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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Delicate folks and less robust people

126 replies

ILikeyourHairyHands · 07/10/2017 22:59

It's Saturday night and I've had a few beers so I guess I'm feeling a bit fighty, but only because this is something that's been bothering me for a while and it has been sparked by the 'Books you wished you'd never read' thread, a number of posters said they had thrown books away rather than subject people to the content.

And films people wished they'd never watched because they were traumatised.

But, and this is the big but, where I'm probably going to get a thrashing, there are often threads about abortion, where posters say you 'Will never get over it'.

And threads about miscarriage where people say, 'You will never get over it'.

And I completely respect their stance and experience, BUT, as someone who has had both miscarriages and abortions I found them both very easy to get over and put behind me, and I think the telling women that they Won't, can make things much harder for people.

If they do, they may feel guilt, or it may make women feel they can't have an abortion because they will always feel conflict.

I guess my point is, everyone responds to things differently, you can't go round chucking books away because you found them distasteful, you can't council a woman who has had a miscarriage she will never get over it and you can't advise against an abortion because it 'will affect you forever'.

And yes, it is a goady title but I'm a little bit irritated about absolutism when it comes down to women, choice, and mental health.

It's ok to be ok.

OP posts:
Itsanicehotel · 08/10/2017 00:12

Struggling to get over something traumatic doesn't mean someone is delicate or not robust.. I think that's a very simplistic and harsh judgement. Finding something a struggle yet living with the feelings involved takes a lot of strength and resolve imo.

Quartz2208 · 08/10/2017 00:13

And it's ok not to be

Shenanagins · 08/10/2017 00:14

Op I kind of get what you are saying. I am currently grieving for the loss of a parent and one of the kindest and most understanding thing someone said to me is that there is no right way to grieve, we’re all different and that’s ok.

It nothing to do with robustness is just doing things differently.

brasty · 08/10/2017 00:14

No it is not delicate to struggle to get over something traumatic. But it is not inevitable that someone else will struggle if they have the same experience.

Original poster
ILikeyourHairyHands · 08/10/2017 00:15

I'm glad you reanimated SGB, whilst I don't always agree with you, your robust opinions are welcome back.

OP posts:
LuckLuckLUCK · 08/10/2017 00:15

red I don't think the OP is showing a lack of empathy. She is saying that those with an absolute view on miscarriage/abortion are themselves showing a lack of empathy. They are not accepting that anyone else can get over it and move on.

Tortycat · 08/10/2017 00:20

"Resilience is circumstantial. If you are a secure person from an emotionally and psychologically secure background who has some degree of control over your circumstances, you will cope with things better than others. That doesn't make you superior, that makes you fortunate"

Yes yes yes. Sorry dont know how to make it bold but pp spot on

Original poster
ILikeyourHairyHands · 08/10/2017 00:22

I accept that as a person that has not had any problems with fertility, and fuck, has had problems with over-fertility, that is a fucker for someone who cannot conceive, for whatever reason.

In life, when you get the opposite of what you want. IT'S CRAP.

Just because our reasons are the opposite side of the scale, it doesn't mean we have to hate each other because we had to deal with exactly the thing the other one doesn't want.

OP posts:
brasty · 08/10/2017 00:22

Resilience is to do with upbringing and I think personality. I know some people who have had a terrible start in life, and yet have got their life together, and others who never have.
But they are not to blame for struggling.

Teabagtits · 08/10/2017 00:23

I’m quite robust, certainly not delicate. I had a miscarriage and thought I’d be ok but it floored me & that was totally unexpected.

Well done OP on being able to just move on from things but as you point out yourself everyone is different. Everyone will react differently and it’s fuck all to do with robustness.

I don’t get people traumatised by fiction but that’s only because it’s not my experience and I certainly wouldn’t belittle someone for having a different experience to me.

Poor attempt at goady post.

7Days · 08/10/2017 00:25

But who does that?
Who does that that has an effect on you? People only know what you tell them. And many people are gob shites so don't tell them.
There is a lot to be said for a sense of privacy and decorum.

So that the only people who know YOUR business are the people ypu are close too who know YOUR circumastances, your personality etc. Their opinion matters and you shoukd take that on board- not sounding merchants

Original poster
ILikeyourHairyHands · 08/10/2017 00:30

That was Hedda, Torty, and she is right, resilience is circumstantial, it is obviously much more easy to be resilient if we have all the choices.

Thing is, in this country, even if it's hard to find them. We do have the choices, not as many as some, sometimes, but they are there.

If I knew how to give everyone the same choices, I'd do it in a fucking second.

But life ain't so simple.

