Sister lost husband and moving on too soon

[Pipsqueaked]

My BIL sadly passed away 2 years ago. Him and DSis have 2 children now 10 and 12.

After a year my sister met someone new (who seems a really lovely man) and they are now talking about moving in together. My Neices are devastated and say it's too soon.

My sister says she is in love and finally happy again and that the girls love her partner so will come around once they realise he isn't going to.be replacing BIL.

I don't know what to do. Me and sister have never been close (she's a lot older than me) but our parents are really concerned and have said if it's too soon for the girls it should be too soon for her as well. My sister has asked me to talk them round because she says they will listen to me but I don't know what I can do. The truth is I do feel for my nieces. AIBU to stay out of it and let them work it out amongst themselves?

Parents upset that the girls are so unhappy and feel like there needs are being ignored. Think they are mostly upset about the moving in and talks of having more children together.

I will suggest family counselling might be useful for everyone. I will also tell DP to try and be more understanding of Dsis. And other than that stay out of it.

Are you sure they haven't had grief counselling? It's sometimes arranged through school, so you might just not know. But either way, getting them more support would be ideal.

The children's bereavement network and Winston's Wish are who to contact to find resources and local support. Also local hospices sometimes organise excellent events for bereaved children.

Part of what kids need support with, after losing one parent, is their fears about the other. Mine we're (unbeknownst to me at the time) worried about me being so lonely and were making plans to live at home forever So they were quite relieved when someone nice came into my life! They were also very worried about who would look after me if I got ill like their dad had, and where they'd live if I died. So the close bond with my second husband, and him getting PR for them, was massively healing, too.

Finally, being a lone parent to children with emotional trauma is exhausting. You might want to think about whether your sister is getting enough practical support, as sometimes I've seen new relationship for fellow wids progress fast partly because the new chap is helpful and willing, and the extra support is so valuable.

I remarried just over 2 years after dh died. He died in March 86 and I remarried late 88. We asked all 5 of our joint dc what they thought and promised we would not marry unless all 5 were happy (aged 12,14, 16, 17 and 18). We also said that if need be we would wait till the youngest was 18 but would be ‘partners’ just not living together. It took them 15minutes to say,”Go for it, we have decided you are more fun together than separate.” I would advise your sister to wait till her dc are ready. Mine already knew dh and his dc before we got together. Nearly 30 years later we share 9 smashing dgc and a largely happy blended family.

pipsqueaked

I feel like you're getting a bit of a hard time when you've been clear that, had you not been asked for your opinion, you wouldn't have given it.

I don't envy you. You're potentially going to upset either your parents or your sister.

Are you close to your nieces? Would they open up to you?

I don’t think you’re BU to stay out of it OP.

FWIW, while it’s great she’s met someone I do think moving him in after this length of time seems a bit quick especially if her daughters are upset. They’ve probably only just started getting used to their dad not being there and having just their Mum, and now they have to get used to another man coming to live with them? They’re only little girls. What’s the rush to have him move in?

Please don't start suggesting counselling to your sister. If she wants to access this for herself and her daughters she needs to reach that decision herself.

Falling in love and grieving a lost love don’t have specified time limits. If they are in love and there’s are no other concerns you and your family need to welcome this and support your nieces. Maybe talk to sis to find ways to ease the children’s fears.

It's ridiculous to say because the children are finding it too soon, therefore hard, that the mother is doing something she shouldn't be ready for yet.

My cat died. She was 18 years old and I had had her since she was a kitten. Within a month we had two rescues cats living with us. Some people would have said that was too soon. If I'd done what they thought I should the cats could easily have lived in the rescue centre for six or more months or whatever the accepted time would have been, and we would all have felt bereft and like our house was no longer a home. All to satisfy someone who had no business commenting as not their place.

For those hard of thinking I am NOT saying a loss of a cat is the same as the loss of a husband. I am saying what would be the benefit of denying someone peace, love, happiness for months or years just to fit in with someone else's opinion?

The mother clearly does need to be mindful of her children's feelings, everyone else needs to butt out and be guided by the mother and the mother needs to be willing to have the partner move out if the children can't cope but I would hope they would be willing to give him a chance for their mums sake.

ilovesooty
"Please don't start suggesting counselling to your sister. If she wants to access this for herself and her daughters she needs to reach that decision herself."

I completely disagree. There is nothing wrong with gently and sensitively making the suggestion. It's a suggestion, that's all. It's not making a decision for her.

The OP's sister has already asked her to get involved. So it's very appropriate for her to suggest that a counsellor might be better placed to help them resolve their different feelings about the issue.

Unless your parents have been in her shoes I suggest they try to be a little less judgmental. Who are they to say it had been too soon? They would do well to be supportive and avoid negative comments around d the children.

Her sister has asked her to get involved but this can be done in a variety of ways - ie reassuring and listening to her nieces, encouraging her sister to be more communicative with her parents.
I don't think suggesting counselling has to be part of it. It's not at all uncommon for people to access counselling because other people suggested it rather than because they have decided to.

SeaCabbage But no one is saying that the sister can't have a relationship! They are saying it is very soon for the guy to move in.

This. The OP isn't judging either, she's only talking about it because her sister has put her on the spot with something she's not prepared to do herself.

I don't think suggesting counselling is a bad thing either. It's just putting the thought in her head for her to consider, it's not like you're frog marching her to counselling..

And as OP has posted more I've changed my opinion on the parents a bit too. If the sister isn't able or willing to talk to her children about their dad, because it will upset all of them, then perhaps she isn't as ready to move on as she thinks?

Gosh, this is so hard for everyone involved.

