to consider reporting this family for having lied to the school?

[mnbvcx445566]

Two parents and one child. They live nowhere near the primary state school they applied for and got into. I think - am pretty sure - they used a different address to the one they live at.
School very sought after. Shall I report them?

I've looked carefully into myself and this is what I think:

1- I am not jealous. If I had the chance to do the same I would not. I would like my child to go to a great state school so they are lucky for that but I would not play the way they did.

2- If I report them the child will have problems at school (? don't quite know what happens in those cases). The parents might have a breakdown or something having to face the backlash. Obviously they have brains and made their choice and would only pay the consequences of their actions but - I - would have precipitated the situation by reporting them. Maybe the system is so fucked anyway that what they did is not that big of a deal. Surely the school should have done 1000 checks before awarding places so there might be something I do not know. What I do know is that they live miles from that school, which has a very very small catchment area.

3- I should report them because if my child did not get into that school 'legally' I would despise people who took advantage of a loophole and took 'my child's place'.

WWYD?

I am a long-time poster/user but I have opened a different account as I do not want to be recognised. (If I do not want to face them and tell them that they are committing an illegal/immoral action does it mean that I am in the wrong thinking of calling the school anonymously?)

Me neither.

Has the OP been back to say if she's going to report or not?

I for one would love to know the outcome of this.

If you lived near a shitty school but had the chance of giving your child a better start at a good school out of your catchment, what would you do?

I would play by the rules. If my child ended up at the shitty school I would go on the waiting lists for better schools and do whatever I could to help the shitty school improve. I would not use a false address or try to fiddle the system in any way.

How would you like it if someone was interfering in your child's future?

If you cheat you are interfering in another child's future - the child who should have got the place. But apparently you think that's ok. It isn't.

You do no that you don't need to live close to the school to get into it. It's whether they have space for that child and they most likely did.

And, before anyone says anything, I have been in the situation where, because I played by the rules, my child ended up in a school we really didn't want. We eventually got him into the school we did want but it was a long, somewhat stressful process. But I did it the right way.

Im.still not lying to get a place. Because im.not a thief

Fair enough, others make a different judgement call. They would chose to be a thief over giving their child a “shitty”education. You chose to give your child a “shitty” education and not be a thief.

As much as I wouldn’t do it either, I think I’d think long and hard about it as a parent, and I do understand why parents do it. The issue is education should not be a post code lottery. The fact it is, drives some people to be “thieves”. It’s a rock and a hard place for many and I have some empathy for those who chose to “steal”for the benefit of their own child.

We all want the same thing and it sucks that schools are so bad in some areas no one is disputing that at all.

I understand the reasoning behind wanting to do it because the thought of my dd going to some shithole next year has had me lying awake at night for weeks.

But I can't understand actually going through with it because whatever way you dress it up it's stealing. And it's not just taking some item that can be replaced. Family can't just do a whip round and get a new one. It's stealing an entire life course from someome. That's worse. And it can't he justified just because they never knew any different and it can't he justified cos "I'm alright jack"

I cannot understand stooping so low to do that. And I certainly can't understand risking being kicked out and ending up at a worse school than you were originally trying to avoid. Because there's a good chance you will get found out. So after all that you fucked over your kid and everyone else's kid for nothing

Giles, I get your reasoning and I don’t think I would do it either, but I can also see why people do it. It really is a rock and a hard place for many.

In this instance though this seems an affluent family. They own a rental property in the catchment area. They will have utility bills and council tax bills for it. I suspect they have used it to get their kids into th better school. Wrong, yes, but there will be no way to disprove they lived there.

Alternately they did nothing wrong and have a legitimate place for whatever reason.

And I certainly can't understand risking being kicked out and ending up at a worse school than you were originally trying to avoid

That's exactly what I don't understand either. It's a huge risk and not worth it imo

If it happened to you could you forgive your parents?

Like prh47bridge said you can get on a waiting list then there's no risk of ending up somewhere worse because you retain control of the situation

And I don't understand people who only put one choice down (where there is more than one choice) because it doesn't make it a better chance you'll get that one school, you're just leaving yourself more open to the LA deciding for you

Clever people would keep there mouths shut.

Then as I've said blunt

If they are legit it will be fine.

But if you understand why someone could lie then surely you can understand someome reporting somebody.

After all for all I know dd didn't get her preferred school for that very reason and if someone had reported maybe others on the list would have got in.

How is one understandable but the other not?

If you lived near a shitty school but had the chance of giving your child a better start at a good school out of your catchment, what would you do?

I would 100% lie, I would go to church, I would rent nearby, I would temporarily move in with grandma, whatever, if it were the difference between a good school or s shitty school for my child.
Renting my home out to fund renting a property near s great school and living there long enough to get a place and then moving back to the other home is definitely something I would do.
It's not stealing, it's not even cheating the system, it's playing the system. 100% I would do this - my 4 are all in excellent schools - and not by chance.

