In challenging my dh when he flips out like a mentalist at the slightest thing the kids do .

[Spidermama]

My ds, on his way to bed, saw dh with a plate of supper he'd just made for himself (oatcakes and cheese) and ds jumped up to try to pinch a bit. I thought it was a jokey, blokey thing but dh leapt as if ds had nutted him, the supper went flying, and dh went into one, 'HOW DARE YOU. LOOK WHAT YOU'VE DONE. PICK IT ALL UP THIS SECOND'. Etc.

In a state of alarm I find myself leaping in to minimise damage and trauma from this sudden explosion which is all coming from dh. I tell him to calm down. Say ds didn't mean to knock stuff off the plate.

DH goes even more mental, like a 5 year old, stamps upstairs .. thinks better of it and comes back down again shouting, 'This isn't fair!'

Meanhile ds silently slinks up to bed withdrawn and pale. I say, 'I'm going to check that ds is alright.'

'You're going to check that DS is alright?!?' he rages.

Now he's upstairs watching telly. It's the only evening we've had together for a while and he's off again tomorrow. What shall I do?

possibly spidey. guilty of having passed it on you mean?

Interesting post olliebird. Have we perhaps married men like our dads?

You could try showing your dh this.

Kind of self hatred MrsA. Or maybe he has pain and upset about his eyesight which he has never resolved. I'm no psychologist but ... etc

Spidermama, fear can definitely manifest as anger. What do you think he sees of himself in his son that frightens him?

dionnelorraine I'm so sorry. That must have been very frightening. You must have felt utterly powerless.

I think my dh has got better actually. Before the kids came along he was more volatile and violent, so there is hope.

I won't put up with it and I'm not scared of him. He's not a total monster - honest. He's fantastic, really great, about 95% of the time.

It's difficult to pinpoint aloha. He looks just like dh did as a kid apparently.

DH is also angry with his brothers still as they were violent and volatile and used to smash up his stuff when they were kids. DH was the peacemaker believe it or not. But it's clear he brings a lot of that shit with him.

Of course we all do, but it's easier to see other peoples' baggage.

actually spidey i am pretty sure he wanted me to feel humilated and vulnerable because i was working on angry, defiant and belligerant at the time.

He knew how powerful removing my sight was so he did it.

I have not married a man like my dad i have married a wonderful gentle caring one.

(i did the reworking my dad thing prior though)

I'd guess something in your ds triggers his emotions and makes him re-experience all those childhood feelings totally unmediated. Sounds like he hard a hard time and felt undefended by his mother, hence his upset at not being 'defended' by you. I would also guess that he knows he is wrong, and when the feeling subside (which won't be yet) he'll feel bad about himself. But shame never makes you feel better about yourself. Maybe he needs to feel better as a father, more loved, more compassionate so he has more to live up to.
If he is great 95% of the time, and you are there to be protective and on their side, I think your children will be fine. You say your dh apologises. I think that's important.

You say his brothers used to break his stuff. I suppose when your ds knocked his supper flying (when he was hungry, tired, frustrated and fed up) he felt like he did when he was a kid and his brothers broke his stuff.

Aw thanks aloha. I think that's spot on.

also, when my ds and dh were really not getting on - dh always being nasty to him - ds was sometimes saying 'I want to be a girl' 'I like girls things' 'I want to be just like you mummy' 'pinks my favourite colour'. Then when dh started really making big effort this completely stopped and he started wanting to like boys colours, ie wanting to be a boy. interesting

Floating I know what you mean. I have said to my dh many times, 'Why are you doing this? I'm NOT your mother'.

I think your dh might benefit from hypnotherapy. So might mine. I don't know if you have any experince of it but they take you into a deep meditative state and get you to recall certain things.

I have a feeling this will sound a bit mad but I've done some guided meditation where I went back and met the ten year old me. We had a very interesting conversation and it has stayed with me and really helped.

