To think that if you haven't booked a seat on a busy train

[MrsSchadenfreude]

You don't stand huffing loudly about young people having no manners and children should be sitting on their parents' laps, and leaning heavily on people who have reserved seats? Train to Cornwall, Bank Holiday weekend, was never going to be empty.

That's very optimistic thinking that a lot of people will be getting off at Taunton

I always reserve seats and often have to ask people to move (we visit family every few weeks in central london). The ones I find rudest are generally older people who look at me like I've shat on their table because I dare to ask them to move.

Being older (and I don't mean 90 or frail; of course I wouldn't ask a truly elderly person to move) doesn't mean you get to do whatever you like. Want a seat? Book one.

That's normally where I book my train tickets too Lonicera.

I always reserve my seats. Then there is no issue unless you end up missing a connection thanks east coast because then your seats are on the train that you missed.

I've seen the entitled sitting in other people's reserved seats thing from every age group, I don't think its the preserve of the older person. And don't get me started on the people who think their bag needs a seat.

TBH re OP I think the train guard should seat people in first - if its empty - in this situation. Given the prices that are charged/profit margin achieved by train companies - and the empirical evidence of every single bank holiday ever - I also don't think its unreasonable to expect the train company to put on extra carriages and to have to manage it properly.

Try being disabled and finding some idiot in your seat that won't move saying they need it! Or getting shoved about because you're trying to store your luggage plus disability aid (wheeled walker thing) all because people have no bloody patience abd they huff and puff at you. Even worse trying to get on/off train and instead of helping you they complain or shove you out way

Yes, it is always the older people who are difficult. The younger ones sit cheerfully on the floor, and the families either split up (I have someone's charming 8 year old next to me, her father is at the other end of the carriage with her little sister on his lap), take turns or just get on with it.

Mop - first class is full. They announced that at Paddington and said there was no opportunity to upgrade. I think some of the chancers were hoping to head to first class on the off chance that there were seats.

oh god, I had this coming back from Wales the other day. Jam packed carriages and chancers trying their luck sitting on reserved seats then kicking up an almighty fuss when they were claimed. Its like they think if they complain hard enough they'll get their own way. No chance! I'm not bloody standing for five hours on a train that I booked in advance!

I saw an awesome train seat battle last weekend

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/3011102-Train-seat-issues

60s isn't even 'older people' anymore... I don't know what's wrong with people you describe in your OP but it gives me an irrepressible urge to be as difficult as possible around people like that. I'd be up and down to the bar carriage incessantly just to irritate them.

What amuses me are the Jeremy-Corbyn clones. They get on crowded train but can't sit together with others in their group, so they huff & puff about how other passengers aren't distributed into seats into a pattern that suits them. "Why are those 2 separate people taking a 4 seat table!" they complain loudly. For the journey, they stand & tut in the corridors even though there are seats, but there aren't 2-3-4 seats together, so not acceptable.

If their group includes little kids, btw, or disabled/frail people, I'm one of the first to move to help them sit together. But able-bodied teens & Adults FFS, just get on with it and find a seat where you can. (Grrrr)

Yes, it is always the older people who are difficult. The younger ones sit cheerfully on the floor,

Because they can sit on the floor, and they're confident they'll be able to get up again!

OP, I don't think YWBU at all, but your issue with the people you encountered was down to PA and their being poor at handling situations where they don't get their own way, not their age!

My elderly DF is disabled (and would obviously always book a seat on a train!) but he wouldn't ever dream of behaving like that, and he'll always put himself out for other less mobile people - I would imagine those people were arseholes when they were younger too!

I think some of the chancers were hoping to head to first class on the off chance that there were seats

I must admit the "pay £5 and upgrade to First" options you sometimes get at weekends do irritate me a little if I have paid for First, although I suppose I wouldn't risk there not being First available.

Although I'm often on the Aberdeen to Edinburgh Scotrail service on a Sunday and often get the whole (Scotrail mini- version) First Class carriage to myself. It is lovely.

lljkk - you know that "Corbyn walked past empty seats" thing turned out to be a lie from Branson/Virgin, right? They released a misleading clip of CCTV and it took them 6 months to release the full video due to "technical issues"

Completely agree with OP - but one thing about some of the posts still puzzles me: unless you buy at the station seats are usually booked automatically. In fact I wouldn't know how not to book a seat.

" "pay £5 and upgrade to First" options you sometimes get at weekends"

Since when has it only been an extra fiver? I used to travel regularly between Leeds and London in the 1980s and it was an extra fiver then. On the London Sheffield route it costs far more to upgrade.

Yanbu and they sound like dicks but I do think it striking that amongst the many many vagaries that constitute buying a train ticket in the UK, the people who pay the most for their tickets ie the walk on fare passengers are also the ones least likely to get a seat.

Problems arise when people have reserved seats, but then their trains are completely cancelled due to running late. This happened to me on both the outward and return legs of a journey to London. Of course nobody who has reserved a seat should have to give it up, but lack of a seat reservation is not always down to passenger inaction.

Not all advanced tickets allow you too book a seat. We found that out on a very busy train to Glasgow where we had only reserved seats one way!!

Went to carriage where no seats were reserved according to Virgin staff even though they actually were this time!!
But ultimately we would never ask anyone to give up a reserved seat.
We just managed as best we could until train got quieter.
Much easier for a couple than a family with 2 young children.
Most people were very helpful though and moved as much as they could to give us 2 seats together.

unless kids are under 5 they have paid for seat and are just as entitled too it as an adult and it's a long journey.

That's true, Inertia, and is really annoying. I think they should seat people in first in that event - it's crazy to have people standing due to the actions of the train company when there are seats free in another carriage.

Since when has it only been an extra fiver? I used to travel regularly between Leeds and London in the 1980s and it was an extra fiver then. On the London Sheffield route it costs far more to upgrade

I literally have no idea what it costs as it is irrelevant to me. I picked a random figure considerably lower than what I will have paid for First.

Last time i did that journey I found avety swet, very elderly lady (with no reservation) sat in my (reserved) seat. Train was packed to the gills due to the cancellation of its predecessor. Hadn't the heart to ask her to move. Stood for 4 hours, outwardly chatting politely, inwardly sulking. This was years ago, I'm still not over it .

I'm still fuming, several years later about being weak enough to be guilt-tripped out of my seat by a sixty-something woman who was being loudly PA about my autistic six year old daring to sit in his own reserved and paid for seat while she had to stand.

Longines - they weren't old though, they were fit, able bodied people in their 60s. A much older lady got on with a stick and a suitcase, and people were really helpful to her, with one woman offering to swap seats so she didn't have to walk so far, and a man helping her with her case.

I always book in advance as travel between London and Newcastle fairly regularly and you always get a seat reservation. Mostly people move when you show up.
One time DD and I had reservations in a coach with half reserved seats and someone was in our seats. I said the seats were ours and she started saying but there's loads of free seats! Myself and another passenger pointed out she could sit in one of them. She did move but complained I was out of order as that seat was in a good position in the carriage and she was there first...