OP posts:
brasty · 08/10/2017 00:33

There is research to show that most people who go through a traumatic event, such as being in a terrorist incident but having no more than minor injuries to them or loved ones, will get over it simply by talking to supportive friends and family. But of course, not everyone has that. Its not just your past, it is your present as well. If you have a miscarriage and your DP is unsympathetic and unsupportive, then surely it would be harder to get over?

BubbaLips · 08/10/2017 00:57

.

Original poster
ILikeyourHairyHands · 08/10/2017 01:01

Tea, it wasn't goady.

I'm not even going to get enervated by the use of Goady.

I think that's my point.

OP posts:
Cantseethewoods · 08/10/2017 01:06

The issue with forums like this is that people are advising from a personal rather than intellectual stance and many people populate the special interest boards because of their personal experiences, so on a termination thread, no-one will say (for e.g.- not real stats)

"Peer reviewed research shows that you have a 40% chance of not regretting it at all, 40% of regretting it a bit and 20% chance of not every recovering"

It will all be about their personal experiences and either "talking their own book" (i.e. justifying their own choices) or trying to make people avoid what happened to them.

brasty · 08/10/2017 01:08

A lot of people are incredibly bad at recognising that not everyone feels the same about the same experiences.

Lagerthaisfabulous · 08/10/2017 06:12

I can see where the Op is coming from.

I hate people who post 'you will regret this for the rest of your life and never get over it' on threads where the op is contemplating abortion. Especially when the poster also says 'its entirely your decision though'.

It feels very manipulative.

I had an abortion and got over it. It was the right decision for me at the time and i have never regretted it. For many people it is the right decision. There are no guaranteed absolutes. When i have posted that i have been told by other posters that i am not being helpful.

Cantseethewoods · 08/10/2017 08:07

Also I would imagine that the MN pregnancy choices board is on the radar of pro- life groups....

WhirlwindHugs · 08/10/2017 08:17

I agree that 'you'll never get over it' posts about abortion are mainly written by people who don't give a fuck about the mother because they believe abortion is wrong and that's more important. Doesn't mean they haven't had an abortion themselves and regretted it, but it does mean they've probably been hanging around abortion regret groups that are sometimes designed by anti-abortion groups to make women feel guilty, not help them come to terms with it. (anti-abortion groups go to insane and horrific lengths to keep women in their place is not a shock)

Anyway. I agree with you. It's okay, to disagree, it's not okay to decide how other people should react.

WhirlwindHugs · 08/10/2017 08:18

Shit I meant woman, I'm really sorry. Genuine mistake with my mind on crazy people who treat every woman as an incubator and very little sleep.

BarbarianMum · 08/10/2017 08:27

I always think the "you'll never get over this" with respect to miscarriage is laden with overtones of "and if you do you're a lesser human being". With abortion opinions seem to fall into 2 camps - the "you'll regret this for ever" forced birthers and "you'll just be relieved and won't regret it at any point " camp. So many people wanting to dictate the emotional response of others, with a bit of added guilt if you get it wrong.

toomuchtooold · 08/10/2017 08:38

OP doesn't like people being told "you'll never get over it". Plenty of people including me find "you'll get over it"/"no point dwelling" irritating as well (to me it feels like being shamed for being sad). I think the best thing is to acknowledge that you may find it easy or hard,and that either response is fine. It's all fine. We are all allowed to feel whatever we feel. Or alternatively just stop telling traumatized people anything, and start bloody listening... I think most people know how they feel, they don't need to be told

Littlebelina · 08/10/2017 08:39

I get what you are saying OP and largely agree. I read this article shortly after DD's death and it rang true for me.

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/jul/05/can-parent-get-over-death-of-a-child

Society expects you to behave in certain ways after traumatic events and if you don't meet those expectations it can not only be hard for others to cope with but can confuse yourself as well. I've spent a lot of time expecting to be a mess but am coming round to the idea that not how I deal with things. Doesn't mean I don't miss her and wish things were different.

I suspect the proportion of people who quietly deal is quite high but they won't be the people advising folks on the miscarriage\termination threads as they will be reluctant to share their experiences as they aren't seen as societies norms. Also I spotted a thread where the situation was similar to mine and I have been reluctant to post as I think our experiences of the loss are different and I'm worried about the fact I am (generally not all the time) coping might make her feel worse.

KarateKitten · 08/10/2017 08:44

I do sometimes think that people's natural resilience has been torn down by access to too much information and other people's opinions. Someone who is easily influenced could be easily influenced to override their natural resilience to life situations and be left with pain and suffering where they would have had it if they hadn't read about how fucked up they 'should' be over something.

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