Given the London boroughs I know that don't allow you to apply from a rental address if you own another property I suspect if it was possible to mount a successful legal case it would already have happened.

There's a reason they had to introduce the policy.

The irony is that many of the excellent schools are in very wealthy areas where the majority of parents can afford to live and expect full commitment from the teaching staff and proper facilities. Many can afford private school fees but don't want to/feel they should have to pay. The school's reputation grows, teachers are accountable and those not getting results are removed. Meanwhile in the working class area, some of the teachers are less than enthusiastic which rubs off on the children, the teachers aren't accountable and the school's results suffer. The parents in both schools want the best for their child but it creates a two tiered society where those who can afford a 'good' area get a better education.

Needless to say I am massively generalising but I am trying to highlight the huge gap. If a parent had been through the second system themselves is it any wonder they will do what they can to procure a better educational experience for their own child. I'm not saying it is tight. I'm not saying working class areas all have unenthusiastic teachers. What I am saying is that, particularly in urban areas, schools create a divide not only in education but society and state funded schools should not do this yet it happens.

And by the way / it is perfectly legit to move away from a school after you've got a place. Plenary of people rent near good schools with no intention of staying, often with another home further away waiting to be returned to. It is not agaiinst any rules so child place is not in jeopardy. Slightly immortal perhaps but worth it for your children securing a good school place - especially if the alternative is a really bad school in special measures.

But if you understand why someone could lie then surely you can understand someome reporting somebody

I said though I accepted reporting if a strong likely hood of fraud, although I wouldn’t do it, I simply don’t accept she has a strong enough reason to suspect fraud, overwhelmingly this family could be there legitimately, and I think she has something else driving her here, that’s less than noble.

And in doing so 38Cody you've deprived other children who genuinely lived nearby of a place. They matter too but evufentmu6 not to people lime you. Smug, sad and very very selfish.

Let's hope it well and truly bites you on the arse in the future.

Clever people would keep there mouths shut.

If they're that clever they'd know it's their mouths too

No one likes a snitch, grass, tell tale whatever you want to fucking call it. I've never reported anyone about anything. But school place issues are bad already and only gonna get worse so I think anyone trying to call out selfish shit where they see it is probably on balance doing the right thing

*Given the London boroughs I know that don't allow you to apply from a rental address if you own another property I suspect if it was possible to mount a successful legal case it would already have happened.

There's a reason they had to introduce the policy.*

I'm also in London and I have never been asked if I own or rent on any application for either primary or secondary.

Perhap prh or tiggy could confirm whether that is within the rules.

And that's what I don't understand blunt

See to me

Not LAC
Not catchment
Not a sibling

Owning a second property

And exceeding the last admission distances significantly

And potentially no SN
(Although not confirmed so could be)

All add up to a strong case to suspect IMO

Or sure how much more you would want. And admission?

They may well be legit but how do you not suspect a thing?

The only things that would get you in above catchment are the SN or being adopted or medical reasons

Op has pretty much ruled them out although we can't be 100% on the AN

There's been no mention of the parents being police officers or social workers or army which im.sure would not have had op wondering if they were these things

So what does that leave?

They may have moved after the deadline that's allowed
.but im.strugglimg to think of anything else.

You would have to he banking on AN

Platform I meant the person doing the stealing, they are not clever theifs if they don't keep their mouths shut. The posts I'm reading on here, well, if the person is stupid enough to tell you then you should report them for being stupid. If it was me I wouldn't go blabbing about it.

What about unmarried couples who both had their own properties before meeting? Or people who say they are a couple? Or separated parents where one parent moves out and rents in an area which happens to be beside the good school? There are far too many genuine reasons for renting that cannot be the reason for the school to refuse.

38 That doesn't happen here either and could easily be challenged. This is a very transient area, one third of the houses on my road are rented and in estates closer to the 'good' secondary school, the houses need to have revolving doors to accommodate the turnover of people.

38 I appreciate your honesty (not being sarcastic) but I disagree with the idea that "playing the system" - using your buying power to do so - is OK (or rather, that's it's OK that we have a play-able system). The implication is that those of us who can buy our way in to better schools do so, which undermines the entire system of comprehensive state education. I'm angry that the current system allows it - by facilitating/condoning such vast differences in school quality and funding principally, but also by not cracking down harder on things like renting next to schools etc.

(And FWIW I'm not polishing my halo here - we bought a family home earlier this year. Criterion 1 on the list was that it was practically on top of the great school in my suburb, for which we obviously paid a premium. I've paid a premium in advance hoping to avoid paying school fees/having to sell up or rent when the time comes - though with my luck the school will go into SM or something at the moment I need it.)

I'm insanely jealous of other countries - never mind Finland, even bloody Russia manages it - where you turn up to your nearest school on 1 September, hand over your child and that's that.

And yes, as long as the system is play-able and there are significant perceived or actual disparities between schools, parents will do what they can.

I wouldn't go blabbing if I lied to get a place I'm not that stupid.