Not that I can ever imagine my dh agreeing to go to a hypno or any other kind of therapist mine you.

Nut SM, your children won't think your dp is a prat, or childish, or anything like that.

They will think he does it because they are bad, and deserve it, and until he doesn't do it any more, nothing that is said will stop them thinking like this.

don't let it become the elephant in the living room.

Need to ask, how was your ds when you left him tonight? Hope you told your bully of a dh to fuck off while you went to care for your ds and make sure he wasn't too traumatised by dh's appalling behaviour. Have to say, if my dh carried my ds upside-down in anger he would be my dh in hell.
Really sympathise with your situation but your priority is your dc, not him. He needs to sort himself out, or as earlier posts have said, your sons will grow up suffering because of it.
Sorry to sound hard but "men" like him make me sick.

This topic brings up such strong emotions because lots of us have been at the receiving end of unthinking adult rage and cannot bear the thought of it happening to our children.

Awareness of why people act as they do is an important first step. Even though I, like Colditz, always wished my mum would leave my dad, she didn't; they've been married since 1960! I sure as hell made sure I married a COMPLETELY diiferent man to my father, but my first couple of boyfriends were carbon copies of him!

Spidermama - I certainly don't think your situation is insoluble, but I do think it's up to you to a) love and protect your children b) makd your dh face up to his destructive demons.

Reading this thread with interest, as my dh also has anger management 'ishooos'. Makes me really .

Good luck, Spidermama.

My mum lost the plot last week because ds (who is just 4) turned off the TV she was watching, because he's not allowed to watch the TV and had just entered the room. As she couldn't possibly get upset at her one and only Grandson she decided that dh must have done it (though he wasn't anywhere near the TV at the time).

She said all kind of weird and ridiculous shit instead of just turning the TV back on like a normal person, and pointing out the programme only had a minute to go.

I wasn't in the room, but when I assumed ds or dh had done something really terribly awful and went into ask her who needed to apologise she decided I had warped my son by banning the TV.

Seriously the woman was insane, just because she missed a minute of a really shit Australian game show.

Just picked up on this thread, and really do identify with it. My dad, and my brother are exactly like Spidermama's dh and it's a horrible way for a child to grow up - easy to see where my brother's anger issues stem from. It's left me with a deep hatred of any violence, mental cruelty etc, however slight.
Spidermama's dh's behaviour, imo, is common in many men to varying degrees, ime. I think a lot of it is to do with them seeing the child as a threat to their authority and taking the mother's attention away from them (ie the child diverting attention from the dh). Yes, juvenile and inexcusable and it needs sorting out - it does sound like professional help would be the thing if Spidermama can persuade him. I think it's interesting that Spidermama says they hardly have any time together - that's going to fuel her dh's feeling of his position being threatened by ds - and while you shouldn't reward dh's bad behaviour, it would probably help to have more child-free time together for all sorts of reasons. hth - stay strong and comfort ds all you can, but do stand up to dh and don't allow his mental abuse to continue - I wish my mum had.

my dh is not good at anger either, he thinks we should make a united stand!

I was about to suggest on preying on his own fear when Aloha started explaining about the unresolved fears your DH may have from his childhood.

Anyways, not in preying in a bad sense but to help him understand how your child may be feeling. Once things have calmed down, get him to talk about himself, about his fears about how incomfortable he may have felt as a child. Then kindly tell him that you see some patterns repeating here and perhaps you both (yes both, to give a team aproach to the problem) can work around these things to stop those problems hurting DH and family. Would that help?

And, I think you have been great in explaining the situation to your son not placing the whole blame on any of the parties. Although I don't want to enter into my own personal details here, I can say that it's good for him to know that he can trust and you will be there to protect him.

Have you noticed how often men act unreasonably when there is food involved? What's that all about?

Don't just "attack" DH for bad behaviour- remember to "reward" good behaviour.

My dad was horrible. We all (4 of us) ended up running away from home and never spoke to the parents again. Is that what DH wants?