to consider reporting this family for having lied to the school?

[mnbvcx445566]

Two parents and one child. They live nowhere near the primary state school they applied for and got into. I think - am pretty sure - they used a different address to the one they live at.
School very sought after. Shall I report them?

I've looked carefully into myself and this is what I think:

1- I am not jealous. If I had the chance to do the same I would not. I would like my child to go to a great state school so they are lucky for that but I would not play the way they did.

2- If I report them the child will have problems at school (? don't quite know what happens in those cases). The parents might have a breakdown or something having to face the backlash. Obviously they have brains and made their choice and would only pay the consequences of their actions but - I - would have precipitated the situation by reporting them. Maybe the system is so fucked anyway that what they did is not that big of a deal. Surely the school should have done 1000 checks before awarding places so there might be something I do not know. What I do know is that they live miles from that school, which has a very very small catchment area.

3- I should report them because if my child did not get into that school 'legally' I would despise people who took advantage of a loophole and took 'my child's place'.

WWYD?

I am a long-time poster/user but I have opened a different account as I do not want to be recognised. (If I do not want to face them and tell them that they are committing an illegal/immoral action does it mean that I am in the wrong thinking of calling the school anonymously?)

She really hadn't got the wrong end of the stick. They were so shocked that they asked for confirmation twice, albeit only verbally. She wasn't either trying to convince me it was ok, because she didn't think it was ok morally and didn't do it. Most likely it was the people answering the phone who'd got the wrong end of the stick. But just in case, if our child ends up on a waiting list this year, I will definitely ask the same question and get them to put it in writing in order to then challenge them on it, because it really doesn't sound like it is legitimate as a rule.

You don't have any hard facts - so I would leave well alone. We live in the catchment area of generally crappy schools; which greatly displeases me; but it sounds to me like speculation. It is the schools job to be quite thorough in checking; I'm not saying that they don't make mistakes. My main concern, would be the child being unsettled by having to leave the school if this was the case; as the child is innocent.

I thought state (whether that's church, grammar, comprehensive) schools were no longer allowed to ask parents' occupations. I know some do it at a second round/appeal stage even though they shouldn't.

On some school applications, the parents occupations are asked for. Why do people think this is?!?!?!?!!!

I can't begin to guess!

I am genuinely disappointed at some of the attitudes on here. All the 'mind your own' 'keep your beak out' 'not your business'. Such unbelievably ignorant comments. If everyone of you who made those comments was denied a place at your children's school because someone lied, and you were the 31st child on the list of 30, wouldn't you feel that it was your business. The attitude that just because it doesn't affect you, you should keep quiet , is appalling.

This attitude to injustice is the exact same mind set that allows racism, bullying, harassment, domestic violence, child abuse and misogyny to go on unchecked. Because 'If it hasn't affected you personally I can't understand why you care???' - this was actually written by a mumsnet member on this thread . ! Really disgusting. Why do we care ? Because we're not all selfish self absorbed fuckers. We care because the rules are there to give everyone an equal chance. Regardless of personal gain.

OP - it's actually very simple. You only have two choices.

Say nothing. And someone who could have lost out on a place remains deprived and a cheat wins
Say something . And someone who has not lied and hasn't cheated will not be affected. If they have lied and cheated, then justice will be done.

Actually very easy.

But equally the people saying report report report are doing so from a place where it doesn't affect them because they have the means to move to a more desirable catchment therefore enabling good schools to get better and bad schools to flounder.

My main concern, would be the child being unsettled by having to leave the school if this was the case; as the child is innocent.

No one likes a child having to leave a place but I'm equally concerned for the children who have missed out and suffering as a result. Or Don't they matter as much

But equally the people saying report report report are doing so from a place where it doesn't affect them because they have the means to move to a more desirable catchment therefore enabling good schools to get better and bad schools to flounder.

What is your evidence for that? I don't think I have mentioned my personal circumstances at all in this thread - indeed I live in an admissions 'borderline area' where I could be very directly affected by school admissions fraud.

My reading of the thread is that most of those saying 'report' are doing so from a point of 'natural justice' and a wish to see fairness within society, not just the most sharp elbowed winning.

IME (and as a teacher i see a non-zero amount of this) the children most affected by school place theft are those who live in the more deprived areas on the fringes of the catchments of good schools. They have their places stolen by richer fraudsters spending money to move temporarily into overpriced rented property - or even maintain two owned properties - who then shrink the effective catchment / admissions footprint.

But equally the people saying report report report are doing so from a place where it doesn't affect them because they have the means to move to a more desirable catchment therefore enabling good schools to get better and bad schools to flounder.

Really? So what about those of us who've said report report report and posted about our negative experiences of our child being the child who's narrowly missed out on a place at our preferred schools? You really think we've all got the means to live next door to our preferred schools, or to buy our way into a better school after not getting our preferred schools? You really think it's completely impossible that any of us were affected by admissions fraud?

'But equally the people saying report report report are doing so from a place where it doesn't affect them because they have the means to move to a more desirable catchment therefore enabling good schools to get better and bad schools to flounder.'

Nope.

Rose where's your evidence of that because nowhere on this thread does it look like that's the case. I live in one of the most deprived working class areas and have no interest in anyone else's business but because the estate I'm on shares a post code with an affluent area we don't qualify for loads of services etc let alone schools. Doesn't mean I shouldn't be angry when people are unfairly barging in on school places

Ha ha, that really couldn't be further from the truth, *wildrose+.

Wildrose, if I had the means to move into a house securely in catchment of a good school then I'd do it in a flash!! I don't really relish the prospect of getting kids to and from two different schools at the exact same time...

by that very thought process, you are contributing to the divide against which you say you are so strongly opposed to. If you, a parent who highly values education, and other parents like you sent your children to the school that isn't currently good, you would create enough noise, have higher expectations, have the means to pay voluntary contributions all of which would contribute to making the 'bad' school better. But instead you moved to a better area as the other school is not 'good enough' for your child but you are appalled that somebody else, who can't afford to buy in the nicer area, but rents to achieve the same thing for their child.

I wrote this upthread to another poster who advised that she left her original house to buy in a location closer to a better school.

From what the most recent posters have said, soon there won't be such a thing as a 'bad' school, as there will be a much better mix in the current 'bad' schools. Sadly I don't believe this really will be the case though. The wealthy will benefit from the better school and do their best to keep the riff raff out, thereby creating an even bigger divide in society.

If everyone of you who made those comments was denied a place at your children's school because someone lied, and you were the 31st child on the list of 30, wouldn't you feel that it was your business.

Kittens my DD was that 31st child theoretically (in another year so the ICSs don't count but it was the main crux of the LAs argument). It did affect my DD, she had to have counselling as a result of all the bullying and I had no choice but to keep her there whilst we fought for this as I said upthread. The mum bragging in my scenario hadn't actually done anything wrong. Hadn't lied about the address or anything like that. She just knew how to use the system to her advantage.

All I'm saying to the OP is that it might all be perfectly legit. Like the person in my DDs case was.

To state the obvious it's most likely none of us will ever know if the case the OP referred to was genuine or a fraud and most people who have been disadvantaged by one or more place liars will never realize what's happened. But that doesn't mean it won't make a difference to speak out if you ever become aware of it. That doesn't have to mean contacting the school or LA. Like PPs have said this kind of deceit makes a bigger impact than you'd think