. So the house is not the reason she didn't want the 'will read' AND she blew up when you asked to see it.

I'm guessing that there was an agreement between them to put the house in her name (to 'provide her with a secure home') and that an amount of cash/other assets would be set aside as your inheritance in lieu of an interest in the house. If she wanted to keep all your dad's assets for herself, naturally she wouldn't want the will read nor for you to see it!!

I'd start by calling every single attorney in town and asking them if they have your dad's will.

If the house was jointly owned it wouldn’t be subject to the Will anyway.

W is in the lead to win CF 2017!!! She’s a gold star Cheeky Fucker, son like CF in training. Call a solicitor.

Did your dad have any other assets apart from the house? You have already stated his back account was empty but what about shares, bonds or expensive jewel ly or cars.

So let me get this right.
Your DF is a wealthy businessman who owns SEVERAL houses. He moves his girlfriend into a house he already owns and puts her on the feeds because she sold her house and they lived on that money.

A few years later there isn’t a penny in his account and he has left nothing ??

However he WAS the owner of a house. So he has either LEFT it all to her - in which case there MUST be a will. Or he hasn’t left a will and therefore under the intestacy laws - you have a share.

Pursue this OP.. rapido - conniving witch. ! At least Dad was smart enough not to marry her !!

Across I'm sure there weren't other assets or money. DF did have 2 other properties and a commercial business interest but they were sold years ago and the money was spent.
There was an agreement between them, along the lines of surviving partner gets to stay there for life after which house is split between me and her son. As the house is now solely in her name I presume DF trusted her to put me in her will, which of course will never happen.
I will call the solicitors in their town and I will see a solicitor myself. I will also try to talk to her. I'm not holding much hope though.

Kittens or it was all jointly held and so goes to w without the need for a will or probate.
I would be a bit more careful before pursuing with solicitors and running up legal bills.
She needs to go back to the land registry and find out how the house was originally held and then depending on what she finds then decide if she has any realistic chance of pursuing this.

"No, they were not married."

As far as I am aware, if they were not married, W cannot inherit unless named on the will, and then she will only inherit what was bequeathed to her.

Nor can she close his affairs (including bank accounts) unless she is the only named executor.

Get a solicitor.

^^This^^ and this....

Before the funeral she told me it would cost £8k to "read the will" and as we already know what their agreement was, there is no point to waste so much money.

So she basically did admit there was a will. Does this not need to be declared at probate? It all smells quite dodgy and you need to get to the bottom of this one way or the other. Absolutely I would look into this further.

He had a car which she sold a few weeks after funeral "to help with costs" and some jewellery which she said she gave to his only brother - that's my uncle but he's a lot closer to her than he is to me, I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him.
After DF passed away, I remembered her telling me my uncle was an executor? trustee? I rang him a few months ago to discuss but he told me it's none of his business and pretty much put the phone down.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing and I should have acted on this immediately after DF passed away, but I was too sad and bewildered.

kittens that's about right, except I would definitely not call him wealthy, comfortable at best. I believe he has left the house to her in a will (although if that happened I should be able to find online shouldn't I?? Sorry I'm confused!) and he trusted her to put me in her will.

As far as I am aware, if they were not married, W cannot inherit unless named on the will, and then she will only inherit what was bequeathed to her.

If the house is bought in joint names, it will default to her as it is in what is known as beneficial joint ownership unless its bought as tenants in common - please get legal advice because most people here haven't got a legal clue

www.legal-advice-centre.co.uk/joint-ownership.html

As the house is now solely in her name I presume DF trusted her to put me in her will ...

An unfortunate and very common mistake, I'm afraid; trust isn't always a good idea where money's concerned

And given "W"'s previous reaction, can I suggest you might want to take advice before speaking to her again? It might not get you anywhere, but at least you'd have a greater understanding of where you stand if she produces more silly claims

cant they must have been on the deeds jointly, because I remember about 10 years ago they took a v small remortgage type loan (I'm talking £10k) for an extension.
So it's either gone directly to her in which case am I right to assume I got not hope whatsoever ?
If he has left his half in his will to her trusting her to put me in her will again I have no hope, but in this case the will should come up online?

Can someone explain to me how something like this can happen?

When someone dies does nok just divvy stuff up, according to the will if they feel like it/have on the ball relatives, or is there actually a legal process to ensure the will is applied as it should be?

Same as probate if there is no will- surely the division of assets must be done by someone legally. I can’t believe it would go to probate and decided x gets half, y gets the other half, give one person the money and sort it out yourselves.

So how can W just transfer the house into her own name and not apply probate/will? There must be checks?

If the house was jointly owned, it's hers. Unless it was as tenants in common and your dad stipulated what should happen to his share. But it sounds more like it was joint tenants. That is what you need to check.

If the money was held in joint bank accounts, it's hers.

But if he didn't leave a will, and they weren't married, you are next of kin and should be able to find out about anything he did leave. There is some useful guidance here: www.gov.uk/wills-probate-inheritance

Sorry that's not very clear. Basically if they were not married, you are next of kin and you can find out if he was intestate or left a will and and there is anything for him to leave.

You are NOK regardless of whether he left a will or not.

This is what land registry says:
Title absolute

1. (date in 2003) proprietor: W's name
2. (same date in 2003) restriction: no disposition by a sole proprietor f the registered estate (except a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered unless authorised by an order of court.

Does anyone know what this means?

OP, the WW's (Wicked Witch) story absolutely stinks. It is putrid. Get thee to a probate solicitor post haste and take her down. She sounds as guilt and conniving as hell.

Check on the Law Society website as they list solicitors who specialise in probate for the location you want.

Sounds like we're all rooting for you. I'd be devastated in your position. Do please report back, there must be something you can do.

As you are his NOK you are entitled to anything of your fathers if there's no will. If there is you need to see a copy of it. I would tell W you wish to see a copy of the will otherwise you will seek legal advice and contact the police as she has no legal right to access money from his bank accounts after his death.

There's a reason your dad never married her and one of them could have been to ensure you received something upon his death.

W is hiding something. It costs nothing to read a will.

If the house was jointly owned then you won’t have any claim on it.

Really there is checks so to transfer property after death you either need a grant of probate using the will as the basis of division of assets or no will using the intestancy rules.

But property is jointly owned then they each own it in its entirety so it would not be subject to a will or probate as you cannot leave in your will something that someone else already owns.

reallyanotherone it's all clearly explained here:

www.gov.uk/wills-probate-inheritance

The point about owning a house in joint names, though, is that neither will nor probate is needed to transfer ownership when the first person dies. "Joint" means what it says, and if one owner isn't there any more it simply passes to the other

Sorry I did say I have no clue about these things!
So just to be clear, if the house was jointly owned which I'm pretty sure it was (by both in its entirety) it all went to her and that's that?

Does anyone know what number 2) on title registry means ? If anything?
I've posted above.

2. (same date in 2003) restriction: no disposition by a sole proprietor of the registered estate (except a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered unless authorised by an order of court.

I had a glimmer of hope this might mean tenants in common ?

Right OP I'm sure that means she owns it as tenants in common as opposed to a joint tenancy. I hope this means that upon her death you should inherit a share. But why all the skull duggery by her? And where the hell has all the other money gone?