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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To wonder if the Prme Minister's speech today appeased anyone?

33 replies

Bearbehind · 22/09/2017 19:37

From what I can see Theresa May's speech today only served to highlight how far away we are from knowing what Brexit will look like.

Remainers must be annoyed that she doesn't appear to have realised we're 6 months into our 2 year deadline and is still trying to rally the troops and is still spouting out hyperbole and rhetoric with no inkling of an actual plan.

Leavers must be annoyed that she admitted there's no way in hell we can manage without a 2 year transition period on account if the fact we've not got anything in place to deal with the implications of leaving.

Where is the light at the end of this tunnel?

OP posts:
balsamicbarbara · 22/09/2017 19:48

Based on the comments I've seen over at the Daily Mail today it seems she's royally narked off both extremes Grin

Userwhocouldntthinkofagoodname · 22/09/2017 19:49

Where is the light at the end of this tunnel? Well the light is that we are leaving the EU with a soft landing to appease the 48%. Yes Leavers would have preferred a quicker exit but most accept that we have to think of the remainers and ease into divorce.

how far away we are from knowing what Brexit will look like well its still being negotiated so we wont know until after that is concluded in 2019.

The UK seems to be putting forward a good compromise for the EU but if they dont want to come to agreement then we have will have to walk away. You cant say we haven't been generous. Ball in EUs court now.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 22/09/2017 19:51

The UK seems to be putting forward a good compromise for the EU

This is a totally serious question- what compromise do you think we've put forward?

OP posts:
Userwhocouldntthinkofagoodname · 22/09/2017 19:58

what compromise do you think we've put forward

To start with we have offered to pay them another 2 years fees.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 22/09/2017 20:00

No we haven't, we've offered to buy 2 more years access to the Single Market.

OP posts:
scaryteacher · 22/09/2017 20:03

Compromise in Brussels speak means rolling over, playing dead, and handing over billions, and agreeing to whatever the EU wants. I don't think that's a tenable position. They cannot think outside the box, and they need to start doing so.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 22/09/2017 20:09

Why do you say that scary?

What have the EU demanded that is unreasonable?

We're the ones who are leaving- we should have the answers.

And the answers aren't just to carry on as we were just without the costs.

OP posts:
EamonnWright · 22/09/2017 20:10

These speeches and the replies to them are just public negotiation.

Usually somewhere inbetween.

scaryteacher · 22/09/2017 20:21

I think demanding a Brexit bill is unreasonable, without giving a legal basis for it, or a break down of it. Afaik, our assets have not been calculated, including the money in the EIB for example. There is nothing in Article 50 about a bill to leave. We have other assets as well to take into account.

I think demanding the ECJ has jurisdiction over matters to do with EU citizens in UK once we leave is off as well. No other country outside the EU is required to allow that, so why should the UK?

As for trade, if the EU introduce tariffs, then so should we. None exist at present; their choice to impose them.

I think it's a game of poker, and you don't show your hand in poker. If the EU refuse the MPs offer, then more fool them. They only see the UK as a cash cow and a block to the ambitions of the federalists.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 22/09/2017 20:25

Just taking tariffs as an example scary how do you think it can possibly work for a non-EU country to have tariff free access to the EU?

OP posts:
baffledcoconut · 22/09/2017 20:29

She's managed something quite spectacular.

Uniting both ends of the spectrum. Everyone dislikes her. At last! Something everyone can agree on Grin

Original poster
Bearbehind · 22/09/2017 20:30

Just looked at the Daily Mail comments- seems I was right about the speech annoying most people.

OP posts:
Doobigetta · 22/09/2017 20:36

We have to think of the remainers and ease into divorce.

Just for the record, it doesn't come within a million miles of making it ok. It never will.

FaithHopeCharityDesperation · 22/09/2017 20:40

Leavers must be annoyed that she admitted there's no way in hell we can manage without a 2 year transition period on account if the fact we've not got anything in place to deal with the implications of leaving.

I’m a leaver!

2 yr transition period always seemed an obvious thing to me tbh, similarly honouring the current financial cycle that we had already signed up to.

She reiterated out of single market & custom union as end point (post transition) so I’m happy with that.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 22/09/2017 20:44

Why do you think the EU will agree to a 2 year transition period?

TM was still bandying about the 'no deal is better than a bad deal' rhetoric.

Why wouldn't they just call her bluff?

OP posts:
FaithHopeCharityDesperation · 22/09/2017 20:47

Well if they won’t, they won’t - then we’ll just leave.
The remaining 27 don’t want that any more than U.K. does.

The ball is firmly in EU’s court now.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 22/09/2017 20:50

The ball is firmly in EU’s court now

Why do you think that?

What can they do to change the deadlock other than let us have our cake and eat it?

OP posts:
Userwhocouldntthinkofagoodname · 22/09/2017 20:52

Why do you think the EU will agree to a 2 year transition period?
Their choice, if they don't we can WTO it, not bothered.

taking tariffs as an example scary how do you think it can possibly work for a non-EU country to have tariff free access to the EU?
Ummm its called a free trade deal, why would there be tariffs?

Original poster
Bearbehind · 22/09/2017 20:54

Ummm its called a free trade deal, why would there be tariffs?

I give up Hmm

OP posts:
Userwhocouldntthinkofagoodname · 22/09/2017 20:54

What can they do to change the deadlock other than let us have our cake and eat it?

Can anyone actually explain what that means? How can you eat your cat if you dont have it?

If the EU dont want to negotiate and just keep the deadlock then we can walk away. Its their choice.

Userwhocouldntthinkofagoodname · 22/09/2017 20:55

cake not cat lol

scaryteacher · 22/09/2017 21:01

Bear Turkey and Canada have tariff free access in goods, why shouldn't we? This can also be extended to services. It's not like we don't already comply with EU rules and standards, as we do with US rules and standards for trading with them.

If the EU apply tariffs to us, then we apply them to EU goods and services. Who will gain most from that; who imports more? It's their choice to apply tariffs, they don't have to do so.

FaithHopeCharityDesperation · 22/09/2017 21:07

What can they do to change the deadlock other than let us have our cake and eat it?

Well...

They can agree to a 2 yr implementation period which is mutually beneficial for a start - this then allows for a smooth transition between the ‘start’ of Brexit (March 2019) & a final cut off date.

This will allow time to negotiate a deal that is mutually beneficial & not a narrow minded, unimaginative, off the shelf, cut & shut job.

As I said, TM has said we’ll guarantee EU citizens’ rights & continue to pay the monies we signed up to whilst not ‘having a seat at the table’ - she’s shown her hand now the ball is in their court.

They could of course say ‘no deal’ - that’s their prerogative; but I can’t see the 27 countries backing that stance in all honesty.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 22/09/2017 21:23

Turkey and Canada have tariff free access in goods, why shouldn't we? This can also be extended to services

Turkeys deal doesn't cover food, agriculture or services.

How much have we got left to bargain with if we exclude those from the UK deal?

OP posts:
Crowdo · 22/09/2017 21:31

Have your cake and eat it means eating your cake, but still expecting to have cake left over once you've eaten it.

I can't believe there are still people who are optimistic about Brexit. Apart from wait years to see what might happen! How close do we get to the epicentre before they see the destruction?