I think your family should keep their noses out. Of course the kids are going to think it's too early, they lost their father and they are also at a awkward age (almost teens) but it's her choice not there's. Really it's no one else's business.

I was entirely unconvinced that my DC needed grief counselling, ilovesooty as they're close to me and were talking to me lots and lots. And also none of them particularly liked the thought of it. But then so many people recommended it - school staff and GP and family members and friends - that I started realising that just me helping my kids might not be the best thing for them.

There's apparently a body of evidence that says people who have enjoyed happy marriages ended by death tend to remarry, and successfully so, much more rapidly than those whose marriages have ended with angry divorces. Which makes sense - a happy experience of what a spouse can bring to your life, plus not being screwed up by misery and a bad relationship.

Having said that, her kids are so young. And it's their home, too. If they have no issue with her dating, but just with having a new man in their home, then honestly I think I would sympathise with them on that. It's a huge step for kids approaching adolescence who have already suffered so much. I think she may want to wait for at least a while on bringing another father figure into the house. Kids grow and change so fast and before she knows it they will be gone. Adding this sort of hurt and resentment into the mix as they head into the hormone crazed years... I'd want to avoid that, if I were her.

I know she's asked you to get involved, but honestly, I'd stay out of it. I can see your parents' perspective. If the kids were adult I'd think it was none of their business, but they aren't. She isn't only choosing who she has to live with, here.

And what if your nieces are still 'desperate for it not to happen' in another two, three, five years time? In some ways it may be easier now than when they're teens. As someone whose DM lost her DH (my dad) young and got together with someone else within a couple of years, then herself was tragically killed in an accident, I say your sister should crack on. LIfe is too short. Why is she so desperate to seek your parents' 'approval', a couple who presumably have no experience of losing a spouse or of living alone week in and week out. Their opinions are largely irrelevant.
Counselling may be beneficial for your nieces too.

Reds rule
I don’t think there is a hard and fast rule about whose suffering trumps another’s. Losing a parent as a child is completely different than losing them when you are middle aged and they are elderly. I lost my father mid teens. I was devastated and finally got help for the depression I had been suffering from for many years in my early 20’s, which his death compounded. I felt his death terribly keenly for years and years. The pain only resolved recently and I am in my 40’s.

I always thought losing a partner to be far more devastating than a parent. But I was taught this by my narcissistic mother. She never comforted me when he died. And made me very aware he would have been devastated if he knew what I was really like.

My mother otoh found a new partner 2years after my dad’s death and married him a year later. He died earlier this year sadly.

I am sorry you are suffering from grief of losing your husband.

Pipsqueaked
My opinion is that if it is too early for the children, it is too early for the children. I think it could perhaps be more of a phased in thing to accustom them to the idea. Staying over the occasional weekend, trying to gel as a family. Not steam rolling them. I would refuse to convince them personally.

honey
"If the sister isn't able or willing to talk to her children about their dad, because it will upset all of them, then perhaps she isn't as ready to move on as she thinks?"
My thoughts exactly.

And it was actually the grief counselling that my kids had, and seeing how much it helped them, that then got me realising I needed it.

Also, it's not just one on one traditional counselling on offer. There are social and activity groups for bereaved children, where they meet others the same age in the same situation. They were brilliant for my kids. I wouldn't have known they existed if people hadnt recommended them to me.

If your sister doesn't like your nieces to talk about their father, that is making it very difficult for them. They perhaps haven't been able to grieve for him, to find ways to remember him and to accept (not 'get over') his death. It can seem to them like she is airbrushing him out of their lives, so introducing a new (and very serious) partner will only reinforce that.

Reading some of these might be useful to her (or to you as a way of talking to her about it).

www.kidshealth.org.nz/helping-child-cope-death-parent

www.goodtherapy.org/blog/how-to-help-children-grieve-death-of-parent-1212165

Falling in love and grieving a lost love don’t have specified time limits. If they are in love and there’s are no other concerns you and your family need to welcome this and support your nieces. Maybe talk to sis to find ways to ease the children’s fears.

But there are other concerns. Her 2 children who are also grieving their father's death have expressed that they are devastated by their mother's plans to remarry. If that isn't a concern what is?

I think 2 years on is very soon for such young children for whom their home and how it works is still their primary focus and sanctuary (older teens are generally in the mindset of moving on a bit). And whether the children are right or wrong they have no control here over a huge change in their lives which must feel terrifying considering they had no control 2 years ago either when their lives changed.

It is possible for the sister to be genuinely in love with a lovely man and for the children to feel devastated by her remarrying. I would err on the side of the children in this case - it doesn't mean the sister has to end her relationship just maybe slow down a bit on the marrying.

OP, you are in a hard position. Could you talk to your nieces and then your sister and see where you get?

Unless your parents have been in her shoes I suggest they try to be a little less judgmental. Who are they to say it had been too soon? They would do well to be supportive and avoid negative comments around the children.

The parents are only concerned because the children are devastated - they aren't judging her moving on and meeting someone but marrying when her children are very upset at the idea. I'd hate to think that if it was DH after I died, his mother would ignore my children's feelings completely and cheer him on with whatever he wanted.

I agree that social and activity groups for the children might be beneficial and they are something a lot of people are unaware of.

I'm a trained counsellor who was trustee chair of a bereavement charity until last year. We had clients refer who actively sought the help and others who were there because their family "thought it might be a good idea". The latter had a high drop out rate. I suppose I'm just trying to say that suggesting counselling to someone isn't necessarily the most appropriate course of action.

Some people take longer than others to move on. It is the right time for your sister. Nothing to do with anyone else.