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Original poster

To be frustrated by the misunderstanding of the honorific 'Ms' ?

662 replies

ChinkChink · 28/08/2017 11:06

Inspired by another thread.

I've come across many people who believe that 'Ms' is the honorific for a divorced woman, rather than the female equivalent of 'Mr'. People including several employers, managers, supervisors etc, plus friends and family who I'd normally regard as clued up. And many of them women. Confused

I do welcome the introduction of the term 'Mx' as a title to be used when gender is irrelevant [almost always!] but I fear that Mx will go the same way - people will interpret it as a title for someone who is [for example] transgender.

What say you, MN massive?

OP posts:
Noodledoodledoo · 30/08/2017 15:42

I personally can't stand Ms. I hated it when I was a Miss and still hate it now I am a Mrs. Don't get the angst about Miss/Mrs at all.

I also don't know any of my friends (late 30s) who have adopted Ms. They all use either Miss or Mrs. Wonder if that is a reflection of certain demographics we fall into.

Also any of you who are adament you are a Ms - don't become a teacher - to students you are all Miss or Sir - regardless!!

Sweetsnbooksnradio4 · 30/08/2017 15:42

Thank goodness for Mumsnet!

kastiekastie · 30/08/2017 15:45

Wow, I did not know it meant divorced to some people - something new every day eh?
Have chosen to be a Ms since old enough to have an opinion - my marital status is irrelevant when buying a car, shopping, doing anything except for perhaps getting married!
I hang my head in shame at the women glibly trotting out phrases such as not married 'after a certain age' or 'militant feminists' oh please, still, really?!

BertrandRussell · 30/08/2017 15:47

"And when people say that they pronounce it mzzz, what is that exactly? In English, you need a vowel sound."

What- like in Mrs?

SenecaFalls · 30/08/2017 15:55

There are two vowel sounds in the way most people pronounce Mrs. So I was wondering what sound a person makes with Mzz.

grandOlejukeofYork · 30/08/2017 15:55

Also any of you who are adament you are a Ms - don't become a teacher - to students you are all Miss or Sir - regardless!!

Like I said, all teachers I know are Ms.

HairNinja · 30/08/2017 15:55

o you should call yourself Ms so no one knows you couldn't find a husband" the more loudly and proudly I am going to call myself "Miss"

Copper this is bizarre. People have repeatedly told you this is not what Ms is for. The whole point of using Ms is to stop the patriarchal system of defining a woman by the man she has or hasn't snagged. From everything you say, it sounds ideal for you!

Fwiw, I'm happily married, have been for years. I'm still Ms, always have been always will be.

derxa · 30/08/2017 15:57

What- like in Mrs? Which has 2 vowel sounds.

BertrandRussell · 30/08/2017 15:59

Well, if Mrs has two vowel sounds, Ms has one. Miz.

Why do people insist this is so difficult ????

BananasAreGood · 30/08/2017 16:00

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

derxa · 30/08/2017 16:00

So I was wondering what sound a person makes with Mzz.
I think people are getting mixed up between spelling and pronunciation.
If Ms had no vowel sound it would be 'mmmm' followed by 'zzzzzzz' and that still doesn't mean it's pronounced 'muz'
Glad to be of service. Grin

derxa · 30/08/2017 16:02

Why do people insist this is so difficult ???? God knows. It's a mystery as Toyah likes to sing.

Copperbeech33 · 30/08/2017 16:03

People have repeatedly told you this is not what Ms is for. no, couple of posters on the internet have said it isn't, and several orders of magnitude more people in RL have told me it is.

grandOlejukeofYork · 30/08/2017 16:04

Then you know an awful lot of stupid and rude people. Get better friends. And a dictionary!

BertrandRussell · 30/08/2017 16:05

So, let me get this straight. Lots of people in real life have said to you that Ms is used by women who are trying to hide the fact that they are single?

Copperbeech33 · 30/08/2017 16:06

but you don't want to because you have a wrong and frankly bizarre notion of what it means

I know exactly what it means in real life, a few randoms on the internet disagree, that is their opinion. It isn't mine

grandOlejukeofYork · 30/08/2017 16:06

You don't though. It's not a matter of opinion, and yours is wrong.

Copperbeech33 · 30/08/2017 16:07

So, let me get this straight. Lots of people in real life have said to you that Ms is used by women who are trying to hide the fact that they are single?

single or divorced, or remarried, yes.

Copperbeech33 · 30/08/2017 16:10

Like I said, all teachers I know are Ms

nearly 30 years of teaching, never ever heard that even once.

teachers are called by their titles only when using their sirename, which is less than 1% of the occasions anyone addresses them.

The rest of the time it is sir or miss, or in one school I knew, Ma'am.

On name tags schools quite often but "Ms", and staff quite often object, and refuse them, and insist they are changed to Mrs or Miss.

I have never agreed to wear a tag labelled Ms, and I never will.

ikeadyounot · 30/08/2017 16:10

Read this copper. I believe someone has already linked to it, but you clearly just sailed straight over that. AFAIK there really isn't that much of a historical dispute about the origin of the word 'Ms' - and it's not about trusting 'some random on the internet' over people 'in real life' - it's a matter of looking at the historical evidence.

www.geog.cam.ac.uk/research/projects/occupations/abstracts/paper25.pdf

BertrandRussell · 30/08/2017 16:11

Like Hilary Clinton?

theymademejoin · 30/08/2017 16:16

@Copperbeech33 - I'm really struggling to believe that you know so many people who are a). so old-fashioned as not to understand what Ms means and b). rude enough to comment on your relationship status.

I have never, in all my 50 odd years, heard anyone say Ms is used to hide their shame at not being married or suggested anyone else should do so. I have encountered a couple of people (all men) who claim it's too difficult to pronounce. I just consider them to be idiots who should work at expanding their vocabulary.

I have encountered a few people who, when they see my wedding ring or I mention a husband (only if it's relevant - I'm not boasting about my amazing achievement of snagging a man) presume I'm a Mrs. Again, mainly men. However, when corrected none of these have had a problem with using Ms. That said, I generally just go by first name anyway.

grandOlejukeofYork · 30/08/2017 16:17

nearly 30 years of teaching, never ever heard that even once

And in what way does that change the fact that all the teachers that I KNOW are called Ms?

teachers are called by their titles only when using their sirename, which is less than 1% of the occasions anyone addresses them

No idea what kind of teachers you're hanging around with, but I can assure you they are called Ms Whatever pretty much all the time.

BananasAreGood · 30/08/2017 16:19

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Noodledoodledoo · 30/08/2017 16:19

grandOlejukeofYork I can't think of any of my colleagues in my past 3 schools who were known officially as Ms.

So it is very obviously something that is very area based.